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Old 01-02-2011, 08:15 AM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saltYmirv View Post
Thats a beast of a kettlebell!


Can anyone here comment on the benefits of doing exercises like muscleups on the rings vs. barbell workouts for the sake of building strength?
My personal take on it is that working bodyweight and kettlebells is inferior to heavy barbell lifting for building sheer mass.

However, the result you get is that you can become extremely strong for whatever size you end up at and the strength is extremely functional. Muscleups themselves are more of a trick - you need to be very strong to do them, but they aren't much more than a strong pullup + a deep dip as far as building strength goes.

If you want to get big and strong - do deadlifts, squats, bench presses and pullups. (stronglifts 5x5 is a good start)

If you want to lose weight and be strong relative to your bodyweight, do crossfit.

If you want to want to do it in your house with minimal space and equipment, get rings, kettlebells, and an ab wheel.

BUT - if you want to keep going - and consistency is the most important thing - DO WHAT YOU ENJOY.
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Old 01-02-2011, 09:38 AM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poison View Post
deadlift 1.5x your bodyweight as many times as possible AFTER running 5k as fast as possible.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TurismoLou View Post
I'd be down for that as well.
I've got it. Run 5k, then do as many 1.5x bodyweight DL as you can in 2 minutes...every successful one takes 10 seconds off your time.

Or since a 5k is 3.1 miles, we can just do it timed...

3 Rounds for time:

1 mile
10 1.5x body weight deadlifts.

Someone like Lou will fly through the deadlifts, but a dedicated runner will definitely take some time.
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Old 01-02-2011, 10:02 AM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neek View Post
Just a little 2 pood...

My WOD on I think Wednesday, was:
.
is that how much you poo when you lift it?
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Old 01-02-2011, 10:03 AM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neek View Post
I've got it. Run 5k, then do as many 1.5x bodyweight DL as you can in 2 minutes...every successful one takes 10 seconds off your time.

Or since a 5k is 3.1 miles, we can just do it timed...

3 Rounds for time:

1 mile
10 1.5x body weight deadlifts.

Someone like Lou will fly through the deadlifts, but a dedicated runner will definitely take some time.
this could be fun... Definitely has to be after May though
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Old 01-02-2011, 11:27 AM   #80
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does anyone have some quick reads on 5-3-1 and starting strength? I did a quick google search and found mostly books. I feel like I did 531 this time last year, but I've forgotten the specifics. Trying to find something that my wife can do (gym noob) with me (4 years of fairly consistent lifting)

edit: n/m-found a SS routine.

and...i found a 531 routine.

Last edited by 240kat; 01-02-2011 at 11:41 AM.
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Old 01-02-2011, 11:31 AM   #81
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From T-nation:

http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_..._pure_strength
Quote:
In 5/3/1, you're expected to train three or four days a week. Each workout is centered around one core lift — the aforementioned parallel squat, bench press, deadlift, and standing shoulder press.



Each training cycle lasts four weeks, with these set-rep goals for each major lift:
Week 1: 3 x 5
Week 2: 3 x 3
Week 3: 3 x 5, 3, 1
Week 4: deloading


Then you start the next cycle, using heavier weights on the core lifts. And that's where a seemingly simple system starts getting complicated.



You aren't just picking a weight to lift five times or three times or one time per set. You're using a specific percentage of your one-rep max. And not your full 1RM. The calculations are based on 90% of it.


So if your 1RM in the bench press is 315 pounds, you use 285 (90%) as the base number for your training-weight calculations. Here's how it works:



Week 1 Week 2 Week 3 Week 4
Set 1 65% x 5 70% x 3 75% x 5 40% x 5
Set 2 75% x 5 80% x 3 85% x 3 50% x 5
Set 3 85% x 5+ 90% x 3+ 95% x 1+ 60% x 5

When you see 5+, 3+, or 1+, that means you do the max reps you can manage with that weight, with the goal of setting a rep record in each workout.



Let's walk through the Week 1 workout for bench press. Using the example above, if your 1RM is 315, you calculate all your percentages from 90% of that max, or 285 pounds.



So you're using 185 (65% of 285) x 5, 215 x 5, and 240 or 245 x 5 or more. (In his 5/3/1 ebook, available for $20 here, Wendler provides detailed lists of weights and percentages so you don't have to carry a calculator with you to the gym.


