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01-06-2017, 09:02 AM | #1 | ||
Scooby Guru
Member#: 73805
Join Date: Nov 2004
Vehicle:24 TypeS ZO6 White |
2018 Nissan LEAF
Quote:
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Last edited by AVANTI R5; 06-22-2017 at 07:01 AM. Reason: Better Title for future searches |
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01-06-2017, 02:33 PM | #2 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 198376
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region:
MAIC
Location: Delaware
Vehicle:23 RAM 1500 diesel BMW ///M4 23' C8 23' |
Make sure you only lease any of these battery electrics. At these prices I might buy one for a toy See link for charts
http://jalopnik.com/newish-electric-...god-1790593342 "Second wave" electric cars- Fiat 500es, Cadillac ELRs and even Tesla Model Ss- are starting to return to dealerships after their first owners are done leasing them. Now apparently those dealerships are wholesaling these vehicles for, like, nothing. First, a crash course in how dealerships trade stock and where leasing fits in- Say it's 2016 and you lease a 2016 Honda Civic for three years. 2019 comes around, your lease is up and the dealership takes the car back. If yours was an exceptionally clean and/or desirable-spec car, the dealer might stick it on their lot for a few weeks as certified pre-owned inventory. But it's more likely that they'll pack it up and ship it, along with all the other off-lease and trade-in cars they got that week, to a wholesale auction. These auctions can only be accessed by other car dealers. They're the main source of inventory for basically every used car lot from decent independent outfits to sketchy buy-here pay-here dumps run by the mafia. This is how the car you traded in to a well-respected franchise dealer like a Herb Chambers in the northeast or Galpin Auto in the southwest end up at some potholed "Bob's Auto Sales" lot in a dodgy neighborhood near the airport. So in 2013, people leased fully-electric Fiat 500es for three years. 2016 has come around and dealerships are getting these cars back. See what's about to happen? Based on this little data sample we were shown this week, those dealerships are wholesaling low-mileage used EVs at insanely discounted rates. What you're looking at here is a screengrab from a wholesale auction listing website. Specifically from Manheim auctions, which is one of (if not the) largest wholesale automotive auction house in America. They host unfathomably large auctions of used cars in warehouses every day of the week all over the country. When I worked as a supply chain manager at a small network of used car dealerships, I would pore over lists like this to try and identify trends and good deals. Then I'd go spend tens of thousands of dollars of borrowed money at Manheim events every week hoping I was right. But you don't have to be a professional to see that the trend here is "insane depreciation." A 500e is MSRP'd at around $30,000 now. Can't imagine it was much less in 2013. Now according to this list, these cars are selling for $4,500 with just around 12,000 miles-per-year. That's like an 80 percent value drop in three years of regular usage! Is an AMG car even that bad? Of course you, the average consumer, do not have access to these prices unless, you know, you know a guy. You're going to have to pick one of these cars up from whatever bidder paid $5,000 for it at the auction and is now looking to make a profit. So what are these things selling for retail? (Autotrader.com screengrab, 12/28/16) Looks like around $11,000, which still seems ridiculously cheap for a three-year-old vehicles with below-average miles. If the dealers in this small smattering of AutoTrader listings I found in my cursory research paid the same prices we're seeing in that Manheim screenshot, EVs are looking like god's gift to used car dealers. What I'm saying is- a 100 percent markup is a lot. Wrenchman and auto writer (and |
01-06-2017, 02:52 PM | #3 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 183032
Join Date: Jun 2008
Chapter/Region:
NESIC
Location: CT
Vehicle:RWD Camry Pull me over red |
Masterauto - I have been cruising the interwebs looking at second hand leafs and the drop in value is astounding; I toyed with the idea of buying one for S&G, but my commute is going to increase next year and I can't merit buying something that won't be appropriate for my commute (eg. can't make a round trip on one charge in the winter). Maybe when these second gen's start coming off lease I'll pick one up at asteeply discounted rate, assuming the depreciation hits them as hard as it did the first gens.
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01-06-2017, 03:00 PM | #4 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 232940
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: cold
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the OEMs typically sell these off-lease EVs to company employees at the wholesale price, so yeah there are regular people out there getting sub $5000 three year old cars.
problem is, they're cheap for a reason. How badly do you want a sub 100 mile range EV when the newest ones coming out are so much better (Bolt)? and a used Model S is still pretty expensive. |
01-06-2017, 03:00 PM | #5 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 4562
Join Date: Feb 2001
Chapter/Region:
NWIC
Location: Auburn, WA
Vehicle:2014 Electric Datsun 2005 Adventure van |
The design language is not horrible looking. I don't mind the current "bloated French frog" look. But this could be a winner.
