2025 Subaru WRX tS Has Something We Wish the BRZ tS Had

[20WRX20]

Originally Posted by Kostamojen

The GT, TR and tS won't be $30k cars in 3 years either. Depreciation is back to normal.

Depreciation on Subarus is way better than a Tesla.

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[mcarb002]

Originally Posted by 20WRX20

Now you’re taking what I said out of context. I said a manual is better suited to a car you don’t drive every day.

So what you’re saying is people should buy the CVT? Haha lol

[20WRX20]

People should never buy a CVT if they can help it.

So I just drove my VA in about 9” of snow. The car really, really needs a lockable center diff and LSDs front and rear. Full stop. There is no substitute for this hardware. If you’ve ever driven an STi in snow with snow tires you’ll know what I’m talking about.

The fact that Subaru is now charging nearly 50k for a WRX without this stuff is truly mind boggling. I just don’t understand why they can’t at least offer the LSDs as part of the tS package. Such a sad state of affairs.

[D-Rodman]

When hardly any other vehicles were on the road and over a foot of snow on the ground I was able to drive my 2005 Saabaru, a wrx wagon on winter sport tires, no problem. Near my house in Missouri there is a very steep hill that would get very icy and people would try and drive up only to end up sideways. I’d climb right up no problem on my Saabaru and my 08 Outback with Continental dws tires. Subaru awd is amazing.


Sent from my iPhone using NASIOC

[20WRX20]

I’m not saying you can’t do it, I’m just saying the whole experience is 1000x better with that STi drivetrain. It’s still fun in the WRX but for 50k I’d expect LSDs front and rear at minimum. Every WRX tS competitor offers this.

[mcarb002]

So you went from ranting about the WRX manual=should be only for weekends->but wrx is not a corvette or Porsche=wrx not a good weekend car. And now saying no LSD for 50k is a joke as every other car offers it=wrx will be crap in the snow. Yet half of the other cars are fwd or biased AWD systems hahaha lol trust me, if those are going to be fine on the snow, so is this WRX without LSD. Now tell me, which of those other 45-50k cars that have the LSD have 6pot front and 2pot rear Brembos? That to me is more important…

[Snow Drift]

WRX has always been a beast in the snow. I've had 05 w/ rear LSD, 08 & 11 with VDC and 18 STI. The STI is on another level, but that's more for fun than anything.

Yes, part time systems work too. For the mountains, I would take a WRX with snow tires over any other car in the snow (not talking about STI). Rear LSD or not. It is the center differential that matters the most.

[20WRX20]

Originally Posted by mcarb002

So you went from ranting about the WRX manual=should be only for weekends->but wrx is not a corvette or Porsche=wrx not a good weekend car. And now saying no LSD for 50k is a joke as every other car offers it=wrx will be crap in the snow. Yet half of the other cars are fwd or biased AWD systems hahaha lol trust me, if those are going to be fine on the snow, so is this WRX without LSD. Now tell me, which of those other 45-50k cars that have the LSD have 6pot front and 2pot rear Brembos? That to me is more important…

First of all, I never said a WRX manual should only be for weekends.

Second, the S3, Golf R, and GRC are all cheaper than this ridiculously half-assed tS and have a much better drivetrain setup. They all have either an LSD or a diff that can split power between wheels (side to side.) The tS, for $50,000, relies on traction control to move power around side to side like it’s the late 1990s.

Brembos are 100% unnecessary for street duty, are noisy, and cost a fortune to maintain. Those I can live without, but as someone who uses their WRX in deep snow in mountainous terrain, I want the extra drivetrain hardware to back up the $50,000 price tag.

What’s going to happen is nobody is going to buy these with the price increases, sales will fall off, and Subaru will axe the car in another 2-3 years citing lack of demand. I guess this is all by design. They needed a reason to kill the car off, well they’re going to get it.

[SoDealer]

Originally Posted by 20WRX20

First of all, I never said a WRX manual should only be for weekends.

Second, the S3, Golf R, and GRC are all cheaper than this ridiculously half-assed tS and have a much better drivetrain setup. They all have either an LSD or a diff that can split power between wheels (side to side.) The tS, for $50,000, relies on traction control to move power around side to side like it's the late 1990s.

Brembos are 100% unnecessary for street duty, are noisy, and cost a fortune to maintain. Those I can live without, but as someone who uses their WRX in deep snow in mountainous terrain, I want the extra drivetrain hardware to back up the $50,000 price tag.

