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Old 06-09-2021, 01:16 PM   #76
BeepBoop
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Originally Posted by Kostamojen View Post
And I see more slow vettes than slow Miatas at track days, because drivers.
Type-RAs are pigs that are also slow due to understeer. There's a reason I didn't mention them

And, luckily for us, we have ways of removing the "driver mod" from the equation. I'm thinking purely from an "all else equal" standpoint regarding twins versus other platforms. Mod for mod, an evo will kill a twin. So will basically every other sport-oriented car on the face of the earth save for a few cars like the WRX. Pretty sure even the turbo 4 brostangs, when equally modded, would do it in.
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Old 06-09-2021, 02:07 PM   #77
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Then go buy a 2022 Evo instead of a Twin.

Oh... Wait...
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Old 06-09-2021, 02:13 PM   #78
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Then go buy a 2022 Evo instead of a Twin.

Oh... Wait...
That's ultimately the point.

Is the BRZ (new or old) an amazing sports car? No. Is it almost unique as an affordably priced, focused, quasi-practical, RWD performance car? Yes.

What new car that's similarly priced offers better performance in a similarly sized package? I'd love it to offer 100 more HP, but that car doesn't exist.
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Old 06-09-2021, 02:20 PM   #79
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It's an amazing sports car given my low expectations. Is it a great value? That's up to the buyer to decide. A Supra 4 bang is a much quicker car, but it's also more money and weight and doesn't have rear seats. So apples oranges comparison.

I would like something to slot between the twins and the 4 bang Supra. There's a huge price gap there.
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Old 06-09-2021, 02:25 PM   #80
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It's an amazing sports car given my low expectations. Is it a great value? That's up to the buyer to decide. A Supra 4 bang is a much quicker car, but it's also more money and weight and doesn't have rear seats. So apples oranges comparison.

I would like something to slot between the twins and the 4 bang Supra. There's a huge price gap there.
The 4 cylinder Supra had a nearly catastrophic brake failure, almost resulting in a crash, either at VIR (lightning lap), or some other magazine's testing location. In any case, the tester's verdict was that the ****ty sliding single piston front calipers were nowhere near adequate for hard track driving given the 4T's power and weight.

I'd take a BRZ/86 with the eventual sport package over the Supra-4 after hearing about that.
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Old 06-09-2021, 02:28 PM   #81
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If Mazda would release a Miata Coupe (not the RF.. a lightweight tin top) and drop the price accordingly, it would ruin the Twins' value proposition for a track day car.
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Old 06-09-2021, 02:35 PM   #82
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If Mazda would release a Miata Coupe (not the RF.. a lightweight tin top) and drop the price accordingly, it would ruin the Twins' value proposition for a track day car.
Maybe, as a dedicated track car. Though I think the Miata is already a better track car given its bespoke suspension design, extensive use of AL, lower overall weight, and level of race support. Spec Miata has really done a lot to push the development of that platform.

Where the BRZ shines is in its sporty/practical mix. The rear seats aren't huge but small back seat >> no back seat in a car you actually use for daily stuff. I think the older BRZ (at least) looks a lot better than the Miata as well.
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Old 06-10-2021, 04:09 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by JP Chestnut View Post
That's ultimately the point.

Is the BRZ (new or old) an amazing sports car? No. Is it almost unique as an affordably priced, focused, quasi-practical, RWD performance car? Yes.

What new car that's similarly priced offers better performance in a similarly sized package? I'd love it to offer 100 more HP, but that car doesn't exist.
If the new Z comes at the advertised price and weight I am not sure that will continue to be true.
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Old 06-11-2021, 01:23 AM   #84
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It gets the tingly tingled.













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Old 06-11-2021, 06:25 AM   #85
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Look how it keeps up with that Supra!

Such sideways!
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Old 06-11-2021, 11:18 AM   #86
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Ryan Tuerk was sliding that ass
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Old 06-11-2021, 12:21 PM   #87
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If the new Z comes at the advertised price and weight I am not sure that will continue to be true.
Agreed. There's huge scope for a car that's (1) slower, (2) lighter and smaller, and (3) cheaper than a Camaro SS 1LE. The BRZ is a little down market for me, but something in that vacant space would be pretty appealing to me.
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Old 06-11-2021, 12:26 PM   #88
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While I'm not surprised it happened, I wasn't quite aware that the 2jz fits pretty perfectly under the hood of the brz/86 and swap kits are readily available...
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Old 06-11-2021, 01:01 PM   #89
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Such sideways!