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01-06-2017, 03:24 PM | #6 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 8489
Join Date: Jul 2001
Chapter/Region:
BAIC
Location: Atherton, CA
Vehicle:2005 Carrera GT Guards |
NASIOC project: 1st gen Leaf with a Whippled LSX. Maybe Pre can donate his old one?
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01-06-2017, 09:37 PM | #7 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 82470
Join Date: Mar 2005
Chapter/Region:
NWIC
Location: The CHAZ
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$10 says it will still look like it has a poopy diaper.
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01-06-2017, 10:31 PM | #8 | |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 139693
Join Date: Feb 2007
Vehicle:Dura ngo 95 horrorshow |
Quote:
Edit: Did some digging. Nissan are being pricks to folks leasing at the end of their lease wanting to buy. They give them a stupid offer (higher than what they are going for on the open market, ebay, etc), person leasing says FU, turns it in. Then Nissan doesn't want to F with it and sells it at auction for 5k. Buyers purchase for 5k, and put it on ebay for 8k. Idiots. If they would have offered their leasing folks the damn thing for 8k, they'd make more money but this is sadly how they are doing it. Doesn't make much sense to me unless it's a tax/write-off thing that's more advantageous to the corp vs. selling them cheaper to leasing folks. Last edited by Pre; 01-07-2017 at 03:37 AM. |
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01-07-2017, 11:26 AM | #9 | ||
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 12
Join Date: Jun 1999
Chapter/Region:
MWSOC
Location: Appleton, WI
Vehicle:2018 STI Type RA Crystal Black Silica |
Quote:
Quote:
I wish the lease on my '12 Leaf lasted a bit longer as I probably would have bought it out for a cheap commuter car. |
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01-07-2017, 12:00 PM | #10 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 873
Join Date: Feb 2000
Chapter/Region:
TXIC
Location: www.testdrivemylife.com
Vehicle:2020 JEEP / RAM Datsun 71 240Z & 68 2000 |
Low priced off lease EV sounds like a winner to a great many people, but I think it was mentioned before. Like all technology products, and that is exactly what an EV is. They become obsolete in a few years. Would you buy an iPhone 4 for 50 bucks? I doubt it. In the race to making disposable cars, the EV is at the forefront.
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01-07-2017, 12:13 PM | #11 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 67807
Join Date: Aug 2004
Chapter/Region:
MAIC
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01-07-2017, 04:17 PM | #12 | |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 139693
Join Date: Feb 2007
Vehicle:Dura ngo 95 horrorshow |
Quote:
I'll have $9k in it, total for 36 months including the down payment. If I can get a buyout for 5, 6, or 7k, man this will be the buy of my lifetime. That would be 1/2 the original MSRP. Even factoring in the original federal tax credit Nissan got, a steal. But I need that Nissan rebate/credit to come back like a puppy needs a tattay to suckle on. My fingers are crossed. |
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01-07-2017, 05:16 PM | #13 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 12
Join Date: Jun 1999
Chapter/Region:
MWSOC
Location: Appleton, WI
Vehicle:2018 STI Type RA Crystal Black Silica |
Pre- I hear you on the lease rebate. Hopefully, they bring that back for you before your lease is up. It was kind of sporadic last year, but I had a number of people take advantage of it. Most people were between $6k & $9k for their buyout after the rebate.
Your battery is comprised of a number of individual cells so if one goes bad they only have to replace once cell and not the entire pack. Your battery should have a 8yr/100,000 mile warranty right from the factory. An SL has quite a few more electronics than the base Leaf so an extended warranty is never a bad idea and they can usually get you a deal on the warranty. I would do a Zurich warranty over a Nissan one as Nissan extended warranties typically do not cover the Navigation, which is crazy expensive. I had a Leaf guest that their back up camera went bad on their more basic model (without navigation) and it cost $1,600 just in parts!?! |
01-07-2017, 07:26 PM | #14 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 139693
Join Date: Feb 2007
Vehicle:Dura ngo 95 horrorshow |
Pete, thank you. Please holler at me if you hear anything on this. For me very important.
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01-08-2017, 12:46 PM | #15 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 12
Join Date: Jun 1999
Chapter/Region:
MWSOC
Location: Appleton, WI
Vehicle:2018 STI Type RA Crystal Black Silica |
Pre, I will keep an eye on it for you, but it may be different between states. I would imagine you would see something in the mail. Did you say your lease is up in April?
