Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Sunday September 22, 2019
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC General > News & Rumors > Non-Subaru News & Rumors

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.







* As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases. 
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads. 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-17-2019, 06:00 PM   #1126
godfather2112
Papi Chulo
Moderator
 
Member#: 53794
Join Date: Jan 2004
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Boner kill city
Vehicle:
... 2017 BMW M2
2017 F-150

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
The price is $49,900 for that option with multi coat pearl white color and basic autopilot .. 3.2 sec 0-60 and 11.5-6sec in the 1/4th mile and you still qualify for $1750 rebate.

I wonder how this is going to affect other automakers sales. For my car I paid $64,000 for that same configuration when the model 3 was introduced
So the exact same build of the car you bought has dropped by almost $15k in about a years time? Am I reading this correctly?
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
godfather2112 is online now   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Old 07-17-2019, 06:04 PM   #1127
4S-TURBO
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 67807
Join Date: Aug 2004
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: your spreads like plague
Vehicle:
.... I do like fish
and grits and pimp ****

Default

They’re giving away the farm with every sale killing profitability. Why?
4S-TURBO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2019, 06:07 PM   #1128
godfather2112
Papi Chulo
Moderator
 
Member#: 53794
Join Date: Jan 2004
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Boner kill city
Vehicle:
... 2017 BMW M2
2017 F-150

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4S-TURBO View Post
Theyíre giving away the farm with every sale killing profitability. Why?
Only legit reason I can think of is demand at the higher price dried up and in order to continue to move those upper trims, they needed to lower the MSRP of them. This is assuming I understood JM correctly.
godfather2112 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2019, 06:22 PM   #1129
SubaDuba420
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 102793
Join Date: Dec 2005
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Vehicle:
2016 WRX
Ugly Sedan

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
The price is $49,900 for that option with multi coat pearl white color and basic autopilot
Quote:
Originally Posted by godfather2112 View Post
Only legit reason I can think of is demand at the higher price dried up and in order to continue to move those upper trims, they needed to lower the MSRP of them. This is assuming I understood JM correctly.
Without extensive research I read this as they have a stockpile of pearl white/autopilot/performance models sitting in the warehouse and no buyers lined up waiting to take delivery of that model....
SubaDuba420 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2019, 06:40 PM   #1130
hooziewhatsit
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 143938
Join Date: Mar 2007
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Oregon
Default

I think it depends on whether you think they have a short term or long term goal.

Short term, they can probably be profitable by selling fewer cars at a higher margin.

But their reason for existing is to accelerate the change to EVs. That can't happen by being a higher priced niche automaker. They need to drive the price down to make it available to more buyers.

So the first buyers (as with every other tech product) pay more to get it now (then?), and everyone else gets it later for less.
hooziewhatsit is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2019, 06:57 PM   #1131
Sid03SVT
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 183032
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: CT
Vehicle:
OLD Family Wagon

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mechie3 View Post
I'm not a huge fan of the model 3 looks. Looks too bubbly. I don't hate it, just don't appreciate it as much as I do the looks of other cars in its price range.

I do like the looks of this......
https://arstechnica.com/cars/2019/07...-electric-car/
That Lotus gives me an E-rection
Sid03SVT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2019, 07:05 PM   #1132
juanmedina
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 133146
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: SC
Vehicle:
07 FPgreen [email protected]
WRX VF39+E85 12.0, 121mph

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by godfather2112 View Post
So the exact same build of the car you bought has dropped by almost $15k in about a years time? Am I reading this correctly?
Yeap if you just look at MSRP. I got $5000 back in exchange of free supercharging and $7500 from the federal rebate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SubaDuba420 View Post
Without extensive research I read this as they have a stockpile of pearl white/autopilot/performance models sitting in the warehouse and no buyers lined up waiting to take delivery of that model....
My understanding is that Tesla's are build to order. Pearl white is the new base free color and base auto pilot is included in all trim and models at no charge. The other day there were some articles stating that they are getting ready to increase production even more so maybe they are hitting new economy of scales. Margins were in the 20% last time IIRC we will see what they say next week.
juanmedina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2019, 07:09 PM   #1133
juanmedina
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 133146
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: SC
Vehicle:
07 FPgreen [email protected]
WRX VF39+E85 12.0, 121mph

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mechie3 View Post
I'm not a huge fan of the model 3 looks. Looks too bubbly. I don't hate it, just don't appreciate it as much as I do the looks of other cars in its price range.

