Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Friday November 16, 2018
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Miscellaneous > Off-Topic

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads. 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-13-2013, 07:18 PM   #726
etothen
Ethon
 
Member#: 221885
Join Date: Aug 2009
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Portland
Vehicle:
09 Ivory Tower
Ivory...duh

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay911 View Post
"This job would be a lot easier if you people back here would stop answering the damn phones." - my tier (fire & ems dispatch) to the calltaker tier
As is often the case, the Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy has a solution.

Joo Janta 200 Super-Chromatic Peril Sensitive Sunglasses
Designed to help the wearer develop a relaxed attitude to danger. The lenses turn completely black at the first hint of trouble, thus preventing the wearer from seeing anything that might alarm him/her.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
etothen is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Old 07-13-2013, 07:36 PM   #727
samb
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 177235
Join Date: Apr 2008
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Vehicle:
2016 Focus RS
2002 WRX Wagon

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vectors2Final View Post
That's one I didn't get to go in. The MI guys can be dicks, all high and might in there Army Fixed Wing "Good Ol' Boy Club" although he was ****ty bricks the night I brought him down. Oh, thank you, sir....blah, blah, blah.
Are they really? That sucks... I have a friend flying Dash 7s now, he's a pretty cool dude but he got in to the fixed wing side while still in flight school. Seems they wanted to bring some new blood into the club so they started sending W1s through the course a few years ago. He flew RC-12s for a few years then made the transition not too long ago. I've thought about it but I love flying helicopters so much that I don't think I could give it up. The money is good on the other side though.
samb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 07:44 PM   #728
Vectors2Final
NASIOC Supporter
 
Member#: 15553
Join Date: Feb 2002
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Austin, Texas
Vehicle:
'18 CTS-V
'18 Navigator BL/L Chroma

Default

I guess it depends on the person.... Those guys are all by themselves in Korea, so to speak. Just from my experience, they weren't too kind until I brought them in below mins.
Vectors2Final is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 07:47 PM   #729
etothen
Ethon
 
Member#: 221885
Join Date: Aug 2009
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Portland
Vehicle:
09 Ivory Tower
Ivory...duh

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by samb View Post
Are they really? That sucks... I have a friend flying Dash 7s now, he's a pretty cool dude but he got in to the fixed wing side while still in flight school. Seems they wanted to bring some new blood into the club so they started sending W1s through the course a few years ago. He flew RC-12s for a few years then made the transition not too long ago. I've thought about it but I love flying helicopters so much that I don't think I could give it up. The money is good on the other side though.
Me too, little tiny ones around my house chasing my cats.

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

hsssst....hsssst...

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

hsssst....hsssst...
etothen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 07:48 PM   #730
Vectors2Final
NASIOC Supporter
 
Member#: 15553
Join Date: Feb 2002
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Austin, Texas
Vehicle:
'18 CTS-V
'18 Navigator BL/L Chroma

Default

Vectors2Final is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 08:49 PM   #731
matt30
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 97330
Join Date: Sep 2005
Chapter/Region: BAIC
Location: California/New York
Vehicle:
2003 WRX

Default

Did anyone actually listen to the recording or just go straight to derpcon 1?
matt30 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 08:50 PM   #732
Jay911
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 50002
Join Date: Dec 2003
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Location: N5059' W11430'
Vehicle:
2013 red Raptor

Default

I didn't listen because I listen to enough frantic 911 callers every day.
Jay911 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 08:52 PM   #733
etothen
Ethon
 
Member#: 221885
Join Date: Aug 2009
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Portland
Vehicle:
09 Ivory Tower
Ivory...duh

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by matt30 View Post
Did anyone actually listen to the recording or just go straight to derpcon 1?
I listened to five min, seemed like SOP, meh.
etothen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 09:18 PM   #734
matt30
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 97330
Join Date: Sep 2005
Chapter/Region: BAIC
Location: California/New York
Vehicle:
2003 WRX

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by upnygimp View Post
Does it really matter who is calling? They're in full response mode, a call from a bystander after the fact does not matter.