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01-08-2017, 02:09 PM | #16 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 139693
Join Date: Feb 2007
Vehicle:Dura ngo 95 horrorshow |
Yes sir. Unbelievable they'd rather them go to auction but it's the beginning of the year and tons of them coming off lease in the coming months....
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01-10-2017, 12:22 AM | #17 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 9481
Join Date: Aug 2001
Chapter/Region:
South East
Location: FFR Challenge #43
Vehicle:1832 Steam Buggy Wood |
The 300 mile range should be the magic number. Time will tell.
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03-24-2017, 06:11 PM | #18 | |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 139693
Join Date: Feb 2007
Vehicle:Dura ngo 95 horrorshow |
Quote:
I opted to get the extended warranty. 4, 5, and 6 year options were all within $300 of each other. Paid a couple hundred over cost for the warranty. Nissan bumper to bumpers aren't cheap but when it was explained that it's 4, 5, or 6 years starting today, not when I got it 3 years ago, I eased and went for it. So from today I have 6 years and 80k bumper to bumper. I figured at the end of the day any coming ev is gonna be 25k or more, and while they will be much nicer with much more range and features, $6700 is too good to pass up. I'd regret it. It's just a work/gym/grocery getter toaster mobile, a cheap and efficient DD. I'm out of the car game for 10-15 years now, which was my end game with the coming nannies and rising msrp's. Happy as a starved pig seeing the slop buckets coming. If I knew it would go down like this I probably wouldn't have driven it like a sports car, banging away from lights, pushing the chassis within an inch of its' life in turns every time I drive it.....but the one smart thing I did (and maybe only one )was charge to the 80% threshold in the settings, more than 90% of the time, over the past 3 years, so the battery pack is as mint as could be. I've maintained the batteries like I maintain my engines. The rest of the car, maybe not so much The one thing I've seen is people losing bars with 5 years and 60k, resulting in a new battery pack, and the owner having to foot $500-600 in labor only. When it's done their new range is 110-120 miles so I have a new video game level to beat now. I had been parking it outside in the sun, and now have to figure out how I'm gonna put everything in the garage. First world problems means some bursig stands when I can afford them. N&R community, especially the Booby pampers wearers, should be happy as I'll spend much less time on here now. Out the game yo! If it weren't Lent I'd be knocking a cold one back right now! Praise Jesus! Last edited by Pre; 03-24-2017 at 06:17 PM. |
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03-24-2017, 08:13 PM | #19 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 873
Join Date: Feb 2000
Chapter/Region:
TXIC
Location: www.testdrivemylife.com
Vehicle:2020 JEEP / RAM Datsun 71 240Z & 68 2000 |
congrats Pre, I hope it brings you many years of good service.!
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03-25-2017, 01:27 AM | #20 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 1654
Join Date: Jun 2000
Chapter/Region:
NWIC
Location: Seattle, WA, USA
Vehicle:2019 GoCycle GX MV Agusta Brutale S |
Grats. It sounds like the plan came together well.
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03-25-2017, 01:59 AM | #21 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 92634
Join Date: Aug 2005
Chapter/Region:
RMIC
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I'm pretty sure the extended warranties start at date of service. Your salesman lied to you.
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03-25-2017, 02:53 AM | #22 | |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 139693
Join Date: Feb 2007
Vehicle:Dura ngo 95 horrorshow |
Quote:
The car was sold to me as a used vehicle. There are tricks to this game that you obviously don't understand. My 6 year 80k warranty started 3/24. Salesman doesn't handle extended warranties by the way, finance does. Not my first rodeo kid. You should watch who you call liars. My "salesman" is the same one I leased it from 3 years ago so not the first time we have done some business. I don't deal with liars, just hecklers on the etherwebz it seems. |
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03-25-2017, 05:50 AM | #23 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 142447
Join Date: Mar 2007
Chapter/Region:
AKIC
Location: Not so Fair...banks
Vehicle:2019 Audi S3 |
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03-25-2017, 09:05 AM | #24 | |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 92634
Join Date: Aug 2005
Chapter/Region:
RMIC
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Quote:
Post up the terms of this warranty then. |
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03-25-2017, 10:10 AM | #25 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 139693
Join Date: Feb 2007
Vehicle:Dura ngo 95 horrorshow |
Why should I? You already called my people liars. You can do your own got damn work and look up Nissan VSC's. Find the section on gold preferred. I already told you what I got, you're just being an a$$ hole about it.
And you remind me why I need to get off these forums. You get something, then there is always someone butt hurt about it. I mean they really get some sand in it. |
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