After you finish the first cycle, you add five pounds to your 1RM calculations for the two upper-body lifts and 10 pounds to your 1RM for the squat and deadlift.
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Old 01-02-2011, 11:31 AM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poison View Post
deadlift 1.5x your bodyweight as many times as possible AFTER running 5k as fast as possible.
I like that.

My 5k time will be measured in months, not minutes, lol.

Something for upper body too. Body weight bench and pullups?

5k
1.5x bw deadlift
1x bw bench
bw pullups

The only issue here is that this will still favor the smaller guys, that's why powerlifting comps use wilkes, because a 150 lb guy deadlifting 300 is no where near as much of a feat of strength as a 200 lb guy deadlifting 400, etc. Strength to weight ratio decreases with increased size.

I'd still do it. I wonder how many reps with 275 I could get...
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Old 01-02-2011, 11:43 AM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCGT View Post
I like that.

My 5k time will be measured in months, not minutes, lol.

Something for upper body too. Body weight bench and pullups?

5k
1.5x bw deadlift
1x bw bench
bw pullups

The only issue here is that this will still favor the smaller guys, that's why powerlifting comps use wilkes, because a 150 lb guy deadlifting 300 is no where near as much of a feat of strength as a 200 lb guy deadlifting 400, etc. Strength to weight ratio decreases with increased size.

I'd still do it. I wonder how many reps with 275 I could get...
Oh just say you wanna do crossfit and be done with it
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Old 01-02-2011, 11:43 AM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCGT View Post
I like that.

My 5k time will be measured in months, not minutes, lol.

Something for upper body too. Body weight bench and pullups?

5k
1.5x bw deadlift
1x bw bench
bw pullups

The only issue here is that this will still favor the smaller guys, that's why powerlifting comps use wilkes, because a 150 lb guy deadlifting 300 is no where near as much of a feat of strength as a 200 lb guy deadlifting 400, etc. Strength to weight ratio decreases with increased size.

I'd still do it. I wonder how many reps with 275 I could get...
No problem - use wilkes to even out the weights. 1.5x bw for our heaviest weight class and then use the wilkes coefficient to calculate the rest of the weights rounded to the nearest 5 lbs increment. Shouldn't be much work to put together a spreadsheet.

Being old... I'm gonna use a horse for the 5k portion of the competition. Especially as that was not stated as being against the rules.
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Old 01-02-2011, 11:56 AM   #85
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Originally Posted by Tim K. View Post
No problem - use wilkes to even out the weights. 1.5x bw for our heaviest weight class and then use the wilkes coefficient to calculate the rest of the weights rounded to the nearest 5 lbs increment. Shouldn't be much work to put together a spreadsheet.

Being old... I'm gonna use a horse for the 5k portion of the competition. Especially as that was not stated as being against the rules.
My car OK to use?
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Old 01-02-2011, 12:04 PM   #86
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Chris changing it up on me, glad I checked OT for the 2011 thread

As most of you know I consulted a certified nutritionist last week. I've been following his diet plan strictly, along with his workout. Worked out with a family friend Friday, he's competing for a body building show in a few weeks. Let's just say he pushed me way harder than I've ever been pushed. Should be an interesting workout from here on out.

Wish you all the best of luck in 2011.
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Old 01-02-2011, 01:50 PM   #87
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Ran 11 miles yesterday at a 9:27/min mile pace. First time in 6 weeks I've felt good running, between the sinus infection, pulled groin, and ligament damage in my foot. This is good news, as I'm 14 weeks out from my first triathlon of the season and start my program this week.

Trying to motivate myself to go get my 20-30 mile bike ride in right now, but the temperature and wind are not very motivating right now.
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Old 01-02-2011, 01:54 PM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neek View Post
From T-nation:
5-3-1 stuff
Thank you; that's perfect.
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Old 01-02-2011, 02:44 PM   #89
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My goal for 2011 is more diet related than strength. I'd like to up my commitment to clean eating and be up to a clean 220 by this time next year. That's 10lbs in a year. Tough for me because eating has always been my weak spot, but doable.

And I WILL squat 365 for reps.
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Old 01-02-2011, 03:33 PM   #90
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Trying to motivate myself to go get my 20-30 mile bike ride in right now, but the temperature and wind are not very motivating right now.
This is the coldest California winter I've ever had(40F outside) so my bike hasn't moved from my garage in weeks. When it gets over 65F it'll see some action.
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Old 01-02-2011, 03:35 PM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCGT View Post
I like that.

