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Old 08-25-2018, 01:17 PM   #1
smoky
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Default My G25-660 2.35 build

Here is the info on the build and the results
  • Cobb access port v3
  • Speed density
  • Cobb flex fuel sensor, Canadian 94 and E85
  • Garret G25-660 with 0.72 hotside rotated custom setup
  • Process West TMIC
  • TGV delete
  • Custom parallel fuel rail
  • Walbro 450 fuel pump, hardwired
  • Aeromotive A1000 FPR
  • Cobb 1300X top feed injectors
  • Rebuild engine 2.35 (ej257 with 2l crank)
  • Manley 8.5 compression ratio 100mm, heavy duty piston pin (**8.1 effective compression ratio on 2.35)
  • Manley MPS h-tuff rods +2mm
  • 11mm head studs
  • MPS 10mm oil pump (ported +1 shim)
  • Static and dynamic balancing
  • Heads
  • Bowl blend porting
  • Power division S1 cams
  • Tomei high rev springs
  • Tomei headers
  • Custom catless downpipe and Cobb axle back
  • Grimmspeed electronic boost controller
  • External wastergate, tial 38mm
  • EFI Logics tune

1 pull on 94:

Final results:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/jxYyhW7itFwMbkBY6

Very impressed with results so far. We had to limit boost on E85 since we maxed the injectors (93%). TMIC was also limiting we had quite high temperature. Probably close to a point where a closed deck would be a good idea. Last point I wanted to rev up to 8500 but the ECU started acting weirdly pass 8000 and we had to stop. It's a 04 STI ECU, could be limited as they were upgraded from 05 and up.

Tx to EFI Logics, Calvin, Cory, Pete, Ben all professionnals, they did a crazy jobs. http://www.efilogics.com/

Tx a lot to Freedom Shop for the custom turbo setup http://freedomshop.ca/


I've not driven the car yet on track, will have to wait a few weeks before I autocross it. Car is built for hardcore autocrossing. It was a bit of a gamble to test that turbo and try a destroke 2.35 at the same time. Looks like there is more to this turbo and that the 550 would have probably given similar result with even better spool. I'll report back with more info once I tested it on the track.

Expension plan for the future would be to go up to 8500-9000rpm to help with short gearing of the subaru in autocross. I could also try a slighly higher compression ratio (9.0 or 9.5) to help with spool and response. Anybody that reached 9k rpm and would like to share info on how to achieve this you can contact me in private
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Last edited by smoky; 09-06-2018 at 12:13 PM.
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Old 08-25-2018, 03:11 PM   #2
rexworx
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Im really liking the curves. I like the build sir! What gearbox and gear was the pull/graph made in?
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Old 08-25-2018, 03:51 PM   #3
smoky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rexworx View Post
Im really liking the curves. I like the build sir! What gearbox and gear was the pull/graph made in?
Not 100% sure, but I think 4th
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Old 08-25-2018, 07:39 PM   #4
subaru_gc8
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o should think about an air to water intercooler system that way you keep the response and actually have a lower boost drop than a FMIC, also what type of boost did you want to run on e85?
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Old 08-25-2018, 08:39 PM   #5
smoky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subaru_gc8 View Post
o should think about an air to water intercooler system that way you keep the response and actually have a lower boost drop than a FMIC, also what type of boost did you want to run on e85?
I though about water intercooler. To really make it work for autocross I would need to put the rad toward the back of the car, adding weight in front is really bad. Then I would need a big radiator and fan working all the time in the trunk. I'll probably go for a FMIC at some point.

For boost I had no precise goal, but I guess you could run 28-30 with that turbo with proper suporting mod. I wanted to stay in the 400wtq range to help prevent drivetrain failure on the track (315 hoosier A7)
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Old 08-25-2018, 08:42 PM   #6
subaru_gc8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smoky View Post
I though about water intercooler. To really make it work for autocross I would need to put the rad toward the back of the car, adding weight in front is really bad. Then I would need a big radiator and fan working all the time in the trunk. I'll probably go for a FMIC at some point.

