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Old 11-25-2019, 05:04 PM   #26
bizzlezx10r
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Originally Posted by HmoobDude View Post
Understood that these cars are abused, which makes the pickings very slim in terms of good used Subarus. I had considered the SI, but I'm wanting something AWD (for snow) and boosted, which doesn't leave many options.



Welp, the ad is gone so I'm no longer considering the STi. But a few post above I've linked to a bugeye WRX I am interested in.

Also, Subaru pricing in CO is definitely ridiculous and may differ from other markets. 15K for an STi that didn't look modded and with ~127k miles was on the lower end here.
The issue is that these motors aren't reliable (no matter what anybody says) There are more people with issues at low miles than people with high mileage WRX/STI's that don't. Is putting 10k down on a new one not a possibility?

I know we sound like a broken record but buying a used WRX or STI is almost the same as buying a used Hayabusa.
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Old 11-25-2019, 05:12 PM   #27
willowlee
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So my advice is to either prepare yourself to do a lot of wrenching, or save up and buy a newer car.
And alot of the time the wrenching requires $$$$. By the time you know it, you would say to yourself, i could of just bought a brand new car already. And of course, that is when you have already invested too much in the car and don't know whether to sell it or keep repairing it.
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Old 11-25-2019, 05:19 PM   #28
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When I bought my used STI I got the extended warranty to protect myself against buying a dud. 8 months later I cashed it in since it was running perfectly and I was going to mod it anyhow.
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Old 11-25-2019, 05:29 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by bizzlezx10r View Post
The issue is that these motors aren't reliable (no matter what anybody says) There are more people with issues at low miles than people with high mileage WRX/STI's that don't. Is putting 10k down on a new one not a possibility?

I know we sound like a broken record but buying a used WRX or STI is almost the same as buying a used Hayabusa.
It's not that it's not a possibility to put $10k down, but this is the psychological barrier I'm trying to overcome in aspects of debt aversion. I'm just very wary of debt at this point and I'm just not comfortable taking on more than I want to. I know this all seems counter intuitive because essentially yes, you're paying more for peace of mind with something new with a warranty vs essentially having to take on debt anyway if something catastrophic happens with an older Subaru.

And I know as most of you have said, that in the end the amount I pour into a used Subaru could eventually equal the cost if I had just bought new. This is the conundrum I am wrestling with and I do think this is more of a personality/psychological thing than perhaps a financial one, even though that is important as well.
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Old 11-25-2019, 05:32 PM   #30
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Sorry you had so much trouble with your Liberty! We bought ours new, and boy has that factory warranty come in handy over the years, although the engine has always run like a top for over 150k now. That's one reason we buy new. We've had the Liberty for 12 years now, and my Hawkeye coming up on 14 years (196k). Yes, we've had repairs, but we know the complete history of both cars. Bought a new 2016 Crosstrek about 3 years ago, and I imagine we'll run that well past 200k. If you buy new and plan for the long term, having a known quantity usually pays off.
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Old 11-25-2019, 06:03 PM   #31
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Don't get us wrong. Its not that we are against buying used subie. Its just that the car is very fragile and highly modded by owners. Not to mention alot of modders are idiots and run it without tuning or improper tuning. Last thing you want is to throw your money away. But i can tell you from experience that it sucks having to always work on a car that has problems. It sucks when you are getting ready to go to work and notice that you're leaking lots of oil. Or driving and the the CEL pops up. Or worst yet, when you are already late for an event and your car won't start.

For me, yes, the cost sucks and matters too. But its the reliability that gets me. I'm at a stage in my life where i don't have the time to keep fixing my car on my days off. Thats all i did when i was younger with my acura integra. Now that i am older i have alot of things to do, and repairing a car is the least thing on my mind. One of my biggest enemy is the fact that i fixed the problem only to discover another one a few days later. Thank god those days are gone. But i still have nightmares to this day.... My favorite phrase back then was "what the fuk is it this time?" And "shiet, where does this go?" Then its back to youtube for the remedy, lol.

