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Old 07-11-2014, 02:56 PM   #151
roadtrip1098
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There is already a system that works. Someone mentioned the killer chiller. They use it to cool the sc on mustangs. Ford even had a similar system designed for the gen 3 lightning before it was scrapped. The idea is that the water in the reservoir is cooled to sub ambient temperature, then is pumped through the AWIC where during high boost situations it picks up a significant amount of heat. This heat is then dumped off back close to ambient temperature when going through the heat exchanger and then further cooled once it returns to the reservoir. Since you won't be at high boost levels for any sustained time the reservoir should hold you over in most any situation where the AC would be temporarily disabled. During normal driving, there is not as much heat to be soaked up by the water and the AC wouldn't need to work as hard to keep the reservoir water cool.
I am fairly certain that this is the route I am going to go when I start putting my system together. I will most likely build it like a traditional AWIC System and add a condenser to the reservoir. Then when I have more than half an hour to myself I'll work on getting it plumbed up to the factory AC.

Anything has got to be better than the top mount.
On a side note, once I get the AWIC installed, I may look for a reverse hood scoop to help pull the heat from the turbo out.
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Old 07-11-2014, 11:28 PM   #152
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It was me talking about the killer chiller, and I've done the research to install it in a Subaru. I also already have an AWIC.
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Old 07-24-2014, 04:02 PM   #153
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http://www.summitracing.com/parts/mez-wp430s/overview/

Curious if any one has tried something like this in the AC position to have a constantly running water pump. I am still researching the AWIC idea and this seemed like a way to do away with the electric pumps assuming flow rate is sufficient. Any thoughts?
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Old 07-24-2014, 05:02 PM   #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evilfirbolg View Post
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/mez-wp430s/overview/

Curious if any one has tried something like this in the AC position to have a constantly running water pump. I am still researching the AWIC idea and this seemed like a way to do away with the electric pumps assuming flow rate is sufficient. Any thoughts?
Now THAT is a pretty cool idea. Don't have to screw around with anything electrical...
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Old 07-25-2014, 01:18 PM   #155
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Originally Posted by Type2 View Post
Now THAT is a pretty cool idea. Don't have to screw around with anything electrical...
It might be. I am certainly looking into it. Would certainly interested in folks' opinions, experiences and ideas on it. Seems one benefit is that flow rate would increase with load.
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Old 07-25-2014, 02:11 PM   #156
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I wouldn't want to give up AC so would need to find a spot for it somewhere. Probably need a custom bracket.
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Old 07-25-2014, 11:16 PM   #157
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Uh there are electric water pumps that pump 40gpm so... No reason to get a belt driven pump.
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Old 07-25-2014, 11:44 PM   #158
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Yeah yer probably right. My goals are daily driving and endurance racing so reliability is the issue but i'm guessing the Bosch pump is fairly reliable as Mercedes uses it. Just throwing out ideas for the sake of curiosity. Belt driven wouldn't make sense for drag racing but it MIGHT for my application. I will probably go electric if I go this route anyway. Ya can buy three Bosch pumps for the cost of that Meziere.
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Old 07-27-2014, 11:02 PM   #159
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Belt driven wouldn't make sense for endurance racing either, all it would do is heat up the water more and add more parasitic load. The additional 4amps an ewp draws will add negligible load and be very reliable if you shock mount the pump, pump relay, add a cooling fan to the pump and install it in the orientation recommended by the manufacturer. You should also install it inside of the vehicle somewhere to avoid water ingress which kills pump bearings and is the cause of most failures with installs of this type. Ewps do not like being mounted outside of the passenger cabin.
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Old 07-27-2014, 11:08 PM   #160
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Yeah have pretty much decided on and agree with all that. In truth I am not thinking an AWIC set up will work for me anyway. Seems over long distances the fluid would just steadily get warmer due to its density. Perhaps I am wrong, maybe with a gargantuan enough exchanger but then the complexity of it all just means more stuff to fail.

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Old 09-02-2014, 06:45 PM   #161
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For those of you with functioning kits and gauges, could I get some information?