You're correct in that people should never hesitate to call. But a plane crashing on the runway? Bet someone already saw it. I thought I heard that the first unit was on the scene within 90 secs and putting foam down within 120. That's just from memory, but it was pretty much as quickly as they could get there.
It might help. You know . . . actually listening to the people on the runway calling . . . so you know where they are and don't run them over. Might help just a little.

And obviously it wasn't full response. Because while the airport emergency services were there in minutes, it took over half an hour for enough ambulances to arrive--in downtown San Francisco.

The process shouldn't be scramble airport fire. Wait a while for someone to call in. Get connected to the sheriff, gets transferred to the airport, get tranfered to someone that can send medics.

Quote:
Originally Posted by etothen View Post
Manny moons ago in a former life as an emergency services coordinator I took thousands of 911 calls. When it is a 'normal' call, somewhere between say one and five individual calls reporting something you can take the time to be sensitive to their plight. When it is a mass casualty or an event being reported by a lot of people at the same time you have an entirely different set of responses based on the fact that you need to collect as much differing information as you can as quickly as you can and get it out to the first responders immediately.

As soon as it sounds the same you then ask a couple quick probing questions to see if anything is new or different than the others reports you are receiving. If not, in the interest of the victims you need to shunt the call off to someone else not involved in first line information collection to finish as you continue to cull through the dozens of calls coming in faster than you can take them. There is no time to sound or be sympathetic.

Triage, how does it work?
Really. Listen to that recording.
*click*
-Hello
-911 what's your emergency?
-There was a plane crash!
-Yeah we know, bye.
-But I'm a survivor out on the runway and there are no ambulances here and people are dying.
-Oh. My bad. Let me transfer you to someone that can actually help.

If thats the kind of "triage" you're talking about then its horrible and worse than taking 2 minutes to try and impart some kind of useful ****ing information in a sympathetic manner.

Quote:
Originally Posted by etothen View Post

Not as far off as you think, I just listened to the first few calls in the audio and it sounds like they are doing exactly what they are supposed to in an event like this one. Remember, this was seen from all over the place so you have hundreds of calls flooding into a room with just a few people receiving them, you have to get on with it and do the job, peoples life depend on your being as efficient as possible at information collection/distribution. The callers can get therapy for anything they consider to be rude or abrupt later.
12. 12 calls. 2 from survivors. Not hundreds. In a major city. And in the one case the 911 operator didn't even know about the fire/crash until they were on a 3-way call with the airport.

You know what sounds efficient? Transfering 12 call over 20 times until each 911 operator has personally asked the airport what's going on. Actually thats the opposite of efficient.

Quote:
Originally Posted by upnygimp View Post
I really think the problem comes because people are under the impression that the dispatch center (and the EMS system in general) is fully staffed by highly trained, well paid professionals. In reality, most are volunteers(pretty much limited to EMS crews) or younger folks that don't make a whole lot more than minimum wage. Many may be moonlighting and working 60+ hrs a week due to the low wages. All are trained, but they may not be at their sharpest at any given time.

Dispatchers in particular spend their day wading through bull**** and dealing with happy crews that probably have spent their day transporting and getting up close and personal with 400lb smegma coated old ladies that smell like a combination of excrement (both human and animal), BO, and untamed vagina whose chief complaint is a hangnail because they need to go talk to that pleasant nurse in the hospital who has conversations with them that they don't get to have in their dark, smelly 3rd floor walk up.

My point is that everyone's disposition is far from sunny and their tolerance is low. It's not really fair to hold them blameful for being a bit short with people reporting info that they already have. Just be assured that they're getting **** done over CAD and the airwaves that you can't observe without being part of the system. At the end of the day they do give a **** even if it doesn't seem like it over the phone.
It doesn't matter how many BS calls you go through. In a major metro city a 911 center is not going to be staffed by a handful of volunteers. And every call should be triaged appropriately. Name, location, ability to quickly determine the status of emergency services. That's basic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AllAWD View Post
So sorry that the customer service of 911 is not better, but the priority is not courtesy.

Why not learn about emergency management so you can be a little bit more informed before you make up how things "should be". The culmination of major studies and best practices from experts around the world have been collected and studied to make the FEMA ICS.

It's free to take training: http://training.fema.gov/EMIWeb/is/I...urce/index.htm

I think I took ICS-100 through 700 for a short lived job. Never used it.
Herp derp.