Whatever you decide on, goodluck brother. Hopefully you are luckier than some of us if you do buy a used subie.
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Old 11-25-2019, 06:13 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by HmoobDude View Post
It's not that it's not a possibility to put $10k down, but this is the psychological barrier I'm trying to overcome in aspects of debt aversion. I'm just very wary of debt at this point and I'm just not comfortable taking on more than I want to. I know this all seems counter intuitive because essentially yes, you're paying more for peace of mind with something new with a warranty vs essentially having to take on debt anyway if something catastrophic happens with an older Subaru.

And I know as most of you have said, that in the end the amount I pour into a used Subaru could eventually equal the cost if I had just bought new. This is the conundrum I am wrestling with and I do think this is more of a personality/psychological thing than perhaps a financial one, even though that is important as well.
I mean at the end of the day it's going to be your decision. Wanting to not get into debt is super smart. I would atleast maybe even go to a dealership and see what your payments would be with that much money down and kind of weigh your options?
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Old 11-25-2019, 06:32 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by bizzlezx10r View Post
The issue is that these motors aren't reliable (no matter what anybody says) There are more people with issues at low miles than people with high mileage WRX/STI's that don't. Is putting 10k down on a new one not a possibility?
Lol, I would LOVE to see where you're pulling that statistic from.

Oh yeah directly out of your ass.

Cue the anecdotal evidence.
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Old 11-25-2019, 06:37 PM   #34
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My engine has been the most reliable part of my WRX.

I'm not trying to scare you away from an old WRX. But I am encouraging you to be careful in your search and to realize it takes some work to keep one up to snuff. It'll reward you with thousands of reliable and fun miles if you do that, and you're going to be hard pressed to find a better winter car. There's a reason I've held onto mine for so long.
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Old 11-25-2019, 07:32 PM   #35
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Sorry you had so much trouble with your Liberty! We bought ours new, and boy has that factory warranty come in handy over the years, although the engine has always run like a top for over 150k now. That's one reason we buy new. We've had the Liberty for 12 years now, and my Hawkeye coming up on 14 years (196k). Yes, we've had repairs, but we know the complete history of both cars. Bought a new 2016 Crosstrek about 3 years ago, and I imagine we'll run that well past 200k. If you buy new and plan for the long term, having a known quantity usually pays off.
Yep and I totally get that. Used cars are well used. I'd like to theorize that the PO was starting to have the issues I was experiencing and dumped it before they had to deal with it. Unfortunately I bought that car based off emotions and not thinking it through clearly. But I'd like to hope that I've learned a bit from that experience. But here we are looking to buy an almost 20 year old car...

Quote:
Originally Posted by willowlee View Post
Whatever you decide on, goodluck brother. Hopefully you are luckier than some of us if you do buy a used subie.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bizzlezx10r View Post
I mean at the end of the day it's going to be your decision. Wanting to not get into debt is super smart. I would atleast maybe even go to a dealership and see what your payments would be with that much money down and kind of weigh your options?
Yep, I understand in the end it's decision and most of what I'm asking for is opinions and most of it is subjective.

They are also a Subaru dealership. It may not hurt to ask to check out some of the newer models as well.
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Old 11-25-2019, 07:33 PM   #36
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Pictures for those who'd like to chime in/are interested. Unfortunately, they're terrible cell phone quality. In this day and age who doesn't have a decent camera on their cell phone?

