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Old 03-20-2017, 08:50 PM   #1
Dreamtribejay
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Default P0021 code??

Soo I have done a ton of research and looking for info on this p0021 code that my 6000 mile built motor keeps throwing. I can't seem to find the RIGHT answer. I've tried everything I've read about.

For some background info the motor is newly build with Manley Pistons and rods and I'm running around 400whp.

I've tried removing all filters out of my Bango bolts ( one under the turbo and one by the intake) are there any more? I've also tried replaces OCV sensor. Changed my oil with Motgul 15w40 as recommended by my builder, also checked the timing belt and that looks good. Nothing seems to be working and and can't afford to take it to the builder for him to charge me even more money. Also the code will come up when ive been driving ot awhile and a a constant speed like on the highway.

Any suggestions or info would be greatly appreciate?
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Old 03-20-2017, 09:01 PM   #2
viper_crazy
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Have you checked your timing belt? Just because a builder did it, doesn't mean he didn't make a mistake.
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Old 03-20-2017, 09:22 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by viper_crazy View Post

Have you checked your timing belt? Just because a builder did it, doesn't mean he didn't make a mistake.

I have pulled the driver side timing cover off and just looked at the belt and looks to be in great shape and doesn't appear to have jumped any teeth. But then again I really don't know what to look for. Also the car runs perfect other then the code that comes up occasionally.
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Old 03-20-2017, 09:34 PM   #4
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You'll have to pull all three covers and make sure the marks on the timing belt line up with the marks on the cam gears.
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Old 03-20-2017, 09:36 PM   #5
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Also, look on you tube for EJ25 dohc timing belt replacement to get a better idea of what you're looking at.
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Old 03-20-2017, 09:38 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by viper_crazy View Post
You'll have to pull all three covers and make sure the marks on the timing belt line up with the marks on the cam gears.

Okay I will do that in the next few days. If the cam gears are off though wouldn't it idle and run funny? Just asking because I am kinda new to these things.

Also found out the a 3rd Bango bolt on the driver side in going to remove and make sure it's clear

Thanks for all the help
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Old 03-20-2017, 09:48 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreamtribejay View Post
Any suggestions or info would be greatly appreciate?
To start, fill in your profile or at least tell us what year and model you have.
Do you have the ability to record data logs?
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Old 03-20-2017, 09:56 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreamtribejay View Post
Okay I will do that in the next few days. If the cam gears are off though wouldn't it idle and run funny? Just asking because I am kinda new to these things.

Also found out the a 3rd Bango bolt on the driver side in going to remove and make sure it's clear

Thanks for all the help
Depends how off it is. But if it's running as smooth as a Subaru should, then it might be a cam position sensor, check the position sensor plug, make sure it's connected. Could be something so simple.
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Old 03-20-2017, 09:56 PM   #9
Dreamtribejay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Subie_ View Post
To start, fill in your profile or at least tell us what year and model you have.
Do you have the ability to record data logs?

Sorry. Again I'm new and using the Mobile site so I didn't even know ypu could do that info. But it's all done now. The car is 2011 wrx and I do have a access port I can log with
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Old 03-20-2017, 10:33 PM   #10
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Default P0021 code??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreamtribejay View Post
Sorry. Again I'm new and using the Mobile site so I didn't even know you could do that info. But it's all done now. The car is 2011 wrx and I do have a access port I can log with
With the engine already warm (greater than 160* F coolant temp), start the engine and immediately start recording a log with: intake LH&RH AVCS, intake LH&RH OCV Duty, RPM, throttle position & MAF. Let it idle for 30 sec or so, then slowly bring it up to 2,100 and hold it there for 30 sec and then take it for a short general drive and post the log.
If you're referring to the banjo bolt behind the LH timing cover it is not easy to get to. You basically have to remove the front of the motor: battery, air intake, radiator, belts, power steering line, crank pulley, timing covers, timing belt & components, then the intake & exhaust cam gears and finally the rear timing cover.
What prompted the rebuild?
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Old 03-20-2017, 10:49 PM   #11
Dreamtribejay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Subie_ View Post
With the engine already warm (greater than 160* F coolant temp), start the engine and immediately start recording a log with: intake LH&RH AVCS, intake LH&RH OCV Duty, RPM, throttle position & MAF. Let it idle for 30 sec or so, then slowly bring it up to 2,100 and hold it there for 30 sec and then take it for a short general drive and post the log.
If you're referring to the banjo bolt behind the LH timing cover it is not easy to get to. You basically have to remove the front of the motor: battery, air intake, radiator, belts, power steering line, crank pulley, timing covers, timing belt & components, then the intake & exhaust cam gears and finally the rear timing cover.
What prompted the rebuild?

Okay I'll try that out tomorrow but I do not have a computer to hook my accessport up to to up load anything. Is there a different way I can get you the log?

As for the Bango bolt I though there was another right by the avcs solenoid on the left side.(like on the right side under the intake) Am I wrong?