Did you even read your own sources?

Quote:
The personnel assigned to determine the causes of these outcomes studied the case histories and discovered that response problems could rarely be attributed to lack of resources or failure of tactics. Surprisingly, studies found that response problems were far more likely to result from inadequate management than from any other single reason.
Is that your excuse at work? I wasn't being incompetent, I was just not being courteous.

Last edited by matt30; 07-13-2013 at 09:27 PM.
matt30 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 09:25 PM   #735
matt30
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 97330
Join Date: Sep 2005
Chapter/Region: BAIC
Location: California/New York
Vehicle:
2003 WRX

Default

If you think that's the best those calls could have been handled, you're crazy.

Edit: Case in point. Airplane crashed at 11:30am, the first victim arrived at San Francisco General at 12:30. SF general is 5-10 minutes from the airport.

Last edited by matt30; 07-13-2013 at 09:30 PM.
matt30 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 09:27 PM   #736
Jay911
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 50002
Join Date: Dec 2003
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Location: N5059' W11430'
Vehicle:
2013 red Raptor

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by matt30 View Post
And every call should be triaged appropriately. Name, location, ability to quickly determine the status of emergency services. That's basic.
I am lucky enough to have never had to deal with a commercial jet crash, either on 911 or on the first responder end of things, but in my 12 years at 911/fire/EMS dispatch and 23 years as a fire first responder, I have dealt with some pretty high-call-volume incidents on both sides of the radio mic. And there comes a time when you have to stop doing full 90-to-300-second assessments on every call coming in reporting the same situation, and just say "We got it thanks bye". Not so much to get all the duplicate callers to stop, but because there's always the possibility that there's somebody 11th deep in the queue (getting the "do not hang up, your call will be answered" message for the past 3 minutes) whose husband has had a heart attack and needs help RFN. That's why you have to get all the 997 other callers reporting the big fire that can be seen for 20 miles, with no pertinent additional information you don't already have, off the phones so that you can learn about the other incidents which don't stop coming in just because a plane has screwed into the ground.
Jay911 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 09:30 PM   #737
etothen
Ethon
 
Member#: 221885
Join Date: Aug 2009
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Portland
Vehicle:
09 Ivory Tower
Ivory...duh

Default

There is now way there were only 12 calls, I would be surprised if there were only 1200 in the first 15 minuets. I have received 12 calls for an old lady that fell down in a cross walk and got up to slow, true story.
etothen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 09:49 PM   #738
matt30
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 97330
Join Date: Sep 2005
Chapter/Region: BAIC
Location: California/New York
Vehicle:
2003 WRX

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by etothen View Post
There is now way there were only 12 calls, I would be surprised if there were only 1200 in the first 15 minuets. I have received 12 calls for an old lady that fell down in a cross walk and got up to slow, true story.
12 calls from 11:29 to 11:56 a.m. related to the accident.

http://www.mercurynews.com/sfo-crash...rated-response
matt30 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 09:57 PM   #739
Jay911
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 50002
Join Date: Dec 2003
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Location: N5059' W11430'
Vehicle:
2013 red Raptor

Default

One thing you need to know is that California Highway Patrol answers cell phone calls and other 911 centers take the landline calls. Even so, as mentioned before, there's no way that there were only 12 calls for that incident. CHP might have released 12 calls as a sample of what was received, but the number is at least 100 times that, as etothen said.
Jay911 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 10:40 PM   #740
vision.dynamix
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 139955
Join Date: Feb 2007
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Boston
Vehicle:
2015 Subaru STI
17Forester / 18Crosstrek

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by matt30 View Post
And obviously it wasn't full response. Because while the airport emergency services were there in minutes, it took over half an hour for enough ambulances to arrive--in downtown San Francisco.
Didnt SFO Say they were holding Ambulances short of the scene to minimize chaos at the scene?
vision.dynamix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 10:47 PM   #741
upnygimp
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 47036
Join Date: Nov 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: On a Hill, not in NESIC
Vehicle:
10 TBHOG
94 Ferd Fteenthousand