My 5k time will be measured in months, not minutes, lol.

Something for upper body too. Body weight bench and pullups?

5k
1.5x bw deadlift
1x bw bench
bw pullups

The only issue here is that this will still favor the smaller guys, that's why powerlifting comps use wilkes, because a 150 lb guy deadlifting 300 is no where near as much of a feat of strength as a 200 lb guy deadlifting 400, etc. Strength to weight ratio decreases with increased size.

I'd still do it. I wonder how many reps with 275 I could get...
Consider something to this effect.

Quote:
OPERATOR UGLY

Warm up: 4 Rounds
10x Goblet Squat @ 12kg
8x Push Ups
10x Sit ups

Training:

(1) Max Reps Bench Press @ 185# (men), 95# (women)

Protocol: Do one warm up set of 10 reps @ 135# (men), 45# (women). Then do a second warm up set of 5 reps @ 165# (men), 65# (women). Then load up 185# (men), 95# (women) and do as many reps as possible. You can "rest" holding the barbell up, off your chest in the elbows locked out position as you fight for more reps. For example, I sprinted through the first 5 reps, then started doing singles with a pause at the top to rest and psych up for the next rep.

The barbell must touch the athlete's chest for each rep, and finish with the elbows locked out. Feet must remain on the floor, and the athlete's butt cannot lose contact with the bench - no excessive arching!

(2) Max Reps Front Squat @ 185# (men), 95# (women)

Protocol: Do one warm up set of 10 reps @ 135# (men), 45# (women). Then do a second warm up set of 5 reps @ 165# (men), 65# (women). Then load up 185# (men), 95# (women) and do as many reps as possible. You can "rest" in the standing position, holding the barbell on your chest in the "rack" position. I sprinted through the first 7 reps, then started doing singles with a pause at the top to rest and psych up for the next rep.

The athlete must lower the barbell until his thighs are at parallel or below. If you have a dynamax medicine ball, place it below the athlete, and have him touch the ball with is butt for the "bottom" position. The top of the range of motion is standing with the hips locked out at full extension.

The athlete may hold the barbell on his chest which his hands and arms in the "clean" position, or crossed in the "body building" front squat position. Clean position is preferred, but not required.

(3) Max Reps Dead Stop Dead Lift @ 225# (men), 135# (women) in 60 seconds

Protocol: Do one warm up set of 10 reps @ 135# (men) 65# (women). Then do a second warm up set of 5 reps @ 185# (men), 95# (women). Then load up 225# (men), 135# (women) and do as many reps as possible in 60 seconds. NOTE THAT THESE ARE DEAD STOP DEAD LIFTS - NO BOUNCING! The barbell must stop completely on the floor after each rep. Watch the clock, and when the second hand hits 60 seconds, stop.

Range of motion starts with the barbell resting on the floor and ends at the top of the lift with the hips fully extended. The athlete may rest by setting the barbell on the floor and standing up without it.

Safety - Each athlete is responsible for his safety and proper lifting technique. If you feel your lower back beginning to "break" it set, I strongly advise you set the barbell down and rest before attempting another rep. However, a full range of motion determines whether or not a rep counts. "Ugly" dead lifts count, but expect to have a very sore lower back the next day.

(4) 4 Rounds for total Reps
60 second 25m sprint
60 second rest

Protocol: Each full length counts as 1 rep. Each full round trip counts as 2 reps. No partials! The athlete has to sprint a full length to get the point for the rep. On each of my 4 rounds, I ran out of time just a step or two from finishing the last rep - they didn't count.

(5) Max Strict Pull Ups

Protocol: These are dead hang and strict, chin above bar pull ups. No kipping, no chicken necking, no bull****. The athlete can "rest" while hanging on the bar with both hands in the bottom position. There is no set warm up for this test. The athlete may do a couple warm up pull ups if he likes. I didn't.

(6) 80# (men) or 60# (women) Sandbag Get up, max reps in 10 minutes

Protocol: Start standing with the sandbag on one shoulder. Lay all the way down, then "get up" any way you want. The "finish" position is full sanding position, knees and hips at full extension, feet shoulder width apart. The athlete may or may not switch shoulders with the sandbag as he wishes. I switched shoulders every 5 reps to help me keep count. Do as many reps as you can in 10 minutes.

(7) 3 Mile Run wearing Body Armor or 25# Weight Vest within 30 minutes.

Protocol: Start within 10 minutes of finishing the Sandbag Getups. Time the run. You have to finish within 30 minutes.