I asked for some engine bay pictures, but I highly doubt I'll get them today and there's supposed to be a snowstorm that'll dump 12" of snow in some areas here in CO.

https://i.imgur.com/nLAy2n5.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/JoGYF5X.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/CdMZkGU.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/TbJA6nL.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/JzQoQzO.jpg
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Old 11-25-2019, 08:28 PM   #37
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Part of me worries if it's a ticking time bomb and something is bound to go wrong at some point.
If youre already thinking that way about your current car, that worry will will only get worse and turn to paranoia with an older turbo Subaru. Trust me, I know from experience. However.... Id buy my bugeye back in a heartbeat if I had the chance. Oh well.
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Old 11-25-2019, 09:34 PM   #38
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If youre already thinking that way about your current car, that worry will will only get worse and turn to paranoia with an older turbo Subaru. Trust me, I know from experience. However.... Id buy my bugeye back in a heartbeat if I had the chance. Oh well.
True... and maybe I'm trying to rationalize it, but in the event of a motor blowing/failure/etc, I would think I'd have more options with the WRX? Plenty of swaps/aftermarket/rebuilds/information online.

As for the Lancer, I haven't really been apart of the forums for awhile (I believe there is only really one and it isn't super active) and I'm not aware of much aftermarket support in terms of rebuilds/engine swaps. I recall that I may have heard that one person may have swapped in an Evo X motor, but it's probably lost in the depths of the internet somewhere.

I just think that in the event with a WRX or STi I'd feel more incline to keep it and build it vs. the Lancer and that I'd probably look to get rid of it if it came to that.
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Old 11-25-2019, 09:37 PM   #39
Dave D.
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Here's a quick loan calcuation website. Let's say you do 15k down on a 30k total purchase. Financed at 60mo. that's 263/mo. The nice thing about a 15k down is that you will never be underwater. And you can pay it off sooner if you wish. I did a 72mo. loan and paid it off in 4 years.

https://www.cars.com/car-loan-calculator/
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Old 11-25-2019, 09:43 PM   #40
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Here's a quick loan calcuation website. Let's say you do 15k down on a 30k total purchase. Financed at 60mo. that's 263/mo. The nice thing about a 15k down is that you will never be underwater. And you can pay it off sooner if you wish. I did a 72mo. loan and paid it off in 4 years.

https://www.cars.com/car-loan-calculator/
True, I can "stretch" a longer loan period but pay it off quicker to avoid interest. But then you have to factor in full insurance coverage for a vehicle on a loan. My understanding is that these are expensive cars to insure so I have thought about it.

Maybe I need to contact my insurance carrier and inquire how much it may cost if I got a new WRX vs a used WRX.
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Old 11-25-2019, 09:59 PM   #41
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Lots of parts availability on a WRX and usually pretty cheap. I've never had any trouble finding parts.
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Old 11-26-2019, 05:32 PM   #42
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Boooo. Dealership called, said after their inspection they need to replace the transmission. No information yet regarding what failure they found, whether this was the transmission with the thinner gear set (being an 02, it's possible), whether they plan to replace with a "new" or refurbished transmission or whether it will be replaced with one with the wider gear set. No word either if the cluth and flywheel will be replaced as well.

Kind of a bummer hearing that... but maybe better them than failing on me? Due to this, I won't be checking it out until Friday. Thoughts?
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Old 11-26-2019, 06:36 PM   #43
bizzlezx10r
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Lol, I would LOVE to see where you're pulling that statistic from.

Oh yeah directly out of your ass.

Cue the anecdotal evidence.
Take a gander at:

https://forums.nasioc.com/forums/sho...arranty+denial

Check how many of those posts are for stock motors under xx amount of miles. Maybe we should have a thread in regards to high mileage WRX's that haven't had rod/ringland issues. That would be a good comparison.
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Old 11-26-2019, 06:49 PM   #44
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Boooo. Dealership called, said after their inspection they need to replace the transmission. No information yet regarding what failure they found, whether this was the transmission with the thinner gear set (being an 02, it's possible), whether they plan to replace with a "new" or refurbished transmission or whether it will be replaced with one with the wider gear set. No word either if the cluth and flywheel will be replaced as well.

Kind of a bummer hearing that... but maybe better them than failing on me? Due to this, I won't be checking it out until Friday. Thoughts?
I think that tranny is just the canary in the coal mine.
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Old 11-26-2019, 07:39 PM   #45
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I'm wanting something AWD (for snow) and boosted, which doesn't leave many options.
Sounds like you have already answered your own question.

