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Old 01-11-2003, 03:35 PM   #1
midlifecrisis
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Default Rims for winter / gravel - Will 16" RS rims fit?

It may seem obvious that the new STi will require 17" rims to fit over the four-pot Brembos. However, since the 16" RS rims fit over Subaru four-pots, maybe they fit over the Brembos as well? Any Brembo owners try this? Some of us will want / need a gravel rim / tire setup; if not the RS rim, any idea what 16s will work?

And on a personal note, if the RS rims won't work, I will be putting my spare set up for sale.

Paul
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Old 01-11-2003, 04:17 PM   #2
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I have been wondering the same thing. Also, I am wondering if we need 17" whether a narrower width would work-- I am just worried that a 225 winter tire might be too wide. a 205/50-17 is the perfect match in diameter, but does anyone know if this would be too narrow? I know they use really skinny ones in winter rallies...

Eric
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Old 01-11-2003, 04:34 PM   #3
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You're kidding right?

They are the '17" brakes' which require 17" wheels.

Glenn
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Old 01-11-2003, 05:47 PM   #4
midlifecrisis
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"You're kidding right? They are the '17" brakes' which require 17" wheels."

Thanks.

Perhaps I should rephrase the question: Since Speedline 15"x7" 2118 rally rims fit over the '16" brakes' on a WRX, I hoped there might be some potential for a 16" rim on these '17" brakes'.

Anyone know what the ProRally STi owners are doing for wheels? Are they removing the Brembos and going to smaller rotors in order to fit the Speedline 2118s, or is there a 16" option?

By the way, ewt, I would imagine that the narrower tire would probably work best on some narrower rims - perhaps the 17x7 Euro rims (the 98-01 RS had 7" wide rims with 205 tires)? If you don't have luck getting an answer here, you might try TireRack - Let us know.

Paul
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Old 01-11-2003, 06:11 PM   #5
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a friend in japan said he saw on a website over there saying the 5-spoke 16" wheels from earlier sti's wouldn't fit over the brembos... not 100% sure if a spacer could correct for this though.

the few pics i've seen on japanese homepages of of owners newage sti's have the stock 17" wheels for snow tires and something aftermarket for summer.
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Old 01-11-2003, 09:11 PM   #6
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Yeah, I think that the Subaru 4-Pot brakes are listed as 17" in Japan, but I think that some 16" wheels just clear the calipers-- I read it over at ScoobyNet. I think it is just a certain set of the 16's. though. Anyway, on the same board (sorry, I haven't searched to find the link :-) ) they also said that the Brembos were bigger, and so you would need the 17's for sure.

As for going to a narrower rim, I think that would be a good idea, but I think that clearance might also be an issue (I have no idea how close you can get to the side of a caliper.) I will definately watch this, because with the weather up here I will need some great winter tires...

Eric
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Old 01-11-2003, 09:41 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by midlifecrisis
Perhaps I should rephrase the question: Since Speedline 15"x7" 2118 rally rims fit over the '16" brakes' on a WRX, I hoped there might be some potential for a 16" rim on these '17" brakes'.

Anyone know what the ProRally STi owners are doing for wheels? Are they removing the Brembos and going to smaller rotors in order to fit the Speedline 2118s, or is there a 16" option?

By the way, ewt, I would imagine that the narrower tire would probably work best on some narrower rims - perhaps the 17x7 Euro rims (the 98-01 RS had 7" wide rims with 205 tires)? If you don't have luck getting an answer here, you might try TireRack - Let us know.

Paul
I think it is more of a width and offset issue, rather than diameter.

The 15x7 Speedline 2118s should fit over the Brembo brakes if the disc and caliper have the same dimensions as the 4 piston Subaru brakes on international STIs...

Similarly, the 16x6.5 WRX wheels should not fit due to insufficient width and too much offset.

-Jeff
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Old 01-11-2003, 09:50 PM   #8
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They won't fit. Wheels I've seen on some Subaru sites basically say either "16" 4-pots" or "17" Brembos". The STi-RA in Japan is what most rally people use, and that car still has the old 4-pot brakes on the 16" model. I have Subaru 4-pots with 2118s and have seen Stoptech/AP 4-pots, which are very similar in design, and there is no way they would fit with those calipers. The calipers are just too large length wise, they'd hit the inside of the wheel. The 16x7 RS wheels likely don't have enough spoke clearance.

Now there MAY be a 16" wheel that would fit if the spokes were shaped the right way with a low enough offset. Volk Gram lights or Rota Attacks come to mind. If I was to trade my WRX in for a STi I was going to put my 4-pots on it just so I could keep the 2118s.

The old Subaru 4-pots use a 11.4" rotor (same as US 2-pots). The Brembos use a 12.7" rotor.
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Old 01-12-2003, 12:57 AM   #9
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Thanks guys. I guess I'll be selling my my98RS wheels w/tires in the spring.

"As for going to a narrower rim, I think that would be a good idea, but I think that clearance might also be an issue (I have no idea how close you can get to the side of a caliper.) I will definately watch this, because with the weather up here I will need some great winter tires..."

I'm not sure how expensive the Volk Gram lights or Rota Attacks are, but it would be helpful to find a cheap set of rims for winter / gravel fun. If anyone else knows what rims fit over the Brembos, clue us in. Thanks.

Paul
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Old 01-12-2003, 10:37 AM   #10
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My advice is buy a spare set of stock STi wheels and put some good 17" winter rubber on.

If you are serious about playing in gravel you'd be running 4 pots and 15" wheels.

Glenn
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Old 01-12-2003, 11:18 AM   #11
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"If you are serious about playing in gravel you'd be running 4 pots and 15" wheels."