What core are you running?
What water pump are you running? GPM?
What is your water temp just before the intercooler?
What is your water temp just after the intercooler?
What is your IAT?

I would like a WOT pull after the water has been warmed to operating temp. I would also like a "daily driving" example.

My goal is to figure out how much heat is being removed with the increased air velocity. Less time to pass through the intercooler = less heat removed and I want to make sure I get a good intercooler. I want to see if it would be beneficial for me to get a larger/longer intercooler to increase the amount of time the air has to cool down and fully utilize the potential.

Is anyone running a variable speed water pump? I.E. electric or mechanical pump that varies speed relative to engine RPM/load.

Yes, I'm over-engineering this.
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Old 09-04-2014, 01:19 PM   #162
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10.5x6x5" core, type
29. It's bigger than that with the end tanks. 20gpm pump, constant speed, 3/4" lines. Reservoir and pump mounted in the trunk. I quit monitoring coolant temp a long time ago, not very useful when you can just monitor iat. My iat sensor is located post ic. Iat will rise if you sit in traffic, no matter what. As soon as you really get on the gas it goes right back down. My iat has never went more than 30* above ambient sitting at idle for long periods. I go below ambient when I spray water/meth. I tuned the car myself, and for a while I had a 16gxt running 24psi to redline which basically makes it into a hair dryer and still didn't increase my iat. Bigger turbo now, less psi making similar power and I can't tell the difference besides slightly slower spool.
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Old 09-05-2014, 11:46 AM   #163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drewvdw View Post
For those of you with functioning kits and gauges, could I get some information?

What core are you running?
What water pump are you running? GPM?
What is your water temp just before the intercooler?
What is your water temp just after the intercooler?
What is your IAT?

I would like a WOT pull after the water has been warmed to operating temp. I would also like a "daily driving" example.

My goal is to figure out how much heat is being removed with the increased air velocity. Less time to pass through the intercooler = less heat removed and I want to make sure I get a good intercooler. I want to see if it would be beneficial for me to get a larger/longer intercooler to increase the amount of time the air has to cool down and fully utilize the potential.

Is anyone running a variable speed water pump? I.E. electric or mechanical pump that varies speed relative to engine RPM/load.

Yes, I'm over-engineering this.
It is my guestimate that it is better to run a FMIC with an intercooler mister controlled by a boost switch

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Old 09-05-2014, 09:56 PM   #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dstroy View Post
10.5x6x5" core, type
29. It's bigger than that with the end tanks. 20gpm pump, constant speed, 3/4" lines. Reservoir and pump mounted in the trunk. I quit monitoring coolant temp a long time ago, not very useful when you can just monitor iat. My iat sensor is located post ic. Iat will rise if you sit in traffic, no matter what. As soon as you really get on the gas it goes right back down. My iat has never went more than 30* above ambient sitting at idle for long periods. I go below ambient when I spray water/meth. I tuned the car myself, and for a while I had a 16gxt running 24psi to redline which basically makes it into a hair dryer and still didn't increase my iat. Bigger turbo now, less psi making similar power and I can't tell the difference besides slightly slower spool.

I really need those coolant temps for my over engineering. I'm trying to figure out what amount of flow is optimal. The amount of flow could affect IAT's. Do you happen to have pre and post intercooler coolant temp sensors?