Default

Your complaints come from a basic lack of understanding of the Incident Command System and the roles the players play. Dispatch is barely even involved, for a good reason. They need to handle the rest of the board. Just because there's a MCI at the airport doesn't mean the rest of the city stops needing emergency services. All decisions relating to the incident are handled by the Incident Commander. Dispatch's only function is to roll units to the scene. They can respond to and try to fulfill requests from the IC as far as getting more units, different units, mutual aid, etc but they do not take an active role.
upnygimp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 11:03 PM   #742
upnygimp
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 47036
Join Date: Nov 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: On a Hill, not in NESIC
Vehicle:
10 TBHOG
94 Ferd Fteenthousand

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vision.dynamix View Post
Didnt SFO Say they were holding Ambulances short of the scene to minimize chaos at the scene?
This is SOP. Victims are brought to a central triage area to be assessed. They are classified as Immediate, Delayed, Minor, and Deceased (Red, Yellow, Green, and Black). Obviously, this is the level and speed which they will need treatment. There is sometimes field triage done to identify the most immediate and speed them through the process, but the level at which this is deployed is dependent on available resources. With a large one such as this, they most likely just sent the walking over to triage and drug everyone else over. From the triage area, the immediates will be on the first rigs out. They call a few in from the staging area, load/package the patient, roll them out, and repeat the process.

A successfully run MCI is designed to save the maximum number of people. They are not designed to save everybody. If it happens, that's an awesome stroke of luck. What I mean by that is that if someone is very severely injured and unstable and unlikely to last for more than a few minutes, they will very likely be put aside to pass while efforts are focused on someone who is more stable but still in need of rapid intervention. It's a very harsh reality, but its not wise to waste resources on a corpse when they can go to someone with a better chance of survival.
upnygimp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 11:11 PM   #743
FaastLegacy
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 11671
Join Date: Oct 2001
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Default

Ok. Who cares.

Lets get back to talking about airplanes and the incident itself.
FaastLegacy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 11:14 PM   #744
upnygimp
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 47036
Join Date: Nov 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: On a Hill, not in NESIC
Vehicle:
10 TBHOG
94 Ferd Fteenthousand

Default

The pilots ****ed up. 3 people died. It may have been related to inexperience with the particular aircraft. Or maybe inexperience with landing without the modern aids found at most airports. Or maybe a combination of both.

Did I miss anything related to the incident?
upnygimp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 11:15 PM   #745
Vectors2Final
NASIOC Supporter
 
Member#: 15553
Join Date: Feb 2002
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Austin, Texas
Vehicle:
'18 CTS-V
'18 Navigator BL/L Chroma

Arrow

Quote:
Originally Posted by FaastLegacy View Post
Ok. Who cares.

Lets get back to talking about airplanes and the incident itself.
The incident is pretty much at a stand still, really. Who knows how long it will be before the NTSB makes a ruling. They are working with the Koreans to figure it all out as well. It could take a year, if not more, sadly.

Here's the scoop on the third death.

Quote:
SAN FRANCISCO (AP) The name of a girl who died of injuries suffered in the crash-landing of an Asiana Airlines flight in San Francisco emerged on Saturday.

San Mateo County Coroner Robert Foucrault confirmed 15-year-old Liu Yipeng's identity and said the girl was still in her seat when she was rescued last week. Chinese state media said she went to school with the other two victims killed in last week's accident, a pair of 16-year-old girls.

Foucrault said Liu Yipeng was transported to San Francisco General Hospital with head injuries after the July 6 crash. She died Friday morning at San Francisco General Hospital where she had been in critical condition. An autopsy was being conducted on Saturday, the coroner said.

Liu Yipeng's identification comes a day after her death was announced amid the official confirmation that one of the other girls who died in the disaster had been covered on the runway in flame-retardant foam and hit by a fire truck speeding to the crash site, a disclosure that raised the tragic possibility she could have survived the crash only to die in its chaotic aftermath.

Police and fire officials confirmed Friday that Ye Meng Yuan was hit by a fire truck racing to extinguish the blazing Boeing 777.

"The fire truck did go over the victim at least one time. Now the other question is, 'What was the cause of death?'" San Francisco police spokesman Albie Esparza said. "That's what we are trying to determine right now."