I'm not too serious I guess. As dwx pointed out, this looks like the option for Rallying the car. For me however, it's time-consuming enough to swap out the tires / rims for a day of Rallycross or cruising the backroads of Minnesota and Wisconsin. Pulling the rotors and calipers isn't worth it. Thanks.

Paul
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Old 01-14-2003, 09:13 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by Glenn Wallace
My advice is buy a spare set of stock STi wheels and put some good 17" winter rubber on.

If you are serious about playing in gravel you'd be running 4 pots and 15" wheels.

Glenn
My favourite ice tire (Hakka Q) is not available in 17". It's expensive in 16" but at least it's available.

Gravel tires in anything bigger than 15" are rare indeed.

Looks like I'll have to swap the Brembos out for smaller calipers.
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Old 01-14-2003, 09:56 PM   #13
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Japan has a nice Blizzak Ice Gripper MZ-03 in 17" sizes. From my experience the Blizzak MZ is the equal of the Hakka Q on ice, though my current favorite for snow driving is the Hakka 1.

(PS did anyone look closely at the Alaska pics and see what tires they were running? )

Also I believe the Blizzak LM-22 is available in 225/45 17 (was considering these for the Saab). They are not as good on ice, but wear longer, something more along the lines of a Michelin Arctic Alpin.

Glenn
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Old 01-14-2003, 11:08 PM   #14
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I am using Toyo Observe Garritt HT's on my current car in 205-50-16 (not an Impreza :-(. ) Previously I had Hakka Q's. While the Hakka's were better on ice, and maybe a bit better in the snow, they were worse in the rain. I was afraid of the Q rating (160km/h) as I would often cruise at 130 or 140, and I didn't like being so close to their limit all the time. So I switched to the HT's, and I really like them. And how cool is a tire that uses crushed walnut shells for traction?

http://www.toyocanada.com/products/GaritHT.html

Anyway, I wrote Toyo to ask about sizing, and the guy who responded said that there should be more sizes coming out next year. (I think it was including 205/50-17 and 225/45-17.) I would definately recommend this tire, especially if there is a mix of above- and below-freezing temperatures. It is not as squirmy as the Hakka-Q in the dry. They are listed only on the Canadian site right now, but with our crappy dollar I bet it would be cheap to import them :-).

BTW, I am a huge Nokian fan, and I agree that the Hakka-1 is the best in the snow. But another possibility is their NRW-- I have used these on an Altima and they are very good tires on both snow and ice. They are called "All Weather Plus" and I think of them as winter tires that can be driven all year. Definately worth considering for those people who have only very light snow in the winters.

Eric
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Old 01-15-2003, 07:57 AM   #15
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Well, I've got a set of 16'' 98 RS rims for my WRX, and if someone who gets an STi wants to swing by and see if they fit, let me know

Are the new STi Brembo brakes much bigger than the old STI brakes? Because it's my understanding that the older STi's came with the same rims as the 98 RS's in the US.

-tim
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Old 01-15-2003, 09:20 AM   #16
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Tim, yes the new brakes use bigger discs (12.7" vs. 11.4") and the Brembo calipers are MUCH larger than the Subaru 4-pots.

- Trent
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Old 01-15-2003, 09:33 AM   #17
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What year did the STi's switch over to Brembo's? I had thought they always had them...
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Old 01-15-2003, 09:43 AM   #18
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only the newage impreza sti got the brembos. previous models had the sti 4-pot front/2pot rear.
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Old 01-15-2003, 09:46 AM   #19
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Didn't know that, thanks for the info!
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Old 01-15-2003, 10:41 AM   #20
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I am also pretty sure that 17" and 18" Oz's will fit and these perhaps will be easier/cheaper to buy than the forged BBS wheels we are getting on the car.

I think Subaru should make the JDM non-forged 17" STi wheels available here for winter use.

Glenn
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Old 01-16-2003, 03:27 PM   #21
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Default Rota Attacks and USDM STI

Quote:
Originally posted by midlifecrisis

I'm not sure how expensive the Volk Gram lights or Rota Attacks are, but it would be helpful to find a cheap set of rims for winter / gravel fun. If anyone else knows what rims fit over the Brembos, clue us in. Thanks.
Paul
I have a set of 17" Rota Attacks. Will these wheels fit on the new STI? I dont think there should be any prob.

Thanks for any input
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Old 01-16-2003, 08:48 PM   #22
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Glenn is keeping you people well up to date on the wheel thing, but just to reinforce what has been said: it is science fact that those callipers are huge, and that many 17"s and 18"s do not clear them.

For example, among the many Volk models, there are many of the same spoke layout that will not clear, and some where the off-set is such that they will - just going on the wheel design alone does not tell the whole story (and Volk's webpage in Japan is full of asterisks and warnings about that). The same goes for BBS rims - they even made some specially for the S401 Legacy that has the STi's Brembos. The same will apply to all wheel makers, so please be careful when choosing/assuming things about wheel applications.

Hope this helps.
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Old 01-16-2003, 10:31 PM   #23
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whups i just tripped on something... there were 2 different designs of wheels for the 2.5RS, correct? do they both fit over the 4-pot sti brakes, or just the 5-spoke ones?
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Old 01-16-2003, 11:10 PM   #24
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The BMW 330xi has 12.8" front rotors and I found one 16" wheel that actually fits from Tire Rack to use for winter.
The Sti has a 12.7" rotor. I'm sure someone will find a wheel that fits, in time.
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Old 01-17-2003, 12:51 AM   #25
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Quote:
whups i just tripped on something... there were 2 different designs of wheels for the 2.5RS, correct? do they both fit over the 4-pot sti brakes, or just the 5-spoke ones?
Both GC8 RS wheels do clear the 4 pots, but the GDA (MY02-) RS wheels (aka WRX 16 x 6.5" wheels) do not.

Glenn
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