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10-06-2012, 06:39 PM | #1 |
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Procom Race Systems 20gxt on 2006 wrx
Dyno: Tune Time Performance's Mustang AWD 500
Tuner: Lou Lieberman from Procom Race Systems Wheel HP: 307 in 4th gear, 294 in 3rd Wheel TQ: 302 in 4th gear, 281 in 3rd Ambient Temp: ~70-75 F Elevation: < 200ft Baseline for stock STI: 205 whp Car Info 2006 WRX Limited Engine Management: EcuFlash Turbo: Blouch 20gxt Intercooler: oem sti Boost: ~16psi Fuel: 93 octane Fuel pump: Walbro 255 Injectors: 750cc Deatschworks Intake/Inlet: oem Headers/uppipe: oem Downpipe: Perrin 3in CBE: oem sti Other Power Mods: Hallman Manual Boost Controller, other than that its all factory wrx from the throttle body up to the turbo. I am extremely happy with the results considering I get to keep my factory intake and exhaust so the car is extremely quiet and to quote Lou, "unassuming". This is exaclty how I need it regardless of the end results. What does not show on the dyno is the the daily driving aspects of the car are much more manageable with the 20g and the tune than with the stock turbo and cobb stage 2 ots tune, so again this yet another advantage for the sake of my wife. The dyno results deserve some explanation. During the first run that yielded 307whp (4th gear), the car pulled some timing around 5500rpm so Lou let off the throttle. Determining that the car was doing 100+mph type work with less than 30mph of air through the intercooler, it was decided to run again in 3rd gear, providing the 294whp number but showing a clean power curve. Lou then recommended an intercooler upgrade, again. 4th gear: 3rd:
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Last edited by thisisntjared; 10-29-2012 at 10:36 PM. |
10-06-2012, 08:43 PM | #2 |
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are u gonna turn the boost up?
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10-06-2012, 09:38 PM | #3 |
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10-08-2012, 09:37 PM | #4 |
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there are many threads that show the stock STi intercooler is better than many aftermarket ones. limiting boost to 16 with a 20G seems very conservative but you still gained 100whp over a stock STi on that dyno which must be a kick in the butt dyno. it seems laggy though. do whatever you need to do but crank that boost up. you paid for a 20G so use it.
It was most interesting to see the comparison between the 3 and 4th gear pulls. good luck. |
10-09-2012, 01:30 AM | #5 |
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Didn't we just do the aftermarket vs sti intercooler debate?
High filter value on the dyno. The pull starts at both a high rpm and has a dip onto boost... |
10-09-2012, 01:00 PM | #6 | |
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to be honest i am not sure where i am on intercooler upgrades... something must be done eventually though... i expected a delay in the boost because i am still using an oem sti 2.5in cat back along with the factory airbox and turbo inletat the time, it was only $60-$70 more than the 18gxt so i figure i would just get the 20g for the long term...
Quote:
link? any empirical evidence? i am have seen a few threads but am VERY curious if i missed any compelling arguments in the aftermarket vs sti intercooler debate. in regards to the filter value, i gave no mind to it as this was the first time i ever had a car on a dyno for power. it is true that there is a dip onto boost, full boost hit at 3700 rpm. Lou said its expected for it to run rich for a bit as the boost first comes on. Last edited by thisisntjared; 10-09-2012 at 01:50 PM. |
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10-10-2012, 09:22 AM | #7 |
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uploaded scanned dynographs
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10-10-2012, 09:25 AM | #8 |
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Honestly, I think this is great. Could you have gone 18gxt, more mods, and then in turn increase the power and how soon it comes on? Yes. BUT, with this setup you have piece of mind (reliability), got what you wanted (decent power and still very quiet), and still have a fun car. Props to you!
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10-10-2012, 09:28 AM | #9 |
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Figured I'd chime in and clear up somethings. 16psi is very low for a 20G and the answer for this is simple...we made 100whp over a stock STi. Keeping the stock airbox and catback exhaust! The car is daily driven, fast, smooth power delivery, and will give him no problems (i.e. trans breakages). I think thats the goal here.