All three girls killed were from China.

Ye Meng Yuan's close friend Wang Linjia was among a group of injured passengers who did not get immediate medical help. Rescuers did not spot her until 14 minutes after the crash. Wang Linjia's body was found along with three flight attendants who were flung onto the tarmac.

Moments after the crash, while rescuers tried to help passengers near the burning fuselage, Wang Linjia and some flight attendants lay in the rubble almost 2,000 feet away. A group of survivors called 911 and tried to help them.

Survivors said that after escaping the plane, they sat with at least four victims who appeared to be seriously hurt. They believe one of them was one of the girls who died.

Cindy Stone, who was in that group, was recorded by California Highway Patrol dispatchers calling in for help: "There are no ambulances here. We've been on the ground 20 minutes. There are people lying on the tarmac with critical injuries, head injuries. We're almost losing a woman here. We're trying to keep her alive."

San Francisco fire spokeswoman Mindy Talmadge said Friday that when airport personnel reached the group near the seawall, Linjia was dead. She did not know when the girl had died.

Several flight attendants remain hospitalized.

Talmadge also confirmed that an Associated Press photograph of a body under a yellow tarp near the burned-out jet was Ye Meng Yuan.

The photo, taken from above, shows firefighters looking down at the tarp, and there are truck track marks leading up to it.

Police said the teenager was covered in foam that rescuers had sprayed on the burning wreckage. When the truck moved while battling the flames, rescuers discovered her body, Esparza said.

"The driver may not have seen the young lady in the blanket of foam," said Ken Willette of the National Firefighter Protection Agency, which sets national standards for training airfield firefighters. "These could be factors contributing to this tragic event."

He said fire trucks that responded to the Asiana crash would have started shooting foam while approaching the fuselage from 80 or 100 feet away. The foam was sprayed from a cannon on the top of the truck across the ground to clear a safe path for evacuees. That was supposed to create a layer of foam on the ground that is several inches high before the truck gets to the plane.

The victims were close friends and top students, looking forward to spending a few weeks at a Christian summer camp in California, where they planned to practice English and boosting their chances of attending a U.S. college.

Their parents were flown to San Francisco after their deaths where the Chinese consulate was caring for them.

The crash-landing occurred after the airliner collided with a rocky seawall just short the runway. Dozens of passengers were hurt. There were 182 survivors taken to hospitals, though most suffered only minor injuries.

So far, an investigation indicates the pilots, a trainee and his instructor, failed to realize until too late that the aircraft was dangerously low and flying too slow.

Nothing disclosed so far by the National Transportation Safety Board investigators indicates any problems with the Boeing 777's engines, computers or automated systems.

Also, San Francisco airport officials said that the runway where the jet crashed was reopened Friday evening, and all airlines would resume normal schedules immediately.

___
http://www.sfgate.com/news/crime/art...sh-4663308.php
Vectors2Final is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-13-2013, 11:30 PM   #746
etothen
Ethon
 
Member#: 221885
Join Date: Aug 2009
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Portland
Vehicle:
09 Ivory Tower
Ivory...duh

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by matt30 View Post
12 calls from 11:29 to 11:56 a.m. related to the accident.

http://www.mercurynews.com/sfo-crash...rated-response
No, they are wrong or you are , but that is not the call volume related to an incident like this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vision.dynamix View Post
Didnt SFO Say they were holding Ambulances short of the scene to minimize chaos at the scene?
This^^, Staging resources is necessary in an accident like this, if I was the Emergency Services Coordinator for an incident like this one of the first things I would do is look at the arterials, have the local/state police close them to non emergency traffic and start talking to the incident commander about what he had available both in terms of mobile assets but also in terms of lines of communication to and from treatment facilities.

It gets complicated in a hurry, you may have to start planing for all sorts of responses, transport for the well, the injured and the dead, getting food and drink in if a sustained response is needed, water, lighting, mutual aide, crew rotations, air assets...

The list can grow quickly and evolves constantly, it is the nature of emergencies like this to be unpredictable and find a way to break the systems you have set up to respond.

