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Old 03-19-2021, 11:38 AM   #476
dwf137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snow Drift View Post
Yes, it was on A/S which hurts the test results and I would always have winter tires. Currently our Tesla is RWD until slip or a condition, and on rollers w/ one front wheel it will also just sit there for a long time. I have enjoyed it in the snow this year, of course I haven't tried deep snow. I'm just used to WRX/STI who just go claw through anything bc they have power at all axles all the time.
4-motion does too, aside from situations where it's truly not needed like crusing on the highway. If you drive it, I think you'd have a change of heart. Appreciate the skepticism, but it's not a reactionary system like it used to be. Early haldex really gave the system a bad name. MK4 R32 had a completely reactionary system. It could not engage the rear until the front actually slipped. But the newer borg warner "haldex" units are preemptive. Rear wheels are engaged before slip ever happens in most situations. I get more front wheel spin out of our outback than I ever did in my Golf R, and given the power differences between the two cars, that should say something.

I snow plowed a few times in my R. Snow up over the hood. It clawed through just fine. Just don't high-center yourself on packed down snow banks from a snow plow, and it'll go through no issues.
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Old 03-19-2021, 12:23 PM   #477
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Originally Posted by dwf137 View Post
4-motion does too, aside from situations where it's truly not needed like crusing on the highway. If you drive it, I think you'd have a change of heart. Appreciate the skepticism, but it's not a reactionary system like it used to be. Early haldex really gave the system a bad name. MK4 R32 had a completely reactionary system. It could not engage the rear until the front actually slipped. But the newer borg warner "haldex" units are preemptive. Rear wheels are engaged before slip ever happens in most situations. I get more front wheel spin out of our outback than I ever did in my Golf R, and given the power differences between the two cars, that should say something.

I snow plowed a few times in my R. Snow up over the hood. It clawed through just fine. Just don't high-center yourself on packed down snow banks from a snow plow, and it'll go through no issues.

The mk7 was a big improvement. The mk8 will even be more. Subaru people keep talking about your R, or the new one as the same AWD system as the mk4 and it's just not true. VAG has made significant improvements to the point where the new mk8 is more advanced than anything Subaru makes, including the STi. I get the skepticism given this is a Subaru forum at heart. I had to drive the RS to be convinced myself.


Whomever above brought up the size is significant. The R is still relatively a compact car to me. The VA and the new WRX/STi is going to be big.
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Old 03-19-2021, 12:31 PM   #478
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Originally Posted by dwf137 View Post
4-motion does too, aside from situations where it's truly not needed like crusing on the highway. If you drive it, I think you'd have a change of heart. Appreciate the skepticism, but it's not a reactionary system like it used to be. Early haldex really gave the system a bad name. MK4 R32 had a completely reactionary system. It could not engage the rear until the front actually slipped. But the newer borg warner "haldex" units are preemptive. Rear wheels are engaged before slip ever happens in most situations. I get more front wheel spin out of our outback than I ever did in my Golf R, and given the power differences between the two cars, that should say something.

I snow plowed a few times in my R. Snow up over the hood. It clawed through just fine. Just don't high-center yourself on packed down snow banks from a snow plow, and it'll go through no issues.
I am glad to see for Mk8 R in Race/Special/Drift it will not decouple the RDU while cruising. "In the Race profile, the coasting function (freewheeling without drive power) is deactivated" (VWoA). So you can force the car to be AWD and not FWD.

I would find this useful when driving home in the snow on the highway (I'll drive into work instead of taking the commuter-train as they fail in the snow often). Special could be good for the bumps and snow.

https://media.vw.com/en-us/releases/1419

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The mk7 was a big improvement. The mk8 will even be more. Subaru people keep talking about your R, or the new one as the same AWD system as the mk4 and it's just not true. VAG has made significant improvements to the point where the new mk8 is more advanced than anything Subaru makes, including the STi. I get the skepticism given this is a Subaru forum at heart. I had to drive the RS to be convinced myself.


Whomever above brought up the size is significant. The R is still relatively a compact car to me. The VA and the new WRX/STi is going to be big.
Without derailing this WRX thread too much, I find that the lack of a center differential means the system can't be "more advanced" than WRX/STI. It is compromised from the start. The S4 had center differential (granted torsen isnt as good as planetary gear) and a sport diff for rear torque split.

Now, the reality based on you guys is that it's not a big enough shortfall to reduce driving enjoyment or snow fun. So, it may be moot.

Last edited by Snow Drift; 03-19-2021 at 12:42 PM.
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Old 03-19-2021, 12:51 PM   #479
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I am glad to see for Mk8 R in Race/Special/Drift it will not decouple the RDU while cruising. "In the Race profile, the coasting function (freewheeling without drive power) is deactivated" (VWoA). So you can force the car to be AWD and not FWD.