What's going to happen is nobody is going to buy these with the price increases, sales will fall off, and Subaru will axe the car in another 2-3 years citing lack of demand. I guess this is all by design. They needed a reason to kill the car off, well they're going to get it.

Do you not listen or do you only listen to the bits you like? Subaru is actively killing the car. It has had an end date since before it went on sale. They are not going to put any money into the car before it dies. They got caught out by the emissions penalties and are going to taper the car into nothing regardless of demand. Subaru has never missed the mark on a WRX and not course corrected it in short order until now. Why? because there's no ROI with the emissions penalties. It is going to ride into the sunset very much like it is now and more low end trim levels will get the axe before it does. No amount of kvetching is going to change that. You're wasting your time and breath.

[20WRX20]

Originally Posted by SoDealer

Do you not listen or do you only listen to the bits you like? Subaru is actively killing the car. It has had an end date since before it went on sale. They are not going to put any money into the car before it dies. They got caught out by the emissions penalties and are going to taper the car into nothing regardless of demand. Subaru has never missed the mark on a WRX and not course corrected it in short order until now. Why? because there's no ROI with the emissions penalties. It is going to ride into the sunset very much like it is now and more low end trim levels will get the axe before it does. No amount of kvetching is going to change that. You're wasting your time and breath.

What “emissions penalties” did Subaru get fined with recently? Do you have any proof of this? Or are you referring to the CAFE penalties that tripled when the VB was released? Either way, there’s still no excuse for not adding LSDs to this car.

Can’t wait for the inevitable 2028 “WRX STi-e” crossover.

[mcarb002]

Originally Posted by 20WRX20

First of all, I never said a WRX manual should only be for weekends.

Second, the S3, Golf R, and GRC are all cheaper than this ridiculously half-assed tS and have a much better drivetrain setup. They all have either an LSD or a diff that can split power between wheels (side to side.) The tS, for $50,000, relies on traction control to move power around side to side like it’s the late 1990s.

Brembos are 100% unnecessary for street duty, are noisy, and cost a fortune to maintain. Those I can live without, but as someone who uses their WRX in deep snow in mountainous terrain, I want the extra drivetrain hardware to back up the $50,000 price tag.

What’s going to happen is nobody is going to buy these with the price increases, sales will fall off, and Subaru will axe the car in another 2-3 years citing lack of demand. I guess this is all by design. They needed a reason to kill the car off, well they’re going to get it.

first of all, you basically did..

Originally Posted by 20WRX20

The manual isn’t even that good in the WRX. Autos are better nowadays anyway, especially in a DD. For a fun weekend car yes, give me the manual, but the WRX isn’t even close to being a weekend car.

Originally Posted by 20WRX20

Now you’re taking what I said out of context. I said a manual is better suited to a car you don’t drive every day.

you're saying that manuals should be for weekend cars not dd, and that WRX sucks as a weekend car as it's not a Corvette or Porsche you can look at a parking lot and say "wow nice car"...because an S3, Golf R, and GRC are weekend cars that would have the opposite effect than the WRX


My question to you is, if this is your rhetoric, then why tf do you own a POS like a 2020 WRX? Did you have an epiphany after you bought it? Or do you drive the CVT as your dd and have a Porsche in your garage? LULZZZ
why didn't you get a better car at that price point in 2020? Are you telling me you'd buy this tS if it had LSD? PUHHHLEASE GTFO..





secondly, stop it, the S3 and Golf R are more expensive at MSRP and will be hard pressed to get them at MSRP, the base 48K MSRP S3 lacks adaptive dampeners and it's $1700 option just to add freaking adaptive cruise control, they'll also be an arm and a limb to maintain, less reliable, depreciate way more, higher insurance probably, and lord knows dealer markups on all 3 of the cars you mentioned. Not to mention the S3 and GRC you'd be lucky to fit people in the back. By the way my local Subaru dealer offers 0.9% financing for a 24' WRX, good luck getting that from Audi/VW/Toyota. I already went over how you compromise with all these cars. How a WRX tS at 45K+ a stage 2 tune would easily equal/surpass these cars in HP with equal or better OTD price with big break kit, STI tuned adaptive dampeners, and adaptive cruise control to boot

By the way, remember that VB WRX has been tested and the 271 hp is at the wheels, at the crank it's like 300hp.