For boost I had no precise goal, but I guess you could run 28-30 with that turbo with proper suporting mod. I wanted to stay in the 400wtq range to help prevent drivetrain failure on the track (315 hoosier A7)
Actually I think an a2w is more efficient at low speeds due to it doesn't need lots of air running through it as for weight, I do not think it really adds much it doesn't take more than 2 gallons which comes out to about 14 lbs
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Old 08-26-2018, 02:56 PM   #7
subaru_gc8
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by smoky View Post
Here is the info on the build and the results
  • Cobb access port v3
  • Speed density
  • Cobb flex fuel sensor, Canadian 94 and E85
  • Garret G25-660 with 0.72 hotside rotated custom setup
  • Process West TMIC
  • TGV delete
  • Custom parallel fuel rail
  • Walbro 450 fuel pump, hardwired
  • Aeromotive A1000 FPR
  • Cobb 1300X top feed injectors
  • Rebuild engine 2.35 (ej257 with 2l crank)
  • Manley 8.5 compression ratio 100mm, heavy duty piston pin
  • Manley MPS h-tuff rods +2mm
  • 11mm head studs
  • MPS 10mm oil pump (ported +1 shim)
  • Static and dynamic balancing
  • Heads
  • Bowl blend porting
  • Power division S1 cams
  • Tomei high rev springs
  • Tomei headers
  • Custom catless downpipe and Cobb axle back
  • Grimmspeed electronic boost controller
  • External wastergate, tial 38mm
  • EFI Logics tune

1 pull on 94:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pE2Z_ookMBk

Final results:


Very impressed with results so far. We had to limit boost on E85 since we maxed the injectors (93%). TMIC was also limiting we had quite high temperature. Probably close to a point where a closed deck would be a good idea. Last point I wanted to rev up to 8500 but the ECU started acting weirdly pass 8000 and we had to stop. It's a 04 STI ECU, could be limited as they were upgraded from 05 and up.

Tx to EFI Logics, Calvin, Cory, Pete, Ben all professionnals, they did a crazy jobs. http://www.efilogics.com/

Tx a lot to Freedom Shop for the custom turbo setup http://freedomshop.ca/


I've not driven the car yet on track, will have to wait a few weeks before I autocross it. Car is built for hardcore autocrossing. It was a bit of a gamble to test that turbo and try a destroke 2.35 at the same time. Looks like there is more to this turbo and that the 550 would have probably given similar result with even better spool. I'll report back with more info once I tested it on the track.

Expension plan for the future would be to go up to 8500-9000rpm to help with short gearing of the subaru in autocross. I could also try a slighly higher compression ratio (9.0 or 9.5) to help with spool and response. Anybody that reached 9k rpm and would like to share info on how to achieve this you can contact me in private
maybe the 04 ecu doenst have enough resolution in the tables or he has to rescale the whole map so you can get the resolution up to, but that a whole lot of work
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Old 08-27-2018, 11:10 AM   #8
Titter
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been waiting to see real data on these new garrett turbos.

thanks for sharing
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Old 08-27-2018, 11:13 AM   #9
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Pretty interesting. Just for comparison, how much whp/wtq for a stock STI on this dyno ? I know they have a Mustang dyno which often read pretty low...
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Old 08-27-2018, 12:24 PM   #10
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What did you want to know about revving to 9k RPM?

Also, seeing you're on +2mm rods and Manley "8.5:1" pistons, I'm guessing this was actually an EJ257 designed piston, so you're probably more like 8.0:1 if not worse.
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Old 08-27-2018, 05:57 PM   #11
smoky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daggernomad55555 View Post
Pretty interesting. Just for comparison, how much whp/wtq for a stock STI on this dyno ? I know they have a Mustang dyno which often read pretty low...
I think 220whp for an 04 STI
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Old 08-27-2018, 06:05 PM   #12
smoky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
What did you want to know about revving to 9k RPM?

Also, seeing you're on +2mm rods and Manley "8.5:1" pistons, I'm guessing this was actually an EJ257 designed piston, so you're probably more like 8.0:1 if not worse.
Yep pistons are EJ257 with standard pin position. I did not think about lower displacement, you are right I'm probably lower than 8.5. Doing the math give me around 8.1

For 9k, lots of different info from different people. Nobody was able to confirm what tomei high rev springs would get me too before floating with S1 cams. GSC would say to stay under 7500 rpm with these and stock retainer, we got 8k without any issue, just left to know if this will hold. Some says titanium retainers are not as reliable as stock, some say the other way around. I also heard about timing belt issue at these RPM from the OEM tensioner. Oil pump advice was also all over the place. Looks like not a lot of people have done it and shared the info.
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Old 08-27-2018, 06:06 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
What did you want to know about revving to 9k RPM?