I would find this useful when driving home in the snow on the highway (I'll drive into work instead of taking the commuter-train as they fail in the snow often). Special could be good for the bumps and snow.
Agreed. Decoupling the rears in all situations was a bummer, but rarely did I ever notice it, even driving down steep snow/ice covered mountain passes. Maybe a bit more reliance on the actual brakes rather than engine braking? I do really like the new additions to the programming. And that new rear diff also sounds like a great addition. Great improvements to an already good drivetrain. Giving Subaru a run for their money for sure.
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Old 03-19-2021, 01:00 PM   #480
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My Tiguan behaved similarly to my SG Forester XT's in the similar snow conditions all on snow tires. Granted my Foresters were dumped and plowed the snow as I went and the Tiguan is full height. But this last snow event showed how great VW calibrated the system for safety and finding traction. It won't drift. At all. It will understeer all day long not allowing the car to rotate. So the fun factor isn't there, but that's not what I bought the Tiguan for. My Legacy GT wagon was for that purpose. And that car would only ever step out.

The Foresters were a happy medium with understeer but would be coaxed good enough and power oversteer. I miss those.
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Old 03-19-2021, 01:47 PM   #481
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Can we possibly merge these three threads?
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Old 03-19-2021, 02:37 PM   #482
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Can we possibly merge these three threads?
plus 1
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Old 03-19-2021, 02:55 PM   #483
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Originally Posted by Snow Drift View Post
I am glad to see for Mk8 R in Race/Special/Drift it will not decouple the RDU while cruising. "In the Race profile, the coasting function (freewheeling without drive power) is deactivated" (VWoA). So you can force the car to be AWD and not FWD.

I would find this useful when driving home in the snow on the highway (I'll drive into work instead of taking the commuter-train as they fail in the snow often). Special could be good for the bumps and snow.

https://media.vw.com/en-us/releases/1419
.
This is very good solid information that there's a mode that keeps the AWD "on" and not just variable and active under certain conditions. But having this mode also seems to indicate the RDU can handle extensive AWD use.

I like Subaru's MT setup where it's 50:50 all the time where I am not guessing how much or when power is going to the rear. While I haven't had problems with today's FWD+ active systems (my Santa Fe, for example), in certain snowy, slushy, rainy conditions, curvy roads where having AWD completely "on" and not just pre-emptive is nice. But on the flip side, there are times when AWD is realistically not needed and free-wheeling is just fine and more efficient where AWD just being "ready" is perfectly acceptable.
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Old 03-19-2021, 03:01 PM   #484
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This is very good solid information that there's a mode that keeps the AWD "on" and not just variable and active under certain conditions. I like Subaru's MT setup where it's 50:50 all the time where I am not guessing how much or when power is going to the rear. While I haven't had problems with today's active systems, in certain snowy, slushy, rainy conditions, curvy roads where having AWD completely "on" and not just pre-emptive is nice. But on the flip side, there are times when AWD is not needed and free-wheeling is just fine and more efficient where AWD just being "ready" is perfectly acceptable.
Agreed it is nice to have those options. I'll happily sacrifice MPG for grip.

The Levorg STI Sport has driver modes also. Maybe the 2022 STI will allow us to adjust the suspension as well as DCCD.

Comfort
Normal
Sport
Sport+
Individual

https://www.subaru.jp/levorg/levorg/stisport/index
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Old 03-20-2021, 07:38 AM   #485
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I imagine you scooby die hards already saw these Renders from Russia. I'm going throw it up anyway.
Quote:
New Subaru WRX looks the goods, sort of…
Spy shots inform latest renders of Subaru’s hotly-anticipated new Rex, but do we like what we see?

After our spy photographers caught the hotly-anticipated 2021 Subaru WRX testing in the US earlier this week, it hasn’t taken long for European designers to strip back the camouflaged development car to create these renders that give us a great look at the all-new Rex – whether we like it or not.

Building off the spy photos that surfaced out of Michigan, the Russian com-gen wizards from Kolesa look to have faithfully replicated the front-end design that, if the production version of the new-generation Subaru WRX comes out like this, could stir up a hornet’s nest.

Not for the first time in the history of the Subaru Impreza, the latest look as imagined by the designers here is polarising, to say the least, and not nearly as menacing as the current WRX.

Notwithstanding the bonnet scoop, muscular fenders, side skirts and quad exhaust tips – much of which references the design already seen with the incoming new 2021 Subaru Levorg – there’s a distinct lack of aggression across the body presented here and what looks to be a slightly higher-riding stance that takes away from its sporty character.

