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Old 02-17-2004, 08:32 PM   #1
ringmaster
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At the Track Lap times for STi or WRX? How fast?

Does anyone have lap times for an STi or modified WRX at tracks around the US? I am very interested to know what these cars are capable of in the hands of an EXPERIENCED driver. I am not interested in times set by track newbies or measured with a stopwatch The more info the better (driver experience, car mods, track temp, etc).

I am trying to compare the top STi lap times to other fast street cars such as 911s, Z06s, M3, etc. Any track will do as I have times for many tracks around the US, but the big track @ Willow would be great!

See you in my rear-view mirror
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Old 02-17-2004, 08:49 PM   #2
HoRo1
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Willow in a street legal WRX on R compounds - some people run high 1:30s with a stock or VERY close to stock motor. I've run an "unofficial" (hand held) 1:41.XX on street tyres (Azenis) with a stock motor and DMS 50s in a WRX. I have friends who've run 1:40.xx on Azenis and about 60 extra ponies under the hood.

I think that Gary Sheehan runs 1:32-1:33 there in his USTCC WRX. But that has quite a lot of "bits" on it. I'm sure that he'll chime in.

ZO6's in the hands of reasonable drivers (not pros) should turn mid 30's out of the box.
E30 M3's with suspension and R compounds (but not stripped) and fairly close to stock motors 1:37-1:38s
E36's should be 2-3 seconds quicker with similar types of mods
E46's should be lapping in the low 30s with similar mods.

All the above goes right out the window when you get stripped cars with race suspensions and race motors. Anything that started life as a low volume production street car that has been converted to outright race spec should be below about 1:26.

996's should run high 20s - if they're brave on street rubber.

Try looking at websites of drivers groups etc
www.speedventures.net has times relating to tracks all over Ca and the US.

What makes you quick at Willow is horsepower, balls and a car that get through turn 2 fast...Oh, and don't screw up 9. WRX's don't have the horsepower and don't like going through 2 very fast. I suspect that STis might have similar trouble in 2.

Edit again
Another thing about Willow is that the time of year can be crucial to fast times. It gets very hot there and on many days it becomes VERY windy. Good luck with the STi...I expect to see sub 38s!

Last edited by HoRo1; 02-18-2004 at 12:01 AM.
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Old 02-17-2004, 11:51 PM   #3
Bart
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taken from Evo forums

"was out at Big track Willow today with the Vipers....i ran a 1:35.42 and Eric ran a 1:34.94 on street tires today...not to bad for a pretty much stock EVO....the car really started to push.....need sway bar"

and "Eric didn't do anything......i put a HKS intake, downpiple and cat back i bought at Super AutoBac....it was factory settings on the alignment and OEM tires....it was pushing bad there after about 5 runs......Eric had me put more air in the rear tires and that helped.......Oh and i took the antenna off ...that may have made us quicker"

and then "i was using stock pads....geez...everyone keeps asking me what i changed on the car....i put a HKS intake, downpipe and cat back....the OEM cat is still on there...thats all i did....i only got the car a week ago....."

and now i'll shut up and wait to hear STi times
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Old 02-18-2004, 02:03 AM   #4
tcarter
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2002 WRX
Koni inserts
Eibach springs
24mm rear sway
Cobb flash on the ecu
Turbo back exhaust
R compound tires
Stock brakes
I might be getting about 240 at the crank maybe a bit more.
Stock boost

1:46's all day long at Road Atlanta.
1:50's at Road Atlanta on 225/45/17 Sumotomo HTRZ's and stock springs/struts

Need more info?

Email me at [email protected]

I have many more mods coming (brakes mainly)
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Old 02-18-2004, 02:28 AM   #5
GarySheehan
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An STi recently did a mid 1:54 at Sears Point on Hoosiers.