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Old 06-11-2021, 02:21 PM   #90
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Wrong sub-forum, 4S-TUR.



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Look how it keeps up with that Supra!

Such sideways!
My biggest takeaway is how much better the 86 looks than the Supra.
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Old 06-11-2021, 02:26 PM   #91
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Was too slow for me. But I only really drove it in the twisties. Corners were magnificent but straight line, certainly wasn't too fast for me. It was slow and boring there.
My risk tolerance is much lower than yours. I enjoy winding a car out, rowing through some gears, feeling out the road enjoying getting a bit loose. In the RS by the time I get into the "enjoyment range" I'm well within reckless driving territory.

I'm not in a financial position right now to take it to the track either. So I'm kind of stuck in a car that I only get a taste of its potential here and there but cannot truly enjoy it anywhere.

But that's an issue with any high performing car these days. For a lot of us they're too fast for the street and too expensive for the track.

That's kind of the role I see for the BRZ/86. I wouldn't get rid of my RS for one, but if I was doing it all over again I'd think hard about what I really want. They seem like fantastic little street cars, something you can have fun in every day, and then take to the track and go fast but not break the bank.
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Old 06-11-2021, 03:47 PM   #92
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My biggest takeaway is how much better the 86 looks than the Supra.
That's because you LOOVVVVEEE Honda taillights.

NGL, I like most taillights over stock Subaru ones.
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Old 06-11-2021, 04:43 PM   #93
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I prefer the GR 86 taillights over the BRZ taillights.
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Old 06-11-2021, 05:06 PM   #94
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Looks so much better than the Supra.
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Old 06-11-2021, 10:21 PM   #95
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Looks so much better than the Supra.
Supra is ugly.
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Old 06-12-2021, 08:38 PM   #96
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My risk tolerance is much lower than yours. I enjoy winding a car out, rowing through some gears, feeling out the road enjoying getting a bit loose. In the RS by the time I get into the "enjoyment range" I'm well within reckless driving territory.

I'm not in a financial position right now to take it to the track either. So I'm kind of stuck in a car that I only get a taste of its potential here and there but cannot truly enjoy it anywhere.

But that's an issue with any high performing car these days. For a lot of us they're too fast for the street and too expensive for the track.

That's kind of the role I see for the BRZ/86. I wouldn't get rid of my RS for one, but if I was doing it all over again I'd think hard about what I really want. They seem like fantastic little street cars, something you can have fun in every day, and then take to the track and go fast but not break the bank.
+10000000000000000000

They're awesome little cars and I love the concept, but living where I do, where it's flat and everything is on the grid system, there's nowhere I could really enjoy a car like this without driving at least an hour out of town.

I'm hoping the first gens crater in value and I can pick up one cheap as a toy.
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Old 06-12-2021, 10:37 PM   #97
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I think a used BRZ Limited for close to $10k would be a great purchase if I were just going to modify it anyway. Crawford Performance engine or such, just get something strong and ready for FI, then build the suspension and body however you want. Tons of body kits and wheel options out there.
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Old 06-13-2021, 02:08 PM   #98
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My risk tolerance is much lower than yours. I enjoy winding a car out, rowing through some gears, feeling out the road enjoying getting a bit loose. In the RS by the time I get into the "enjoyment range" I'm well within reckless driving territory.

I'm not in a financial position right now to take it to the track either. So I'm kind of stuck in a car that I only get a taste of its potential here and there but cannot truly enjoy it anywhere.
Iíve heard that ďriskĒ thing for 20+ years now. Step 1, get training, IE track instruction. Enough of it to know what youíre doing. Step 2, find twisty roads somewhere in your area, in a rural type area.

I think some conjure up images of someone WFO, top speed the vehicle is capable of, carrying so much corner speed you barely make the corner with the wheels chirping. Nah. Iíd say on the track Iíll go up to 8 or 9 tenths. Probably 8/10ths. The street I never go past 7/10ths. You have to develop a different way of riding/driving than the track, but itís a blast. With radar detector, and away from the mass population you can really have some fun. My roads if I make some bonhead mistake itís me and a ditch. Not another motorist around.

If you really canít enjoy the vehicle anywhere sell it in this market. Youíll get an extra 4, 5, or 10k.
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Old 06-13-2021, 02:53 PM   #99
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Not really worth arguing about

Last edited by samb; 06-13-2021 at 07:04 PM.
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Old 06-13-2021, 03:42 PM   #100
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Then go buy a 2022 Evo instead of a Twin.

Oh... Wait...
I mean ... kind of different share of the market.

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