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Old 09-28-2019, 05:16 PM   #1
jongibson
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Default DAM @ .875 (400 miles)

2017 WRX Stage 1 MAP ots tune 91 oct with 93 octane gas

I understand .875 DAM is not detrimental but it's been stuck at .875 for 2 weeks and I'm on my 2nd tank of gas. About every half pull and full throttle I'll see -2.75 fine knock learn.

I've ran Cobb stage 1 93 oct tune and I've witnessed the DAM drop but it climbed back up with in the day.

Just curious if folks around here have the same experience with MAP shelf tunes.

I've read alot of forums prior to posting, seems that people will either reflash the ecu or the DAM climbed back up.
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Old 09-28-2019, 05:27 PM   #2
Nerdelectric
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Where are you filling up? It's possible that you have some sub-par gas, which isn't too uncommon from less reputable gas stations. I personally only fill up at Top Tier gas stations (if you don't know, just Google Top Tier gas, it's a real thing, and they'll give you a list), and I also avoid any station that looks less than well maintained.
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Old 09-28-2019, 05:30 PM   #3
jongibson
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1st tank @ HEB 2nd tank @ Chevron
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Old 09-28-2019, 05:30 PM   #4
jongibson
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nerdelectric View Post
Where are you filling up? It's possible that you have some sub-par gas, which isn't too uncommon from less reputable gas stations. I personally only fill up at Top Tier gas stations (if you don't know, just Google Top Tier gas, it's a real thing, and they'll give you a list), and I also avoid any station that looks less than well maintained.
I typically dont have an issue with HEB gas
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Old 09-28-2019, 07:13 PM   #5
Jersey Man10
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HEB gas is crap my man. Use Chevron or Shell and it should go back up. Also don't reset your ecu because then you won't know if it was really heb gas causing the problem. Just drive it easy and empty the tank.
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Old 09-30-2019, 02:10 AM   #6
subarulz!
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I have had a DAM drop take a couple tanks to get back to 1.00 and I have had it happen in a few drives. I would maybe contact Cobb to have someone explain it to you better because I'm no expert but from what I understand, the engine has to go through certain conditions to raise the DAM back. It may be taking a while because it happened and it's not being put through what it needs to be adding back the timing.
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Old 09-30-2019, 02:58 PM   #7
jongibson
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Old 09-30-2019, 03:00 PM   #8
jongibson
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I hear ya.. if anyone has some knowledge with datalogging here's my 3rd gr pull
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Old 09-30-2019, 03:09 PM   #9
EastPhilly
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Not sure if it was correct to do, but my tuner recommended for me to do a pull or two and see if that fixes it. I kept getting .8xx for a while. I drove around for about 15 minutes, then did a pull in 2nd from ~2.5k and it went right back to 1. Never went down after that.
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Old 09-30-2019, 04:40 PM   #10
jongibson
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EastPhilly View Post
Not sure if it was correct to do, but my tuner recommended for me to do a pull or two and see if that fixes it. I kept getting .8xx for a while. I drove around for about 15 minutes, then did a pull in 2nd from ~2.5k and it went right back to 1. Never went down after that.
Yeah I've done 2nd and 3rd gear pulls with similar fine knock learn events. Nothing really changes. I'll just push through this Chevron gas and fill up at the Shell...

Might change results, may not.

Please post up my data log if it belongs somewhere else in the forum.
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Old 10-07-2019, 01:10 AM   #11
jongibson
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Bump: still having issues. Anyone can check my datalog. Same results.
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Old 10-07-2019, 06:32 PM   #12
JayCee.FA20
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Are you sure youíre using 93 octane?
How are your driving habits?
Are you driving up hill?
If youre stage 1: do you have an aftermarket intake that matches with the part on the cobb
Or
Are you stage 1 with just an aftermarket exhaust and no intake delete.

I used to use chevron but for some reason my DAMís will drop on that whole tank of chevron, when i switched to shell or even costco gas, my DAMís never drop.

As of right now im stage 2 with an ETS catted j pipe, single exit invidia exhaust and stock intake.

If you have a catless j pipe your DAMís will drop cause well we dont have external wastegates to let the air recirculate out to the atmosphere.

Catless j pipe = money pit = KillerB EWG headers recommended = 1600-2000 headers.


To see DAMís rise again simply cruise and dont drive like a child, these engines are very sensitive especially since youre not PROTUNED, if you want to drive like that, you have to get off the OTS map and get your car tuned tuned and save your investment.
Keep the RPMís around 2500-3000 you will have to be on a freeway and just cruise it out until your DAMís are back up.