Better drive train? Like how the GRC goes on limp mode and overheats if you go over 80 and more than 2 laps around a track




I love how you think that Brembos are overkill for the street but LSD is A MUUUUUST specially in an AWD car...LOL

[mcarb002]

Originally Posted by SoDealer

Do you not listen or do you only listen to the bits you like? Subaru is actively killing the car. It has had an end date since before it went on sale. They are not going to put any money into the car before it dies. They got caught out by the emissions penalties and are going to taper the car into nothing regardless of demand. Subaru has never missed the mark on a WRX and not course corrected it in short order until now. Why? because there's no ROI with the emissions penalties. It is going to ride into the sunset very much like it is now and more low end trim levels will get the axe before it does. No amount of kvetching is going to change that. You're wasting your time and breath.

I imagine this tS will be just a 25MY trim.
What else can Subaru do with this WRX until what? 2027/28? Which I presume will be the MY where they either axe it or next gen.

[20WRX20]

Originally Posted by mcarb002

first of all, you basically did..









you're saying that manuals should be for weekend cars not dd, and that WRX sucks as a weekend car as it's not a Corvette or Porsche you can look at a parking lot and say "wow nice car"...because an S3, Golf R, and GRC are weekend cars that would have the opposite effect than the WRX


My question to you is, if this is your rhetoric, then why tf do you own a POS like a 2020 WRX? Did you have an epiphany after you bought it? Or do you drive the CVT as your dd and have a Porsche in your garage? LULZZZ
why didn't you get a better car at that price point in 2020? Are you telling me you'd buy this tS if it had LSD? PUHHHLEASE GTFO..





secondly, stop it, the S3 and Golf R are more expensive at MSRP and will be hard pressed to get them at MSRP, the base 48K MSRP S3 lacks adaptive dampeners and it's $1700 option just to add freaking adaptive cruise control, they'll also be an arm and a limb to maintain, less reliable, depreciate way more, higher insurance probably, and lord knows dealer markups on all 3 of the cars you mentioned. Not to mention the S3 and GRC you'd be lucky to fit people in the back. By the way my local Subaru dealer offers 0.9% financing for a 24' WRX, good luck getting that from Audi/VW/Toyota. I already went over how you compromise with all these cars. How a WRX tS at 45K+ a stage 2 tune would easily equal/surpass these cars in HP with equal or better OTD price with big break kit, STI tuned adaptive dampeners, and adaptive cruise control to boot

By the way, remember that VB WRX has been tested and the 271 hp is at the wheels, at the crank it's like 300hp.


Better drive train? Like how the GRC goes on limp mode and overheats if you go over 80 and more than 2 laps around a track




I love how you think that Brembos are overkill for the street but LSD is A MUUUUUST specially in an AWD car...LOL

Look, I respect your opinion, but I didn’t say anywhere that a WRX should be a weekend car. If there’s a community college nearby you should sign up for ENGL 101 or something similar. I’m not going to pick apart your word barf that is written at a 4th grade level. Good luck with whatever it is that you do, I’m sure you’re doing quite well for yourself with your expert analytical abilities.

[20WRX20]

Originally Posted by mcarb002

I imagine this tS will be just a 25MY trim.
What else can Subaru do with this WRX until what? 2027/28? Which I presume will be the MY where they either axe it or next gen.

It’ll probably get axed for an electric model in 2028 (that’s the rumor anyway.) There’s really not much more they can do with it. The transmission is maxed out at the current levels, so they can’t even offer a factory warranted tune/hp upgrade. Subaru did everything with the brakes/suspension already. The diffs (for whatever reason) clearly aren’t getting upgraded. Appearance they (for whatever reason) refuse to change. It’s going to be take it or leave it (with price increases every year) until the next gen.

[mcarb002]

Originally Posted by 20WRX20

Look, I respect your opinion, but I didn't say anywhere that a WRX should be a weekend car. If there's a community college nearby you should sign up for ENGL 101 or something similar. I'm not going to pick apart your word barf that is written at a 4th grade level. Good luck with whatever it is that you do, I'm sure you're doing quite well for yourself with your expert analytical abilities.

Well, I guess if we can find some common ground with our analytic abilities is that, at the end of the day, it just depends on everyone's unique situation.