I do like the looks of this......
https://arstechnica.com/cars/2019/07...-electric-car/
2.1 million with specs inferior than the 200k Tesla Roadster
juanmedina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2019, 07:41 PM   #1134
Keshav
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 1654
Join Date: Jun 2000
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Seattle, WA, USA
Vehicle:
2019 GoCycle GX
MV Agusta Brutale S

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
2.1 million with specs inferior than the 200k Tesla Roadster
inject the eventual comparison videos directly into my NeuraLinkô
Keshav is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2019, 08:17 PM   #1135
E. Nick
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 8489
Join Date: Jul 2001
Chapter/Region: BAIC
Location: Atherton, CA
Vehicle:
2005 Carrera GT
Guards

Default

So ridiculous - it should be under bankruptcy protection right now, writing off debt, selling assets, and restructuring as a niche automaker. Demand at any profitable sales price is gone, quality issues are plaguing every model, thousands of lawsuits are pending, and the idiot in charge constantly and continuously spews lies about every aspect of the "business".

Where's the roadster, where's the semi, where's the pickup, model Y, where's the FSD that people have been paying for for years, how about SolarCity? I could go on with 100 more "broken promises" which are actually just lies. Can't wait to see the package of BS they file as an earnings report
E. Nick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2019, 08:48 PM   #1136
godfather2112
Papi Chulo
Moderator
 
Member#: 53794
Join Date: Jan 2004
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Boner kill city
Vehicle:
... 2017 BMW M2
2017 F-150

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hooziewhatsit View Post
I think it depends on whether you think they have a short term or long term goal.

Short term, they can probably be profitable by selling fewer cars at a higher margin.

But their reason for existing is to accelerate the change to EVs. That can't happen by being a higher priced niche automaker. They need to drive the price down to make it available to more buyers.

So the first buyers (as with every other tech product) pay more to get it now (then?), and everyone else gets it later for less.
You do know that could simply be summed up by stating demand is weak at the higher price levels, correct? And that pricing needed to be dropped in order to sustain customer orders.
godfather2112 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 03:18 AM   #1137
Pre
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 139693
Join Date: Feb 2007
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shikataganai View Post
Yeah, the mandatory 20Ē with lo-pro tires killed it for me. The sad thing is that aftermarket 18Ēs exist now that clear the big brakes, so one could have had the best of both worlds had Tesla not been lazy in wheel design.
18ís and 19ís have been up on Tire Rack for a while now. I found 18Ē wheels for under $200 and around 23 lbs each. Tires were $167 a pop too. I punched in a 2019 Model 3 Performance dual motor version and looked at the 18 and 19 inch options and there were a number of them. 18ís definitely the sweet spot.

The RS, the CTR, hell the STI and Golf R all come with 19Ē and too skinny tires (35 series). I sold my stock wheels and tires at 1000 miles (break in basically) and downgraded to 18ís. A Tesla Model 3 owner should do the same. EE just busted two of his on a pot hole. 35 series tires are stupid. EE also outlined his bill. Iím like dude, for such a smart guy you could have bought new lighter 18Ē wheels and tires for over a grand less than you replaced for 2 replacement wheels and tires. Then sold your remaining 2 mint wheels and tires to someone else who has busted theirs. I sold all my stock wheels individually. One guy wanted a spare, the rest needed one or 2 because of pot hole damage. 20ís are stupid and unnecessary. Tesla isnít the only one doing oversized rims and skinny tires. Itís an industry problem right now. Looks over longevity.
Pre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 07:47 AM   #1138
Sid03SVT
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 183032
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: CT
Vehicle:
OLD Family Wagon