But the last thing you want is to plug up your routes of ingress and egress, if you screw this up things go to hell in a hurry, so you find a staging area where you can ship your assets in and out of as required. Oh yea, and you have to remember where all of this crap is and where it is needed. I get a headache just thinking about it.
etothen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2013, 02:28 AM   #747
kgb4187
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 35824
Join Date: Apr 2003
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by matt30 View Post
It might help. You know . . . actually listening to the people on the runway calling . . . so you know where they are and don't run them over. Might help just a little.

And obviously it wasn't full response. Because while the airport emergency services were there in minutes, it took over half an hour for enough ambulances to arrive--in downtown San Francisco.

Herp derp.

Did you even read your own sources?

Is that your excuse at work? I wasn't being incompetent, I was just not being courteous.
Your location. . . says BAIC. . . yet you think SFO is in downtown SF? It only takes. . . 5 minutes to drive 13 miles. . . at 150 mph. And you want the fire response team to wait for all bodies to be accounted for before deploying apparatuses in case one gets run over after being covered up, perhaps by a different truck?

Derp, indeed.
kgb4187 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2013, 04:07 AM   #748
matt30
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 97330
Join Date: Sep 2005
Chapter/Region: BAIC
Location: California/New York
Vehicle:
2003 WRX

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kgb4187 View Post
Your location. . . says BAIC. . . yet you think SFO is in downtown SF? It only takes. . . 5 minutes to drive 13 miles. . . at 150 mph. And you want the fire response team to wait for all bodies to be accounted for before deploying apparatuses in case one gets run over after being covered up, perhaps by a different truck?

Derp, indeed.
Dude, the distance from SF general to SFO is literally 10 miles. The size of manhattan. And both right next to the 101. Doing 80 it takes 7-8 minutes. It takes less than 20 minutes on bart.

I see we've gotten to the stage where we make up things other people never said. Cool story.
matt30 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2013, 04:37 AM   #749
matt30
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 97330
Join Date: Sep 2005
Chapter/Region: BAIC
Location: California/New York
Vehicle:
2003 WRX

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by upnygimp View Post
Your complaints come from a basic lack of understanding of the Incident Command System and the roles the players play. Dispatch is barely even involved, for a good reason. They need to handle the rest of the board. Just because there's a MCI at the airport doesn't mean the rest of the city stops needing emergency services. All decisions relating to the incident are handled by the Incident Commander. Dispatch's only function is to roll units to the scene. They can respond to and try to fulfill requests from the IC as far as getting more units, different units, mutual aid, etc but they do not take an active role.
My two biggest complaints are that, first, 911 is transferring calls to SFO when they are trying to deal with the situation. It's a waste of time. Second, 911 isn't properly doing triage. Almost hanging up on someone on the tarmac (who apparently wasn't talked to by anyone fire/medical/police by at least 11:59).

It's obvious there were problems because 60 people went missing right after the event. And by missing I mean they were wandering around the terminal until the press found them. That's forgivable because the situation wasn't expected, but the bay area needs better unification of thier communications infrastructure.

In Chicago for example city and county 911 lines are merged (they can dispatch fire, police, and medical) and the emergency management center is located in the same building for both city events (courts, sports events, ect.) and county locations (airports, ports, highways).

http://www.emsworld.com/article/1032...first-response

I may be wrong but that seems like a much smarter way of doing things.
matt30 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2013, 04:44 AM   #750
kgb4187
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 35824
Join Date: Apr 2003
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by matt30 View Post
If you think that's the best those calls could have been handled, you're crazy.

Edit: Case in point. Airplane crashed at 11:30am, the first victim arrived at San Francisco General at 12:30. SF general is 5-10 minutes from the airport.
Quote:
Originally Posted by matt30 View Post
Dude, the distance from SF general to SFO is literally 10 miles. The size of manhattan. And both right next to the 101. Doing 80 it takes 7-8 minutes. It takes less than 20 minutes on bart.

I see we've gotten to the stage where we make up things other people never said. Cool story.
Where did I make up things that you said? Whats the distance from the edge of the runway (where the crash was) to the entrance to the hospital? If they went 80 (which is illegal, since they can only go 15 over the 55 posted speed limit, not to mention going on crowded Potrero) it would still take over 15 minutes from the terminal.
kgb4187 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:44 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2018 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2017, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.