We have a Model Y which my wife uses to commute. We take it to the city for a weekend if we wanna go for a short family outing. It's super fast, but I drive it and it's like I'm not even there. I don't close the door, step out of it, and continue thinking about it and itching to drive it again. It's a soulless vehicle that I could care less about. I work from home, don't have to commute other than your common errands. So most of my time in a vehicle is spent like this week where we're going for a roadtrip. Minivan is absolutely perfect for all of this. So, yeah, it leaves me desiring a "me" toy car. Do I need one? Absolutely not, like most of the crap we all have. But what I do know is I'm itching to roll some gears again. I'm in a position where it would be my second vehicle so there's more flexibility. But if I wanted to have the latest nannies and fast vehicle, sure the WRX is a dinosaur. But then if I decide to ditch manual, I might as well go for bigger and better things, RS3 or screw it, wait for my 40th and treat myself to an M3 and forget about it.

My point is, in general, from my perspective and situation, I don't see superior options to what I initially want, AWD manual. GRC is an egg on wheels that I simply don't like. Other manuals are not AWD. So yeah, I guess either chill for the fun of rolling gears, or wait a little and go big. Guess time will tell.

[SoDealer]

Originally Posted by 20WRX20

What “emissions penalties” did Subaru get fined with recently? Do you have any proof of this? Or are you referring to the CAFE penalties that tripled when the VB was released? Either way, there’s still no excuse for not adding LSDs to this car.

Can’t wait for the inevitable 2028 “WRX STi-e” crossover.

Duh. CAFE and GHG. They ramp by model year. They've already killed the WRX margins. GHG is by carline and CAFE is for the brand. WRX is a liability for SBR. It went from high per unit profit to a drag on the entire company. SBR has WRX in a chokehold and is quietly telling it to go to sleep. No amount of whining and crying from someone on a forum is going to change that. by the time WRX is put out to pasture, it will be looking at +$20k in per unit penalties. SBR isn't having any of that.

[chanomatik]

Originally Posted by SoDealer

Do you not listen or do you only listen to the bits you like? Subaru is actively killing the car. It has had an end date since before it went on sale. They are not going to put any money into the car before it dies. They got caught out by the emissions penalties and are going to taper the car into nothing regardless of demand. Subaru has never missed the mark on a WRX and not course corrected it in short order until now. Why? because there's no ROI with the emissions penalties. It is going to ride into the sunset very much like it is now and more low end trim levels will get the axe before it does. No amount of kvetching is going to change that. You're wasting your time and breath.

Yeah, they priced it out of consideration for me. The tS would be my preferred model, but not at what they're asking. Back in the day I could see myself paying $35k-$38k for a WRX tS.

At these prices, I'm considering used Caymans or other used sports car offerings. Possibly a MkIV Supra too. :shrug:

[20WRX20]

Originally Posted by mcarb002

Well, I guess if we can find some common ground with our analytic abilities is that, at the end of the day, it just depends on everyone's unique situation.



We have a Model Y which my wife uses to commute. We take it to the city for a weekend if we wanna go for a short family outing. It's super fast, but I drive it and it's like I'm not even there. I don't close the door, step out of it, and continue thinking about it and itching to drive it again. It's a soulless vehicle that I could care less about. I work from home, don't have to commute other than your common errands. So most of my time in a vehicle is spent like this week where we're going for a roadtrip. Minivan is absolutely perfect for all of this. So, yeah, it leaves me desiring a "me" toy car. Do I need one? Absolutely not, like most of the crap we all have. But what I do know is I'm itching to roll some gears again. I'm in a position where it would be my second vehicle so there's more flexibility. But if I wanted to have the latest nannies and fast vehicle, sure the WRX is a dinosaur. But then if I decide to ditch manual, I might as well go for bigger and better things, RS3 or screw it, wait for my 40th and treat myself to an M3 and forget about it.

My point is, in general, from my perspective and situation, I don't see superior options to what I initially want, AWD manual. GRC is an egg on wheels that I simply don't like. Other manuals are not AWD. So yeah, I guess either chill for the fun of rolling gears, or wait a little and go big. Guess time will tell.

Keep the Y as the commuter and then get something really nice. At 50k you have a lot of options, especially when you factor in the used market. Going to 60k (only 10k more!) really opens up some good cars. Have you looked at the M2? That’s a lot of car for 62k. There’s also CT4-V Blackwing. Working remote is nice because you don’t have to destroy your car commuting everyday.