Example:

http://www.teamsmr.com/movies/Street...CCWRXSmall.wmv

Gary
Sheehan Motor Racing
www.teamSMR.com
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Old 02-18-2004, 08:54 AM   #6
sdecker
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One of my buddies is an instructor for the Panoz Racing School here at Road Atlanta (PM if you need more detail). His 02 WRX had:

Tein Flex (poorly adjusted, IMHO) plus EDFC
Pirelli P-Zero Nero's on 18" SSR Comps
Cusco RSB set to 26mm with a set of solid endlinks
Cusco FSB (21mm I think)
Turboback exhaust and uppipe with *no engine management*

He went 1:46 - 1:47 on those street tires very consistently, and really didn't get too many laps to dial in the coilovers. IMHO they were way too mushy when I drove the car and he could have easily dropped another second or two. Add Hoosiers to those properly tweaked coilovers and he could have been down in 1:42 territory or better, I'm thinking.

However, this may be an unfair comparison because of his job. He probably has 10,000 laps or more at Road Atlanta and knows every crack in the pavement...

(edited to add parts I forgot)

Scott

Last edited by sdecker; 02-18-2004 at 02:46 PM.
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Old 02-18-2004, 11:44 AM   #7
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WRXs with good street tires, springs/shocks and basic power mods at TWS run around 2:08 or so.

stock z06s can get around in 1:58
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Old 02-18-2004, 11:46 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by HoRo1

ZO6's in the hands of reasonable drivers (not pros) should turn mid 30's out of the box.
E46's should be lapping in the low 30s with similar mods.

eh?
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Old 02-18-2004, 02:31 PM   #9
ringmaster
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Quote:
Originally posted by HoRo1
ZO6's in the hands of reasonable drivers (not pros) should turn mid 30's out of the box.
E36's should be 2-3 seconds quicker with similar types of mods
E46's should be lapping in the low 30s with similar mods.
996's should run high 20s - if they're brave on street rubber.

I think this is a bit mixed up. A Z06 should run in the low 30s, but the E46 M3 will not be as fast. Also, unless the 996 is a GT2 or GT3 it isn't going to be faster than the Z06.

I would hope an STi with a couple of goodies and sticky tires would be able to run in the 1:32 - 1:34 range @ Willow?
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Old 02-18-2004, 02:32 PM   #10
tcarter
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I wish I had an STI to see how fast I could run at Road Atlanta.
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Old 02-18-2004, 02:47 PM   #11
sdecker
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Quote:
Originally posted by tcarter
I wish I had an STI to see how fast I could run at Road Atlanta.
Yeah. Me too, buddy.
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Old 02-18-2004, 02:53 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by ringmaster
I think this is a bit mixed up. A Z06 should run in the low 30s, but the E46 M3 will not be as fast. Also, unless the 996 is a GT2 or GT3 it isn't going to be faster than the Z06.

I would hope an STi with a couple of goodies and sticky tires would be able to run in the 1:32 - 1:34 range @ Willow?
I would expect an STI with some minor power mods and race rubber could stay with a street tire z06 around many courses
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Old 02-18-2004, 03:09 PM   #13
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Just to put things in perspective...Last years Speed World Challenge touring car fastest qualifier at Road Atlanta was Kleinubing's Acura RSX-S running 1:37.499

No comparison to street car but interesting still.
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Old 02-18-2004, 04:09 PM   #14
tcarter
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Quote:
Originally posted by BriDrive
Just to put things in perspective...Last years Speed World Challenge touring car fastest qualifier at Road Atlanta was Kleinubing's Acura RSX-S running 1:37.499

No comparison to street car but interesting still.
Yeah. Those cars are a bit more 'sorted' than most street cars.
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Old 02-18-2004, 05:14 PM   #15
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But they were on shaved street tires (Toyo T1-S), and have marginally less power than a stock STi. The lap imes will drop 3+ sec/lap at Road Atlanta on the RA1's in '04.
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Old 02-18-2004, 05:43 PM   #16
briank
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This is one internet resource that is sorely lacking. I wish there was a registry / database where everyone could put in their best lap time at a list of tracks around the world, car, model ,year, mods, weather and any other pertinant info.

Then you could do searches and sort the data by any of these fields (SQL database?).

I did find a site at one point that was not dynamic like this and had very little participation.

If there was a site that was this flexible, it would be an awesome resource to see what the fastest track cars really are and what mods make the biggest difference for each car. I think it would be really popular. So who wants to work on this with me? I can probably host it.

Or better yet? Is there such a site in existance?