GAS is important. Ive tested this 2-3 times already. Same results, like i said before chevron always drops my DAMís so reasons why i use shell
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Old 10-07-2019, 06:45 PM   #13
GlarryHoodDIT
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Why do you keep referring to DAM (Dynamic Advance Multiplier) in the plural? It's one parameter.

A catless J by itself does not cause DAM to drop, DAM drops are from Knock and nothing else. I dont know what you're going on about with EWGs and recirculating air back to the atmosphere, you seem to be conflating the knock control and boost control systems together...

OP, just ignore the entire post above mine basically.

DAM drops because your car experienced a significant knock event. In order to raise the DAM back up you need to drive through the same loads/rpm ranges where knock originally appeared without the ECU detecting knock again. Once this happens x amount of times your ECU will raise the DAM. If its consistent at .875 it's probably not gas, it's probably the timing scheme is a little too advanced for your car in whatever range the knock is occurring. You can either get an E or Pro Tune or live with not running the most amount timing advance possible, which means less power. FWIW, I get occassional DAM drops from cruise all the time. Typically it takes a few highway drives to get the DAM to raise back up.
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Old 10-09-2019, 06:52 PM   #14
jongibson
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GlarryHoodDIT View Post
Why do you keep referring to DAM (Dynamic Advance Multiplier) in the plural? It's one parameter.

A catless J by itself does not cause DAM to drop, DAM drops are from Knock and nothing else. I dont know what you're going on about with EWGs and recirculating air back to the atmosphere, you seem to be conflating the knock control and boost control systems together...

OP, just ignore the entire post above mine basically.

DAM drops because your car experienced a significant knock event. In order to raise the DAM back up you need to drive through the same loads/rpm ranges where knock originally appeared without the ECU detecting knock again. Once this happens x amount of times your ECU will raise the DAM. If its consistent at .875 it's probably not gas, it's probably the timing scheme is a little too advanced for your car in whatever range the knock is occurring. You can either get an E or Pro Tune or live with not running the most amount timing advance possible, which means less power. FWIW, I get occassional DAM drops from cruise all the time. Typically it takes a few highway drives to get the DAM to raise back up.
Thnx for the reply. To add on to this post, car is stock with namless muffler delets. I went to a different chevron gas station and filled up. (Yes with 93 oct.. that's what's here in texas)

Still experiencing fine lock learn events every single half throttle through each gear.

I dont believe my car like the MAP ots tunes. I will be switching back to Cobb ots tune since I did not experience these types of events with them.

DAM still at .875
Still experiencing -2's fine knock learn events (typically after boost hits above 3-4psi)

I will update this post with Cobb ots tune results and I think I will make an opinionated post about MAP ots tunes...
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Old 10-09-2019, 07:01 PM   #15
Waddlz
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I'm not sure if its the same with the FA20 maps, but Cobb runs too much timing on their Stage 1 OTS maps for the EJ25. At least, for my wifes WRX.

I had to pull -2 degrees global timing for the knock to go away.

Try pulling 2 degrees and see if the DAM stops dropping.
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Old 10-10-2019, 09:23 AM   #16
Craigster08
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You are going to continue experiencing those fine knock learn events within that range until it gradually goes back to 0, or if your DAM increases. Typically the fine knock learn will reach 0 in increments of .35.

FWIW, I run MAP's stage 2 tune, and I do experience some knock and DAM drops, but normally DAM works its way back to 1.00. I would highly suggest reading up on Subaru's knock strategy and what each of those values are, FBK, FKL, and DAM. Cobb has a couple articles regarding that.
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Old 10-10-2019, 12:08 PM   #17
jongibson
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Interesting. My DAM has refused to increase. It's still stuck at .875. I see fnk every time I reach above 3-4 psi. Nothing has changed with in the past month and 3 tanks t
of gas.
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Old 10-10-2019, 12:11 PM   #18
Jersey Man10
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Do you have the ac on? Why are you always in boost?

In this situation just reset your ecu and start over.
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Old 10-10-2019, 12:25 PM   #19
jongibson
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jersey Man10 View Post
Do you have the ac on? Why are you always in boost?

In this situation just reset your ecu and start over.
Ya ac on. Ac typically causes feedback knock. The fine knock learn is new since the MAP ots tune.

Not always in boost. Just stating that's when fine knock learn events come into play and at full throttle. Check out 1st post for additional details.
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Old 10-10-2019, 03:32 PM   #20
GlarryHoodDIT
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Run the Cobb OTS map since you said you weren't having problems with it.
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