Needed a rebuild because I spun a bearing

Last edited by Dreamtribejay; 03-20-2017 at 10:56 PM.
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Old 03-20-2017, 11:31 PM   #12
Subie_
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Default P0021 code??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreamtribejay View Post
Okay I'll try that out tomorrow but I do not have a computer to hook my accessport up to to up load anything. Is there a different way I can get you the log?
nope, not really. I can tell you what to look for tomorrow though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreamtribejay View Post
As for the Bango bolt I though there was another right by the avcs solenoid on the left side.(like on the right side under the intake) Am I wrong?
The one on top doesn't have a filter that would be too easy, right? You should have 3 total... the two red circles and one more on the back side of the RH head feeding the turbo. The red box, yeah, that's the red box of hell that you don't want to open if you don't have to. Some people have filed the head down to get enough room to back it out, but with mixed results. The job isn't too bad, just really really annoying considering the design and the effort required to get to something so simple.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreamtribejay View Post
Needed a rebuild because I spun a bearing
Did you:
make sure to open all oil galleries in the heads and thoroughly clean them out?
replace the oil cooler?
clean or replace AVCS cam gears? Here's the inside of mine after rod bearings started to go. Main bearings can be just as nasty.

When did the problem start? Immediately after installing the short-block? Who installed it?

I'd investigate electrical first. That's virtually free to check and way quicker than doing banjo filters and cam gears. Check to make sure OCV and harness pins are straight. Next look at Accessport data (refer to FSM) and after that flip to the electrical diagram section, break out the multimeter and start probing.

Last edited by Subie_; 03-20-2017 at 11:38 PM.
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Old 03-21-2017, 12:04 AM   #13
Dreamtribejay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Subie_ View Post
nope, not really. I can tell you what to look for tomorrow though.



The one on top doesn't have a filter that would be too easy, right? You should have 3 total... the two red circles and one more on the back side of the RH head feeding the turbo. The red box, yeah, that's the red box of hell that you don't want to open if you don't have to. Some people have filed the head down to get enough room to back it out, but with mixed results. The job isn't too bad, just really really annoying considering the design and the effort required to get to something so simple.

Wow yeah I was totally misinformed about what ones have filter. I checked the bolt right in front of the OCV on the right sid3 and then today the one under the turbo that goes from the block to turbo. Looks like i have some more work to do. But honestly I'm not that skilled to take all that stuff off for the one under the belt cover.


Did you:
make sure to open all oil galleries in the heads and thoroughly clean them out?
replace the oil cooler?
clean or replace AVCS cam gears? Here's the inside of mine after rod bearings started to go. Main bearings can be just as nasty.
https://youtu.be/3AwDpxrDEec

I didn't do the rebuild. I took it to a local performance shop in portage, MI. They allegedly did a new full stage 1 bottom end and re used the head but cleaned everything up. Which I did see it all cleaned up. They did do the oil cooler I believe

When did the problem start? Immediately after installing the short-block? Who installed it?

The problem started about 2 or so weeks after I got the car back.
Strickly performance in MI

I'd investigate electrical first. That's virtually free to check and way quicker than doing banjo filters and cam gears. Check to make sure OCV and harness pins are straight. Next look at Accessport data (refer to FSM) and after that flip to the electrical diagram section, break out the multimeter and start probing.
I'll do this sometime this week when I have time

The answer to all the questions are up in the gray box above

Last edited by Dreamtribejay; 03-21-2017 at 07:58 AM.
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Old 03-21-2017, 08:29 AM   #14
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I recently had this problem too. P0021 even though the engine ran great - and after swapping OCV and pulling banjo screens and doing oil flushes I pulled the intake cam sprocket and found I had misaligned it on the camshaft.

The sprocket's AVCS stuff is made of soft aluminum. There are three smaller holes and a larger hole. The camshaft dowel pin is supposed to go into the big hole. Instead, it easily went into the smaller hole and made it bigger. Not only were the AVCS oil feed passages blocked, but the cam timing was off. Yet it idled and drove just fine.

Once the sprocket was removed I managed to re-form the de-formed metal and open the oil passages. Once the sprocket was re-installed I never saw that code again, and the engine ran even stronger than before, especially at upper-mid RPM.

Get what you can from the logging; if that proves inconclusive you may want to consider pulling the sprocket; if you don't see anything amiss then these guys can clean out your AVCS:

https://www.outfrontmotorsports.com/...gear-servicing
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Old 03-21-2017, 08:37 AM   #15
RJames426
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I had this same code that would come up repeatedly on my 2006 WRX within 1500 miles of buying it.

Did a bunch of research just like you, I check all my banjo bolts and everything was good. I ended up changing my oil with some Rotella t6 and putting on a OEM Subaru filter. The dealership I bought the car from put a piece of crap filter on it, I had never even heard of the brand before.

I never have had the code come back up and it's been 27k miles.

Hope yours is something as simple as mine!
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Old 03-21-2017, 08:41 AM   #16
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Thanks for all the help guys really.

So this morning I logged the said parameters l. It's seems to be the left avcs getting pinned at 0 alot of the time as the right moves up and down? Also when I tried to keep it at 2100 rpms it would not stay and the rpms would dip?