Test Notes and Explanation:

Reps vs. Max Effort Strength - An issue I struggled with in designing this test was how to test strength. The obvious way was to do a 1 rep max strength test. Issues arise with this - safety for one. Also, standardizing how to score the result is difficult. I've been intrigued by the 225# for reps bench press test the NFL uses at its combine for the draft, but knew that 225# for reps was too heavy for military athletes. Thus - I chose 185# for loading. A military athlete should be able to bench press 185# for reps.

Why bench press and front squat? - One of the most interesting things about strength is when an athlete is balanced, his front squat and bench press 1 rep max will be very close together. The same is true for max reps, like this test. With the front squat test, I'm not only testing leg strength, but also strength balance between upper and lower body. I got 10 reps for both the bench and front squat.

Dead Lifts - The dead lift is a great test of overall, full body strength. I chose not to test a 1 rep max because of time constraints. I found 60 seconds to be about right for time.

Sprints - The 60/60 25m sprint for reps tests anaerobic endurance and the athlete's ability to recover metabolically. I chose sprints as the "mode" to test anaerobic endurance and recovery over other means because I feel sprinting is a key fitness attribute for military athletes. Plus, no special equipment is needed for this test.

Pull ups - This is one carryover from typical military fitness tests. Pulling power is another needed attribute for military athletes. We don't do kipping pull ups in my gym or programming. I much prefer strict pull ups.

Sandbag get up: This is a great, functional exercise for building and testing core strength. Doing the sandbag getup for reps over a relatively long interval, 10 minutes, also test the athlete's work capacity. The sandbag getup is a full body exercise, which when done in high reps for time, will make you breath like a mother.

Loaded 3-mile Run: This event pushes Operator Ugly into a stamina event. Running 3 miles within 30 minutes in a 25# weight vest or body armor is not difficult as a single event, but after a solid hour of intense work leading up to the run, finishing in 30 minutes is no joke.

Rest between sets and exercises - Work through the test briskly enough so you can complete it in 60 minutes. For the bench press, front squat, and dead lift, there is no set rest period between sets. Rather, perform the test with a partner, or pretend that you are. By the time each guy does the set, plus weight changes, you'll be getting enough rest for these tests. Also, use the same barbell for each lift. The time it takes to unload the plates, re-set the racks for the front squat, and or, take off the barbell for the dead lift, etc, will give you the right amount of rest before starting the next exercise.

After the dead lifts, the athlete can take time to get a drink and catch his or her breath before starting the sprints. After the sprints, rest 3-5 minutes before doing the pull ups. You can take another couple of minutes between the pull ups and the sand bag get ups. Start the run within 10 minutes of finishing the sandbag getups.

SCORING:

Bench Press reps x1
Front Squat reps x1
Dead Lift reps x1
Sprints x1
Strict Pull ups x1
SBGU /2.
3 Mile Run within 30 minutes (Pass/Fail)

Here's an example on how to score the test:

Bench Press - 10 reps = 10 points
Front Squat - 10 reps = 10 points
Dead Lift - 18 reps = 18 points
Sprints - 36 total = 36 points
Pull ups - 18 reps = 18 points
SBGU - 52 reps/2 = 26 points

TOTAL: 10+10+18+36+18+26 = 118 points

SCORING STANDARDS

Minimum passing score is 100, and finishing the run within 30 minutes.

For male athletes less then 160#
- 110 is a respectable score
- 115 is a good score
- 125+ is a great score

For male athletes between 160# and 200#
- 125 is a respectable score
- 140 is a good score
- 150+ is a great score

For male athletes greater than 200#
- 145 is a respectable score
- 160 is a good score
- 170+ is a great score

- Rob Shaul

http://militaryathlete.com/page.php?page_ID=43

I would not pass, for the record

Last edited by saltYmirv; 01-02-2011 at 04:00 PM.
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Old 01-02-2011, 04:02 PM   #92
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My car OK to use?
Nope... something biological has to run. A pet Cheetah would be perfectly acceptable though.
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Old 01-02-2011, 05:31 PM   #93
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my 3k would be measured in years
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Old 01-02-2011, 05:40 PM   #94
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Originally Posted by Physics Junkie View Post
This is the coldest California winter I've ever had(40F outside) so my bike hasn't moved from my garage in weeks. When it gets over 65F it'll see some action.
I voted for a couple of hours on the trainer lately instead. Best thing I bought for training during the winter.
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Old 01-02-2011, 06:18 PM   #95
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Had a fairly light day, as it was my second gym trip in months. Feeling a lot better despite the low numbers. Just need to my muscles accustomed to working again.
(all sets are 8 reps)
Squats: 95, 115, 135, 155
Bench: 95, 115, 135, 135
Bent Row: 95, 115, 135, 135
Mil Press: 45, 65, 95, 95
DL: 95, 135, 155, 155