I bought my WRX as a commuter. Cars get destroyed commuting by road salt, idiot drivers, ****ty roads, etc. so my theory with daily drivers is to buy something fun but cheap and then run it into the ground. Sport compacts fall into this category since they are relatively cheap to purchase, maintain, and operate. It does suck how the Premium is almost 40k now but when you factor in inflation it isn’t terrible. I do not see much value in the higher trims, especially tS, for what you get.

[OldBlu]

Sorry to be late to the 2025 pricing discussion, but I don't know how the biggest loyalists could even defend this pricing. You'd be stupid not to pick up a 2024 if you think the WRX is God's gift to humanity. And then once the new 2024's are dried up, you'd be crazy not to consider a used model over a 2025 with how these are depreciating.

Heck. In my area you can get a certified 2024 with no miles on it for under $30k. And even if you must have a new car with brembos, how you could you pass up a TR for $40k?

Forget the competition. Subaru won't even be able to compete with the 2024s and used WRXs they already have on the lot.

It's wild to me that they've cut the base model and basically increased the starting price by $4k without a refresh. If they at least fixed the black cladding, I could see some buyers valuing the upgrade, but there's nothing particularly appealing about the 25s besides the purple paint, and I know I wouldn't shell out for it.

[SoDealer]

cutting the base model is the story here. It's by far the highest volume trim level. It's not a cash grab. It's a strangulation.

[samagon]

curious to see how it plays out.

[subySerb]

Originally Posted by SoDealer

Duh. CAFE and GHG. They ramp by model year. They've already killed the WRX margins. GHG is by carline and CAFE is for the brand. WRX is a liability for SBR. It went from high per unit profit to a drag on the entire company. SBR has WRX in a chokehold and is quietly telling it to go to sleep. No amount of whining and crying from someone on a forum is going to change that. by the time WRX is put out to pasture, it will be looking at +$20k in per unit penalties. SBR isn't having any of that.

Does Subaru have to pay the same penalties on the Outback and Ascent with this engine? Or maybe they are not because those are SUV's. If that's the case, then just gives us the lifted Levorg.

[SoDealer]

Originally Posted by subySerb

Does Subaru have to pay the same penalties on the Outback and Ascent with this engine? Or maybe they are not because those are SUV's. If that's the case, then just gives us the lifted Levorg.

Rules are less stringent for light trucks. Footprint is also factored into CAFE. The smaller the vehicle, the tougher the standard.

Back before the 2011 standards hit, it was noted that the CAFE would affect Subaru and Porsche the most of everyone because of the aforementioned. Neither brand had any minivans, vans, trucks, or truck based SUVs and most of the vehicles sold are modest in size.

With how stringent both GHG and CAFE have become, WRX and BRZ are absolute killers. Removing the base WRX at 50% of volume is going to decimate WRX sales... on purpose.

[Apharmd]

Oof at that '25 MY pricing. I'm so glad I got a GR Corolla a few weeks ago. It's not a perfect car but it makes so much more sense than this generation of WRX. The VB is a real stinker, sucks that Subaru is giving the WRX/STI this kind of send-off, what a thumb in the eye for long-time Subie enthusiasts... I think I'm done with this brand period, my wife still enjoys hers but when she moves on from it I don't think it's going to be another Subaru.

Originally Posted by SoDealer

cutting the base model is the story here. It's by far the highest volume trim level. It's not a cash grab. It's a strangulation.

Yeah that's just crazy. The 2024 base made a lot of sense once they ditched the Fisher Price 2 screen infotainment that was originally in the VB base trim.

[Russ_G93]

The Pricing for a Top Trim WRX at 45k is a little Mind Boggling Considering the "Amount of Build Materials Used. I think a Low Trim Ascent is around 46,000. So.. Subaru is saying that a top trim WRX matches the Extra Metal, More Sprayed Paint, More Rubber, More Glass, More Plastics, Bigger Wheels, Bigger Tires, Bigger brakes, thicker suspension components, More Room inside, More Available Seats, Longer Electrical Component wiring (main wiring harness), The Ability to Tow, 277ft lbs of Torque from the Trans, Etc.. that comes with an Ascent. I mean sure I don't have the prices or Bean counter data sheets for the price of Materials used, but it is interesting to see Less Materials Used, Match the Price of More Materials Used.