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Old 09-06-2014, 04:20 AM   #165
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Uhh the amount of flow will affect iat... Directly. As in, you want as much flow as you can get, all the time. If you really want pre and post ic temps there's a thread on iwsti by turbineguy, he took the time to do all that. I monitored pre ic coolant temps for a while like I said, and if you stomp on the gas your post ic temps drop to whatever the coolant temp is, and your coolant will be ambient road temp if you have a properly sized or oversized heat exchanger that has air directed at it correctly. I went through several iterations until I ended up with what I have now. Frontal area is king, except when airflow will be blocked to most of the heat exchanger, so you won't be able to use a tall exchanger unless you want to cut up your bumper cover like and make it look like an evo. No scientific data is needed, just get the biggest ic and exchanger that will fit, and the highest flowing pump that you can find (Davies Craig makes a 40gpm). You don't need a bleed at the high point in your system if you pump from the reservoir to the low point, all the air gets pumped out into the reservoir. Larger coolant lines are better than smaller coolant lines. Don't use -an coolant lines, they're expensive and a pita and you will end up changing your setup a few times slightly. There really isn't any engineering to do, use common sense.
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Old 09-06-2014, 09:57 AM   #166
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Drewvdw: check the original post. I put a link there to Turbinguy's thread on iwsti. He did a good bit of testing with multiple monitors.
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Old 09-08-2014, 12:07 PM   #167
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Well, there is a bit of engineering for me to do, I'm going to try building my own "Killer Chiller" style AWIC.

Also, more flow does not equate to more heat removed. Just as in the engine's coolant system, if you move the coolant too fast, you will overheat. There's far more science to this than you or I can understand. Does it work? Absolutely. But I don't just want this to work, I want it to work perfectly.

Last edited by drewvdw; 09-08-2014 at 12:35 PM.
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Old 09-08-2014, 01:27 PM   #168
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Does anyone have a source for buying the PWR AWIC heat exchangers? I have a BRZ now with a supercharger using an AWIC integrated into the manifold, but need to find a heat exchanger. I've always heard good things about the PWR ones but can't seem to find them anywhere. The car will be maybe 350WHP using E85 with a roots blower, which isn't the most efficient, so a good heat exchanger is needed.

Or really anything decent, doesn't have to be PWR. I've looked at some of the Mustang-specific dual-pass ones with fans from some of the other vendors. They are kind of nice because a lot of them have integrated oil coolers, but they are made specifically for the Mustang and I don't know about shoehorning them in or mounting them on a BRZ.
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Old 09-08-2014, 03:14 PM   #169
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Has anyone considered tapping the fuel pump power as a signal source. The factory fuel pump is driven at 33% at idle and low speed,66% at intermediate load and 100% at heavy load. You would just need some FET transistors and some diodes for a simple driver. Could be a simple way to get longer pump life, less power draw.
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Old 09-08-2014, 04:32 PM   #170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deseely View Post
Has anyone considered tapping the fuel pump power as a signal source. The factory fuel pump is driven at 33% at idle and low speed,66% at intermediate load and 100% at heavy load. You would just need some FET transistors and some diodes for a simple driver. Could be a simple way to get longer pump life, less power draw.

This is an awful idea, and another failure mode in an already complex inter cooling solution. Who cares about power draw? Pump life is long, even longer if you mount it inside the passenger cabin. 20,000-50,000h mtbf is longer than the life of the vehicle.
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Old 10-08-2014, 07:44 PM   #171
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vica153 View Post
We need to find a new source for AWICs, these tiny ones off frozenboost are no where near the proper size and they want way too much for the big ones.
http://www.bellintercoolers.com/_pag...iquidCore.html

Pricey but quality.
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Old 10-09-2014, 01:54 AM   #172
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bell is one of the best out there if not the best...... period.
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Old 11-20-2014, 09:42 AM   #173
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My Plan is to have Moore Performance build me an AWIC here locally. They use Bell Intercoolers. I have seen a few they have done and I'm mostly sold. I may not be able to fit it in the budget though.

Last edited by slowgenius; 11-20-2014 at 12:52 PM.
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Old 11-20-2014, 04:07 PM   #174
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I just want to point out that I have a frozenboost intercooler and a gtx3582r and it is no where near "way too small". It keeps up with the heat that turbo puts out just fine, and has done so for a long time. The person who was having problems most likely had an issue with their setup other than the intercooler.
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Old 11-20-2014, 04:26 PM   #175
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dstroy View Post
I just want to point out that I have a frozenboost intercooler and a gtx3582r and it is no where near "way too small". It keeps up with the heat that turbo puts out just fine, and has done so for a long time. The person who was having problems most likely had an issue with their setup other than the intercooler.
How is it holding up for you? Leaks corrosion etc?
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