BW: 188 The numbers are embarrassing, but I don't want to hurt something trying to pull the numbers I once could. I also burned my thumb at work the other night, so I'll be using a thumb-less grip until the blister heals.
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Old 01-02-2011, 06:59 PM   #96
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3rd week doing SS. At what point do I need (if at all) a belt? Might be a dumb/noob question. I was squatting 190lbs. Correct form but I can feel my back straining a bit, and doing DL (also correct form) feels fine until about the last two sets then the next couple days I'm pretty sore.

I'm somewhat embarrassed of my numbers/stats. But hopefully by the end of SS they'll be way better..
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Old 01-02-2011, 07:14 PM   #97
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Forget the Wilkes formula, the smaller guys already have the 5K they have over us bigger, out of shape guys. I say we do this:

5K
Deadlift - max reps for your bodyweight
Dips - Max reps
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Old 01-02-2011, 08:28 PM   #98
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Found this when I was training for the Navy SEAL fitness challenge. Might start this again after I complete my current 6 week workout.

MONDAY. Start with body weight bench press. 4 sets max reps, 2 mins rest between each set. Followed by pull-ups 4 sets max reps, 2 mins rest between each set, followed by 3 sets max sit-ups 2 mins rest, and then body weight squats no weight, just stand up and do a full squat, your thighs should break the 90 degree angle.4 sets of 25 reps. Time the workout and save the time so the next time you do the work out you can see your progress. ALL OUT EFFORT!

TUESDAY. Timed 3 mile run, try to stay below a 7:30 mile, record the time to see the progress. Do what you can, the times will get shorter the harder you train, push yourself!!!!!

WED. REST

THURSDAY. PUSH-UP/ SPRINT COMBO: Mark out 100 meters, then start your watch, do 20 perfect push ups and sprint as fast as you can to the other end. Your rest is the time it takes you to walk back, you will perform 5 sets of this. Then stretch for 20 mins.

FRIDAY: ABS 1 warm up set of sit ups, perform 50 slow sit-ups, take as much time a you need. Next is knees to elbows. You hang on the pull-up bar and with your legs about shoulder width apart you pull your knees to your elbows. SOUNDS EASY….its not . Try to perform 3 sets of 10 reps.
Next flutter kicks, to do the exercise you lay on your back hands under your butt and legs completely straight with your head off the ground. Start the flutter kick raising one leg up and keeping the other one 6 inches off the ground keep switching at a comfortable pace. This is a four count exercise, and you need to keep your legs so the lowest they can go is 6 inches from the ground and the highest is 36 inches. Perform 100 reps in as few sets as possible. Next is V ups 5 sets of 20 reps. A V up is laying on your back with your legs straight and your arms back over your head, then bring them up together in the middle of your body, if this does not hurt your not doing them correctly. Stretch as needed.

SATURDAY. Pull-up/ dip combo. Do 100 pull-ups and 100 dips in as few sets as possible, so if you do 10 pull-ups then do as many dips as you can until you get 100 reps of each.

SUNDAY. Day of REST.
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Old 01-02-2011, 10:15 PM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TurismoLou View Post
Forget the Wilkes formula, the smaller guys already have the 5K they have over us bigger, out of shape guys. I say we do this:

5K
Deadlift - max reps for your bodyweight
Dips - Max reps
I think the "for reps" portion of this year's contest is going to kill the bigger out of shape guys. I liked how last year's bit was a compound score of a good number of events.

I also hate the notion of a 3.2 mile run; the last one I did was a 27-minute performance, though it was barefoot
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Old 01-02-2011, 10:59 PM   #100
TurismoLou
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Originally Posted by 240kat

I think the "for reps" portion of this year's contest is going to kill the bigger out of shape guys. I liked how last year's bit was a compound score of a good number of events.

I also hate the notion of a 3.2 mile run; the last one I did was a 27-minute performance, though it was barefoot
How about Max reps for 1.5 x bw for deads ?
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