Seems like money isn't the primary deciding factor for you. Oftentimes I ask similar questions and the replies are solely money based. People tend to think with their wallets before their hearts. And you aren't asking for financial advice.

If you don't have dire financial constraints then a GD based STI is a great choice. They are solid well built reliable cars. Maybe not camry/civic reliable, but they are damn fine vehicles.

Plus you have a Miata to back you up on the occasional day that you might need to fix something. Don't be afraid of used as some suggest, just be smart.

So why STI and not WRX? You get the 6sp and r180 rear end, the better brakes and 114.3 hubs. I think you would be best served by a GD based stock sti with low miles. They are out here, and since you are in no hurry wait for the right one. An 09/10ish GR might be good to.

The GD STI can also be had with some other goodies the WRX does not have. Climate control and DCCD. The DCCD would be great in low traction conditions especially with an Iwire Spiider.

Then you have parts availability and JDM supplies. The supply is huge out there.

Soon enough you will probably tire of your Miata. I have a 99 as well. It's a great autocross car. But anything beyond that is pushing it. Anything other than local roads are taxing, and freeway/distance driving is just plain miserable.

When you sell the miata and the STI becomes your "fun" car, take the Miata money and mod the STI. Then buy a Dad car as you daily. Maybe a 4 door Tacoma.
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Old 11-26-2019, 07:39 PM   #46
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I think that tranny is just the canary in the coal mine.
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Old 11-26-2019, 07:51 PM   #47
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Plus you have a Miata to back you up on the occasional day that you might need to fix something. Don't be afraid of used as some suggest, just be smart.

Soon enough you will probably tire of your Miata. I have a 99 as well. It's a great autocross car. But anything beyond that is pushing it. Anything other than local roads are taxing, and freeway/distance driving is just plain miserable.

When you sell the miata and the STI becomes your "fun" car, take the Miata money and mod the STI. Then buy a Dad car as you daily. Maybe a 4 door Tacoma.
Hopefully on those occasions it's not during the Winter months and it isn't snowing outside. I don't think I'd be caught driving my Miata out in the snow. Not that the Miata hasn't been reliable, but I would feel better about that statement if I had left it stock and I would hope I don't tire of the Miata as I was hoping for some big plans for that one.

As for the other points you have made regarding WRX vs. STi, thanks for the input. I know the WRX will never quite be an STi, but part of me just debates that one is a softer daily driver, while the other one is more of a track oriented one.
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Old 11-27-2019, 04:41 PM   #48
pazzoduc
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I know the WRX will never quite be an STi, but part of me just debates that one is a softer daily driver, while the other one is more of a track oriented one.
I think that is really kinda hair splitting when you are talking a stocker. IMHO that draw to an STI is the shortcomings of the WRX have been addresses when you do want to move forward with mods. As far as daily comfort they are very very similar.
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Old 11-27-2019, 06:46 PM   #49
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I had a 2009 lancer for 3 years. Modded it to look like a Ralliart pretty much. Got an 02 bugeye Impreza rs NA and drove it a bit. Helped me understand the boxer engine etc. Was looking at getting an 07 STI but a 2011 with low miles came up and I jumped on it.

Just depends on what you really want man.
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Old 11-28-2019, 10:29 AM   #50
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Hmoob . . .

Given that the boosted Miata has already taken a lot of fun out of driving the Lancer, I have a feeling that any "Dad car" is going to be unsatisfying to drive with even a mildly modified STi or WRX on hand as an alternative.

The transmission issue does concern me a bit, and that's without knowing what's wrong with it or whether you're more oriented toward straight line performance/drag racing/hard street launches and harsh upshifts or more toward corner-carving, easier launches, and softer shifting.

Give some thought to how abruptly boost comes in with respect to winter driving, whether this is the difference between a WRX and an STi before you buy or between stock and "tuned" afterward. A too-abrupt transition is likely to make driving tricky under conditions where grip is lower than when it's only wet.


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