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pre View Post
18ís and 19ís have been up on Tire Rack for a while now. I found 18Ē wheels for under $200 and around 23 lbs each. Tires were $167 a pop too. I punched in a 2019 Model 3 Performance dual motor version and looked at the 18 and 19 inch options and there were a number of them. 18ís definitely the sweet spot.

.....Tesla isnít the only one doing oversized rims and skinny tires. Itís an industry problem right now. Looks over longevity.
Agreed; I want to say the trend started in the late 90's early 2000's; big diameter, narrow wheels with skinny tires on them, because they look cool, with tons of negatives like the increased rotational mass, unsprung weight, cost, minimized contact patch, and the inability to handle potholes. Add to all of the increased weight of cars in general, lower stiffer suspension and you're just asking for trouble.

I will admit that I run 17's on my car when 16's will clear the calipers but it's cheaper to buy 17" tires, and there are far more options in the size I run, not to mention I've got enough sidewall.
Sid03SVT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 07:54 AM   #1139
arghx7
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 232940
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: cold
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
The price is $49,900 for that option with multi coat pearl white color and basic autopilot .. 3.2 sec 0-60 and 11.5-6sec in the 1/4th mile and you still qualify for $1750 rebate.

I wonder how this is going to affect other automakers sales. For my car I paid $64,000 for that same configuration when the model 3 was introduced
So $49,900 for the Long Range dual motor or for the performance with 18 inch wheels? I'm confused, the 18 inch wheels and tires save you $5k on a Performance? That doesn't make much sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sid03SVT View Post
Agreed; I want to say the trend started in the late 90's early 2000's; big diameter, narrow wheels with skinny tires on them, because they look cool, with tons of negatives like the increased rotational mass, unsprung weight, cost, minimized contact patch, and the inability to handle potholes. Add to all of the increased weight of cars in general, lower stiffer suspension and you're just asking for trouble.

I will admit that I run 17's on my car when 16's will clear the calipers but it's cheaper to buy 17" tires, and there are far more options in the size I run, not to mention I've got enough sidewall.
I'm happy with the 18 inch wheels with aero covers removed on my long range dual motor. There's enough sidewall for a decent ride and it still looks pretty good (aero covers are fugly).
arghx7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 07:56 AM   #1140
Snow Drift
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 75071
Join Date: Nov 2004
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Long Island
Vehicle:
'18 Tesla Model 3
B4: 05 08 11 WRX 18 STI

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by arghx7 View Post
So $49,900 for the Long Range dual motor or for the performance with 18 inch wheels?
Performance w/ 18s, but you lose all of the Performance Package extras, and possibly Track Mode.
Snow Drift is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 07:59 AM   #1141
arghx7
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 232940
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: cold
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snow Drift View Post
Performance w/ 18s, but you lose all of the Performance Package extras, and possibly Track Mode.
So it's a dual motor car with extra acceleration for 2 grand? If that were an option a month ago I would have bought that. I just want the power.

Are there any difference in the motor/inverter/battery between performance and dual motor?
arghx7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 08:09 AM   #1142
juanmedina
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 133146
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: SC
Vehicle:
07 FPgreen [email protected]
WRX VF39+E85 12.0, 121mph

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by arghx7 View Post
So it's a dual motor car with extra acceleration for 2 grand? If that were an option a month ago I would have bought that. I just want the power.