As for the dip in power at peak boost, it's an anomaly in some ECU's. Some cars will dip rich at peak boost. It's just something that happens with not all, but some cars. You can combat the issue by ramping up timing in that area, but to be honest, the car is unbelievably smooth on the street so we left it as such, and left some room for error in the map. (i.e. bad gas, etc) I'm not one to tune until you cant tune anymore. Tuning has been made to seem like this form of "black magic", it's not. It does take a lot of knowledge, but I usually just let the car make the power. I'm not the type to force it out. This leads to a better performing car that will LAST! I can make 450whp on this turbo, I'm sure, but when he calls me and says the car is broken, I haven't done anyone any favors! The filter rate is simply to give everyone those pretty curves. Any chassis dyno is going to show some "noise" and it shows up as those small humps in the curve. It's simply cleaned up for a more mainstream look. At the end of the day the peak power and curve is the same. No harm, no foul. As for the intercooler debate, I'm not going to hijack the thread on this subject. IMO it's not only intercooler efficiency we need to look at in this case, but it's surrounding air temps. On a dyno with a fan on the intercooler we can make the air temp whatever we like, but driving around a city at 25mph (i.e. this guy) and then going WOT down a side street will spell disaster for any TMIC. What really needs to be looked at is added heat sheilding in an effort to keep exhaust heat away from the intercooler. We will be developing a TIMC intercooler set-up over the next few months that will showcase this theory. In closing, thanks Jared for the kind words! I hope to see you in the shop again very soon. This car will more then likely be the tester for out TMIC set-up. Enjoy the car and beat the piss out of it, because you can! |
10-10-2012, 03:45 PM | #10 |
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^ very well said. Sometimes I think some people forget others may like a safer tune so their engine/ tranny will last.
Also agree with you about the intercooler. I have talked to one shop that said a TMIC may not start cooling effectively until you get up to about 40mph Last edited by batteryman; 10-10-2012 at 04:07 PM. |
10-10-2012, 07:42 PM | #11 |
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Very interesting I am going from my HTA68 to a Kamak 20 GTX STS with all supporting mods and a 6 spd swap on my 11. I was making over 350 WHP with the HTA and Meth, so it will be intresting to see what happens with my new motor and the new 20G. That said I also swaped out my UEL for an EL of the same make. So spool will be intresting and I am FMIC.
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10-11-2012, 02:17 PM | #12 |
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Any time Lou!
I did forget to mention my need for the reliability of this setup. When I first contacted Lou, I mentioned that my goals for reliability and daily-drive-with-wife-and-child-ability(must be quiet) would exceed the priority of the goal for 300whp. With the constraints provided, I was surprised to see the first run hit 307whp even after letting off early. I should also mention that Lou advocated keeping the setup as simple as possible. I did not make cost a priority as I was prepared to continue saving if the budget needed to be expanded. In addressing reliability, Lou also kept this setup more affordable by minimizing extras. i would love to see more info on this. this would mean that a tmic would not start cooling effectively on a good portion of auto-x courses. it would also mean i should strongly consider a front mount and scoopless hood from an impreza. Last edited by thisisntjared; 10-11-2012 at 02:33 PM. |
10-11-2012, 02:24 PM | #13 | |
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Quote:
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10-11-2012, 02:34 PM | #14 |
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your setup had me considering the hta68 for quite a while, then i decided that the psi it takes for it to shine was really on the upper end of where i wanted to go. i am curious to see 2011boostdwrx's results too, but a little bit more to validate the decision i made even though they are different 20gs
Last edited by thisisntjared; 10-11-2012 at 02:54 PM. |
10-11-2012, 11:46 PM | #15 |
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The Turbo will be in on Monday, the SB should be in next week. Akuma should be building the SB next week. I akso added an ELH, Turbo Blanket, so I am hoping for some nice spool. The HTA was at 23 PSI w/Meth at over 35o WHP. We were going to push to 24-26 PSI, so like 10 WHP/ we were looking at like 370+, then the cylinder liner went on the dyno.
Lets see what happens with the 20GTX, looking for at least 400 whp I hope. But, once all put together I am looking at 1000 miles breakin, so I dont know if you will see anything for at least another month number wise. |
01-24-2013, 04:25 PM | #16 |
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I just bought a 20g xt and will have the same setup with low boost. I will have tons of headroooom
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01-24-2013, 07:43 PM | #17 |
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3000 miles later and i am already calculating what it would take to push more...
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01-24-2013, 08:20 PM | #18 |
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Still on stock tranny?
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01-24-2013, 08:34 PM | #19 |
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Stock tranny, stock clutch, stock long block, stock intake
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01-24-2013, 08:46 PM | #20 |
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That makes me feel better about my 5mt. You running stock size wheel and tires?
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01-25-2013, 09:14 AM | #21 |
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Stock wheels. 215/45/17 dunlop sport signature all seasons
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02-23-2013, 10:54 PM | #22 |
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How many miles on the car?
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07-30-2013, 08:45 AM | #23 |
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07-30-2013, 08:27 PM | #24 |
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This is just what I wanted to see. Have an 07 with same mileage. Also am located in central jersey. Was planning on hitting Lou up for a tune once things got more serious with my car! Have heard tons of good in regards to him and Procom.
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