Last edited by Dreamtribejay; 03-21-2017 at 05:59 PM.
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Old 03-21-2017, 04:18 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreamtribejay View Post
Soo I have done a ton of research and looking for info on this p0021 code that my 6000 mile built motor keeps throwing. I can't seem to find the RIGHT answer. I've tried everything I've read about.

For some background info the motor is newly build with Manley Pistons and rods and I'm running around 400whp.

I've tried removing all filters out of my Bango bolts ( one under the turbo and one by the intake) are there any more? I've also tried replaces OCV sensor. Changed my oil with Motgul 15w40 as recommended by my builder, also checked the timing belt and that looks good. Nothing seems to be working and and can't afford to take it to the builder for him to charge me even more money. Also the code will come up when ive been driving ot awhile and a a constant speed like on the highway.

Any suggestions or info would be greatly appreciate?
Recently had a similar issue on my fresh IAG Stage 2 block. Did the same things as you ie. Oil change, check timing, replaced OCV. Turned out my drivers side exhaust AVCS cam was sticking. I logged it on my access port by comparing LH and RH Exhaust AVCS. In my case I was getting P0019 which was "Crank Position Sensor - LH Exhaust Cam". Try logging it and seeing what you get on intake and exhaust if you have dual AVCS.
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Old 03-21-2017, 07:27 PM   #18
Dreamtribejay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sp3nny View Post
Recently had a similar issue on my fresh IAG Stage 2 block. Did the same things as you ie. Oil change, check timing, replaced OCV. Turned out my drivers side exhaust AVCS cam was sticking. I logged it on my access port by comparing LH and RH Exhaust AVCS. In my case I was getting P0019 which was "Crank Position Sensor - LH Exhaust Cam". Try logging it and seeing what you get on intake and exhaust if you have dual AVCS.
I will look at those next time I drive it. Juat curious was that something IAG was responsible for?
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Old 03-21-2017, 07:52 PM   #19
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I don't have "exhaust avcs" on my accessport. Mabye my year doesn't have it? It's a 11 wrx
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Old 03-21-2017, 08:11 PM   #20
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Ok well then if you noticed that it was getting stuck at 0 and the other one is moving, that is where your issue is. The code shows as the crank is off, but its the cam gear relative to the crank position if my assumption is correct. My car is a 2010 STI so the WRX could be a bit different.

No IAG's block was perfectly fine. I bought all my parts, and did all my own tear down and build myself. I cleaned both my intake and exhaust avcs gears, but the exhaust ones are more complicated and tougher to clean really well. It took me a bit to solve cause like you I researched everything, thinking the worst. My LH cam avcs gear would get stuck at times and respond laggy compared to the RH so I figured something was up. I bit the bullet, bought a new gear, swapped it out and voila, she was fixed! I spun a bearing like you and figure a bit of matrerial got stuck in there and was messing with it. It ran fairly well even with it malfunctioning, but would hesitate at certain RPM's so I knew something was up. Swapping the gear only took 2 hrs and cost $260 CDN bnib from Subaru.
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Old 03-21-2017, 08:19 PM   #21
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That being said, it could be something else as well. I'm just relating my experience as it seems similar to yours. Do what you can with cleaning banjo bolts, test OCV solenoids etc, but keep it in mind that the avcs gear could be bad as mine was. I researched it a lot, and I could only find 2 other people who had a bad gear with these codes. Most people seemed to get there issue fixed with a solenoid replacement.
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Old 03-23-2017, 02:36 PM   #22
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[quote=sp3nny;45044510]That being said, it could be something else as well. I'm just relating my experience as it seems similar to yours. Do what you can with cleaning banjo bolts, test OCV solenoids etc, but keep it in mind that the avcs gear could be bad as mine was. I researched it a lot, and I could only find 2 other people who had a bad gear with these codes. Most people seemed to get there issue fixed with a solenoid replacement.[/QUOTE


So I got to swapping the other OCV sensor so now there both new and I've driven about 100 miles now with no code!! So fingers crossed that it fixed it but if not on to checking the next thing.


Thanks you so much everyone for all the help!!
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Old 03-23-2017, 04:34 PM   #23
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So I spoke to soon😢 the light just came on again.

I did notice that after it came on it seemed that the avcs intake was reading super low like no higher them 3 on both sides when normally it was around 35 or so.

I also got a video of it after I reset the code once again. But the rpms would drop once I tried to slowly bring the rpms up? It would dip and come back up dip and come back up.
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Old 03-23-2017, 05:01 PM   #24
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Just talked with my builder and we think we're gonna go ahead and replace the left side cam gear. It seems that all my trouble is coming from there. He said that they where cleaned out when they did the motor.

Any input on this decision?
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Old 03-24-2017, 02:07 PM   #25
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When the AVCS is disassembled for cleaning, then re-assembled, a spacer is needed to ensure the parts are properly aligned. Perhaps your builder didn't properly re-assemble it? i guess you can check the price of a getting it sent out for a rebuild vs. buying a new one.
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