Also, seeing you're on +2mm rods and Manley "8.5:1" pistons, I'm guessing this was actually an EJ257 designed piston, so you're probably more like 8.0:1 if not worse.
Don't you just spin it there provided the heads can take it and the oil pressure is 85-90 psi in the top end As you know EJ's actually like reving high being an oversquare motor and all, even with stock rod/stroke ratio there is nothing wrong with 8200 rpm if the heads can flow and wont float.
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Old 08-27-2018, 08:46 PM   #14
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Yeah, 9k on a 75mm stroke isn't a thing. Make sure you have enough shim for oil pressure to keep up and just let it eat

Looking at your curves, unless you're going to taper/increase high RPM boost, it'll be moot for your, except for using as an over-rev to stretch a gear entering a corner.
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Old 08-27-2018, 09:54 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
Looking at your curves, unless you're going to taper/increase high RPM boost, it'll be moot for your, except for using as an over-rev to stretch a gear entering a corner.
Or you know, the smile a screaming EJ brings to your face!
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Old 08-28-2018, 09:16 AM   #16
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Out of curiosity, I went ahead and plugged in the numbers, leaving deck height and gasket thickness the same, making stroke and rod length the only variables:

79mm stroke = 8.70:1
75mm stroke = 8.31:1

So a delta of 0.4.
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Old 08-28-2018, 12:57 PM   #17
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Manley uses 51cc head volume to calculate their CR:

http://www.manleyperformance.com/sc/..._pistons.shtml

With 56cc sti heads and those pistons and a 75mm stroke I get 7.9:1. 79mm I get 8.3.

Using the high compression 9.8:1 pistons destroked I get 9.0:1.
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Old 08-28-2018, 03:00 PM   #18
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Peter, I'm guessing you're also using stock deck heights and HG's on those numbers?

My point was to simply show that he was ~0.4:1 CR lower than what he thought. Your numbers show the same.

Without having cc'ed chambers after cutting seats and decking, it's all guessing. Same goes with quench volume, in regards to deck cutting and headgasket used...but you know that.
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Old 09-05-2018, 03:40 PM   #19
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Nice build! Very promising low and mid-range numbers. I'm about a month out on my own G25-660 build for autocross. Built 2.5 with GSC S1 cams as well. Glad to finally find some comparable numbers.
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Old 09-06-2018, 02:12 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by tsrapophis View Post
Nice build! Very promising low and mid-range numbers. I'm about a month out on my own G25-660 build for autocross. Built 2.5 with GSC S1 cams as well. Glad to finally find some comparable numbers.
Awesome, keep me updated, it will be a good comparison between the 2.5 and 2.35.
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Old 09-08-2018, 08:59 PM   #21
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Take this with a very large grain of salt since this is just what I've heard my tuner say, but there are two things he hates: ****ty Canadian gas (no offense if you're Canadian) and high CR. For him the ideal CR is low 8.X.

That being said I'm sure you all know what you're doing, curious to see what people think about high CRs.
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Old 09-08-2018, 09:09 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by billyboy999 View Post
Take this with a very large grain of salt since this is just what I've heard my tuner say, but there are two things he hates: ****ty Canadian gas (no offense if you're Canadian) and high CR. For him the ideal CR is low 8.X.

That being said I'm sure you all know what you're doing, curious to see what people think about high CRs.
Higher than stock CR help for off boost response and spool, but you need to lower boost/timing = about the same power but better response. It depends on fuel quality. High CR are for NA engines.
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Old 09-08-2018, 11:21 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daggernomad55555 View Post
Higher than stock CR help for off boost response and spool, but you need to lower boost/timing = about the same power but better response. It depends on fuel quality. High CR are for NA engines.
Correction high(higher than normal) CR is for cars that run the fuel to support it.
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Old 09-09-2018, 02:09 AM   #24
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^^^yeah kinda. what happens is to make power on high CR, with any given fuel, the less timing you add, and the more abuse on the rotating assembly you add.

Quote:
Originally Posted by billyboy999 View Post
Take this with a very large grain of salt since this is just what I've heard my tuner say...he hates: high CR. For him the ideal CR is low 8.X.
Well duh, it makes his job harder via a smaller range of 'it's all good' to 'splattered parts'.

The higher the CR and boost (for any given octane, it's all relative), the finer the edge to great power and and destruction becomes.

Last edited by Homemade WRX; 09-11-2018 at 10:11 AM.
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Old 09-09-2018, 03:59 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daggernomad55555 View Post
Higher than stock CR help for off boost response and spool, but you need to lower boost/timing = about the same power but better response. It depends on fuel quality. High CR are for NA engines.
If you wanted better response, would going with a smaller turbo be more effective?

And yeah my tuner only does Subarus so he's probably hasn't seen very many NA cars.
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