-BrianK
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Old 02-18-2004, 06:00 PM   #17
Penguinking
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at roebling road a modified wrx (stg4 equivalent, falken azenis tires) ran a 1:29, but i was maintaining speed on the straightaway - if i were driving balls to the wall it'd probably be around 1:27-1:28 even.
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Old 02-18-2004, 06:43 PM   #18
BriDrive
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The problem is his question...its too subjective...who's experienced, a guy who's slow but done 50 track days or a rookie first timer who's a natural.
For example, at road atlanta, I've seen wrx times for a guy named todd carter in 2003 who ran a 1:49 on 225/45/17 Sumotomo HTRZ street tires...I've seen times above 2:00
It's just too hard to say with any accuracy or correlation...
Generally, I think on most road courses I would rank the cars something like this(at least at road atlanta, highspeed track):
#1 Chevy Z06
#2/#3 Porsche 911 very close to E46 M3 -1~2 seconds
#4 STI or Evo8 - 3~5seconds
#6 WRX - 6~10 seconds
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Old 02-18-2004, 06:55 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by briank
This is one internet resource that is sorely lacking. I wish there was a registry / database where everyone could put in their best lap time at a list of tracks around the world, car, model ,year, mods, weather and any other pertinant info.

Then you could do searches and sort the data by any of these fields (SQL database?).

I did find a site at one point that was not dynamic like this and had very little participation.

If there was a site that was this flexible, it would be an awesome resource to see what the fastest track cars really are and what mods make the biggest difference for each car. I think it would be really popular. So who wants to work on this with me? I can probably host it.

Or better yet? Is there such a site in existance?

-BrianK
I have found a car specific (S2000) site. That was last year sometime. I don't know if it is still up. No user participation. from memory, what it had was the track, date, driver name, lap time, weather (general, not detailed), major performance mods. and timing system used (hand held - least accurate, HotLap or similar - fairly accurate, transponder - most accurate). It was very interesting to look at.

So, who wants to start a primarily Subaru, but not just Subaru, data base? All we need is the above info and a search function. I suppose I could help somebody if necessary - but be warned, email and NABISCO postings are about the limit of my skills.
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Old 02-18-2004, 08:50 PM   #20
sdecker
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I'm definitely in. My driving skills are lacking, but I attend a lot of track days...so maybe I can help, particularly at Road Atlanta since it's right next door. I can poll all the owners I see there, so some of the results might be, ummm... 'less correct' than we would like, but it's a start.

Let me know how I can help.

Scott
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Old 02-18-2004, 10:06 PM   #21
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Did someone say track day

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Old 02-18-2004, 10:12 PM   #22
briank
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Quote:
Originally posted by BriDrive
The problem is his question...its too subjective...who's experienced, a guy who's slow but done 50 track days or a rookie first timer who's a natural.
That's why you need a large samples of drivers and lots of participation in the database. I'm no noob and I'm well aware that the driver has a lot to do with the lap time. There just doesn't seem to be a single resource with enough track times.

www.corner-carvers.com is a good example of what I've found out there. Just a few entries per track and not very useful in determining anything but that driver's skill.

We need a website that has a dynamic database with search and then promote it on all the forums where track rats hang out.

-BrianK
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Old 02-18-2004, 11:50 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by sdecker
I'm definitely in. My driving skills are lacking, but I attend a lot of track days...so maybe I can help, particularly at Road Atlanta since it's right next door. I can poll all the owners I see there, so some of the results might be, ummm... 'less correct' than we would like, but it's a start.

Let me know how I can help.

Scott
what times do you normally put down at RA?
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Old 02-18-2004, 11:54 PM   #24
Penguinking
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speedventures has a WRX challenge group that runs time trials - this page has the results from various races, wrx's included. click on the race to expand the results and you'll see some wrx times in there

http://www.speedventures.net/track_records_db.asp
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Old 02-19-2004, 12:01 AM   #25
tcarter
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Quote:
Originally posted by BriDrive

For example, at road atlanta, I've seen wrx times for a guy named todd carter in 2003 who ran a 1:49 on 225/45/17 Sumotomo HTRZ street tires...I've seen times above 2:00
Hey.. that's me!!!

I run 1:46's with race rubber and the koni inserts with eibach springs.
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