Of course, we’ll have to wait until mid-year to see the final production version of the new 2021 Subaru WRX officially emerge from the Japanese car-maker, ahead of its Australian launch in the final quarter of 2021.

The rear-end design is another matter altogether, as the images shown here have turned the WRX sedan into a liftback with tail-end treatment that is just plain ugly.


There’s a lot going on, but none of it seems to flow together, with an awkward boot lip spoiler and tail-lights that look like they were plucked out of another manufacturer’s parts bin.

Full details on the Japanese brand’s next sports car are yet to be revealed, however as we’ve previously reported, Subaru Australia’s senior management team has promised the new WRX will get improvements in “everything from powerplants, transmissions, all the things that the Rex fans really crave”.


Reports suggest the 2021 WRX will offer around 213kW/412Nm from an all-new FA24 2.4-litre four-cylinder turbo-petrol boxer engine.

As for transmission options, the new WRX is expected to be offered in either manual or auto, the latter tipped to be a continuation of the current model’s CVT.

Stay tuned for more details on Subaru’s upcoming WRX, which is set to be followed by the launch of the even hotter WRX STI in 2022.


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Old 03-20-2021, 08:27 AM   #486
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Welcome to the party pal!
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Old 03-20-2021, 05:57 PM   #487
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Originally Posted by Snow Drift View Post

Without derailing this WRX thread too much, I find that the lack of a center differential means the system can't be "more advanced" than WRX/STI. It is compromised from the start. The S4 had center differential (granted torsen isnt as good as planetary gear) and a sport diff for rear torque split.

Now, the reality based on you guys is that it's not a big enough shortfall to reduce driving enjoyment or snow fun. So, it may be moot.
I don’t think you understand torque vectoring then. Just a smarter and faster system, period.
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Old 03-21-2021, 10:26 AM   #488
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I don’t think you understand torque vectoring then. Just a smarter and faster system, period.
I drove two generations of Acura MDX SH-AWD for years. They had rear torque vectoring differentials. It did nothing in the snow to prevent getting stuck. Fronts spun, rears did very little.
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Old 03-21-2021, 01:02 PM   #489
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Can we possibly merge these three threads?
Of all the posts, there are only a handful with useful information...the rest are just babies and idiots whining about a car they haven't seen or driven.
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Old 03-21-2021, 03:12 PM   #490
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I drove two generations of Acura MDX SH-AWD for years. They had rear torque vectoring differentials. It did nothing in the snow to prevent getting stuck. Fronts spun, rears did very little.
Not the same drivetrain as the Mk8 man, not the same as my RS either.
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Old 03-21-2021, 03:25 PM   #491
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Yeah but no power sent to the back Pre. And it only ever goes 50:50. But it doesn’t do it quick enough. But it will power oversteer drift sending power to the rear to maintain said drift. Square that.
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Old 03-21-2021, 05:27 PM   #492
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I drove two generations of Acura MDX SH-AWD for years. They had rear torque vectoring differentials. It did nothing in the snow to prevent getting stuck. Fronts spun, rears did very little.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pre View Post
Not the same drivetrain as the Mk8 man, not the same as my RS either.
My understanding is that the current SH-AWD in the MDX has 90/10 % to 50/50 % F/R power distribution due to a center clutch pack. The RDU is similar to the GKN setup with twin clutches for each axle allowing 100% torque to one wheel.

I think the issue with SH-AWD is that increased power to the rear is more controlled with vehicle sensors and caters to handling on a curve at speed. In a situation with snow at zero/ low speed, increased power to the rear is not happening, so it might be 30% at the rear for snow.

Last edited by subyski; 03-21-2021 at 05:35 PM.
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Old 03-21-2021, 06:41 PM   #493
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Not the same drivetrain as the Mk8 man, not the same as my RS either.
FWD platform, starting 90:10, max 50:50, and torque splitting rear. This is a very similar system, but not 100%. SH-AWD used both planetary gear and clutches plus it could over-drive, which R-PTV can't do. I'm just explaining experience with a torque vectoring front biased system.

Quote:
Originally Posted by subyski View Post
My understanding is that the current SH-AWD in the MDX has 90/10 % to 50/50 % F/R power distribution due to a center clutch pack. The RDU is similar to the GKN setup with twin clutches for each axle allowing 100% torque to one wheel.

I think the issue with SH-AWD is that increased power to the rear is more controlled with vehicle sensors and caters to handling on a curve at speed. In a situation with snow at zero/ low speed, increased power to the rear is not happening, so it might be 30% at the rear for snow.
Thank you. Agreed.