Are there any difference in the motor/inverter/battery between performance and dual motor?
Tesla claims that the performance and inverters have a higher sigma but who knows.... maybe they will have a power up option for the AWD models in the future. I also hope they introduce launch mode low 11s would be nice.
juanmedina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 09:26 AM   #1143
arghx7
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 232940
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: cold
Default

What would a launch mode do though, assuming you're referring to something besides Ludicrous mode? Right now on a dual motor car if you come to a dead stop, you can tap the brake and it will hold the car in position while in drive. Then slam the gas and it just takes off, no squealing or anything (slip start turned off).
arghx7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 09:34 AM   #1144
godfather2112
Papi Chulo
Moderator
 
Member#: 53794
Join Date: Jan 2004
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Boner kill city
Vehicle:
... 2017 BMW M2
2017 F-150

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
Tesla claims that the performance and inverters have a higher sigma but who knows.... maybe they will have a power up option for the AWD models in the future. I also hope they introduce launch mode low 11s would be nice.
Why would you need launch control for a car with instant torque / power? Maybe Iím missing something
godfather2112 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 09:47 AM   #1145
shikataganai
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 92634
Join Date: Aug 2005
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Default Tesla Catch All Thread. Hate us cause you ainít us.

You canít buy the non-Performance Pack (20Ēs and bigger brakes and Track Mode) Performance 3 any more, afaik. That was a short lived option.

What Pre and I are talking about is how one can get aftermarket 18Ēs that clear the Performance Package brakes.

Last edited by shikataganai; 07-18-2019 at 10:10 AM.
shikataganai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 10:20 AM   #1146
juanmedina
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 133146
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: SC
Vehicle:
07 FPgreen [email protected]
WRX VF39+E85 12.0, 121mph

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by godfather2112 View Post
Why would you need launch control for a car with instant torque / power? Maybe Iím missing something
Launch mode preloads the powertrain so you already have torque before you start moving. The model S and X have launch mode.
juanmedina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 10:21 AM   #1147
juanmedina
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 133146
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: SC
Vehicle:
07 FPgreen [email protected]
WRX VF39+E85 12.0, 121mph

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shikataganai View Post
You can’t buy the non-Performance Pack (20”s and bigger brakes and Track Mode) Performance 3 any more, afaik. That was a short lived option.

What Pre and I are talking about is how one can get aftermarket 18”s that clear the Performance Package brakes.
as of yesterday you can buy the 18" wheel performance model 3 over the phone.
juanmedina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 10:30 AM   #1148
Keshav
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 1654
Join Date: Jun 2000
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Seattle, WA, USA
Vehicle:
2019 GoCycle GX
MV Agusta Brutale S

Default

it isn't clear if the performance M3 without the performance items (brakes, wheels, suspension, spoiler, etc) was a small batch of goofed-up production or a new off-menu item. I'm seeing conflicting stories.
Keshav is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 11:33 AM   #1149
juanmedina
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 133146
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: SC
Vehicle:
07 FPgreen [email protected]
WRX VF39+E85 12.0, 121mph

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keshav View Post
it isn't clear if the performance M3 without the performance items (brakes, wheels, suspension, spoiler, etc) was a small batch of goofed-up production or a new off-menu item. I'm seeing conflicting stories.
just go to tesla.com click "design your model 3" on second tab "exterior" you will see "18'' Aero Wheels available upon request"
juanmedina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 11:34 AM   #1150
hooziewhatsit
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 143938
Join Date: Mar 2007
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Oregon
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by godfather2112 View Post
You do know that could simply be summed up by stating demand is weak at the higher price levels, correct? And that pricing needed to be dropped in order to sustain customer orders.
Maybe? We don't have all the numbers (yet).

If the earning report shows lower gross margins along with the lower prices, then I would agree that it would appear they had to take a cut to profit to get more customers (not really a good thing...).

But if it shows a good GM with the lower prices, it would seem to show that they are producing them cheaper, so they're passing the savings on, and making them available to more buyers on virtue of being cheaper.

:shrug:
hooziewhatsit is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:14 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2019 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2019, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.

As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.