Last edited by Snow Drift; 03-22-2021 at 11:07 AM.
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Old 03-22-2021, 04:37 PM   #494
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Yeah but no power sent to the back Pre. And it only ever goes 50:50. But it doesn’t do it quick enough. But it will power oversteer drift sending power to the rear to maintain said drift. Square that.
If the true max is 50% to the rears only, then you got me there, that sucks, and is unlike the Twinster then. The Twinster could send 70% to the rears. And that was the preference amongst the RS owners who lived in the snow belt. They’d throw it in drift. They said that was the best mode for snow driving and it annihilated anything else they’d owned. But if the mk8 can’t do that and is FWD up until max 50% to the rear then I agree, that sucks, and will be a deal breaker for me.
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Old 03-22-2021, 05:11 PM   #495
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If the true max is 50% to the rears only, then you got me there, that sucks, and is unlike the Twinster then. The Twinster could send 70% to the rears. And that was the preference amongst the RS owners who lived in the snow belt. They'd throw it in drift. They said that was the best mode for snow driving and it annihilated anything else they'd owned. But if the mk8 can't do that and is FWD up until max 50% to the rear then I agree, that sucks, and will be a deal breaker for me.
I was being sarcastic. In no real world situation is it possible to have both be true. You either have massive safety understeer and grip or you have rear bias of power that allows for maximum slip angle. Maintaining a drift on dry pavement with a slow reacting setup or 50:50 split doesn't provide what we've seen the Golf R do in videos. Especially with no aid from non existent ebrake handle.




Even if the system is being brake controlled to allow for power on rotation, it's achieving the fun factor not available before from the 4MOTION Haldex.
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Old 03-22-2021, 09:55 PM   #496
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Originally Posted by Yeeman19 View Post
Of all the posts, there are only a handful with useful information...the rest are just babies and idiots whining about a car they haven't seen or driven.
Yeah, I rather sift through one thread of BS, looking for actual news, than three.
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Old 03-22-2021, 10:35 PM   #497
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Yeah, I rather sift through one thread of BS, looking for actual news, than three.
Hi you must be new here. Perhaps here could be of assistance.
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Old 03-23-2021, 09:00 AM   #498
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Moved my responses to the Golf R thread.

Last edited by Snow Drift; 03-23-2021 at 10:07 AM.
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Old 06-30-2021, 04:45 PM   #499
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Default AUS. 2022 WRX delayed a year. US Next ?

New Subaru WRX delayed

Quote:
Next-gen Rex’s Australian arrival pushed back to 2022 as waiting lists for other Subaru models swell

The new Subaru WRX won’t arrive in Australia this year as scheduled, thanks to COVID-19.

Officially teased for the first time this morning ahead of its imminent global reveal, the new-generation Rex was due on sale here in late 2021.
However, Subaru Australia has confirmed to carsales that the next WRX won’t arrive Down Under until early 2022 due to COVID-related production issues including the global semi-conductor shortage.

“New generation WRX [is] now anticipated early 2022 as opposed to late 2021,” said a Subaru Australia spokesman.

But the hotly anticipated 2022 Subaru WRX, which was previously caught testing in the US and will upgrade to a new FA24 2.4-litre four-cylinder turbo-petrol boxer engine producing 213kW and 412Nm, isn’t the only Subaru model affected by the coronavirus pandemic.

Waiting lists for the new Subaru Outback, as well as the Forester and XV, now extend to about three months and, with the WRX, STI, BRZ and Levorg now in run-out mode before their all-new replacements arrive, stocks of all four models are in short supply.

Subaru Australia says it expects to return to normal stock levels for continuing models from September or October, and it does not plan to delay the launch of any model other than the new WRX.

Nor does it plan to discontinue any further models following the axing of the Liberty last year, or to adjust the specifications of any model variants as a result of the worldwide computer chip shortage, as BMW and Mercedes-Benz have recently done.

Subaru Australia would not say how many sales it expects to lose in 2021 due to supply issues, but did state: “It’s a dynamic situation that we continue to evaluate in conjunction with the factory in Japan.”

The new-generation Subaru BRZ and Levorg are both still due on sale here by the end of this year, followed in 2022 by the new WRX, the new WRX STI and, perhaps, turbocharged and Wilderness versions of the new Outback.
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Old 07-01-2021, 12:14 PM   #500
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Default Subaru WRX coming late 2021,STI turbo flagship also confirmed to be ‘slightly behind’

What I am curious about is what differences there will be between the sti and Wrx MOTOR. Will it just be turbo and tune? Intercooler size? Heads? Cams ? We know the fa24 will take some decent power so it’ll be cool to see a wrx making 400 plus at the wheels with just a turbo and exhaust. Maybe IC.

Last edited by pcampbell; 07-01-2021 at 01:08 PM.
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