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Old 05-13-2020, 02:11 PM   #1
WRXnick16
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Default 2020 vs 2021 Supra dyno comparison

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...a-dyno-tested/

Back-to-back test, same dyno (dynojet), same day.

2020 Supra
Rated at flywheel:
335 hp
365 lb-ft

Dyno at the wheels:
346 whp
409 wtq

2021 Supra
Rated at flywheel:
382 hp (+47 hp)
368 lb-ft (+3 lb-ft)

Dyno at the wheels:
388 whp (+42 whp)
421 wtq (+12 wtq)

So it does appear that the 2021 Supra has ~40-50 more horsepower than the 2020 model. Toyota underrated the Supra yet again.

2020 dyno:


2021 dyno:



The power increase results from a few engine modifications:
  • New cylinder head & exhaust manifold design (6 individual ports instead of 2 merged ports - see below diagram), improving flow & "heat management"
  • New piston design reducing the compression ratio from 11:1 to 10.2:1 to safely allow for more boost pressure
  • Revised tune to increase boost and take advantage of the lower compression & revised head/exhaust manifold
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Last edited by WRXnick16; 05-14-2020 at 02:31 PM.
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Old 05-13-2020, 02:25 PM   #2
WRXnick16
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Default

Now just give us a manual transmission

For comparison sake, I believe stock M2Cs put down ~390-400 whp & 430-440 wtq depending on the dyno.

Obviously, this is in stock form and results will vary based on the dyno & conditions. The M2C's S55 should "walk away" from the Supra's B58 once tuning begins.

Impressive nonetheless given the engine differences.



Looking forward to seeing what the new S58 can do.

Last edited by WRXnick16; 05-13-2020 at 02:39 PM.
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Old 05-13-2020, 05:35 PM   #3
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Was about to say, those look like M2/M3 numbers. Manual transmission=no brainer to get enthusiasts to buy. I am sure Toyota is already working on design changes for a mid-life cycle updates, aka BMW's LCI.
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Old 05-13-2020, 08:31 PM   #4
thill
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Good luck selling those leftover 2020’s. I’m guessing at least $10K off MSRP, there are still over 100 of them for sale within 100 miles of me, and some launch editions that dealers have had for 8+ months.
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Old 05-13-2020, 08:51 PM   #5
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Just give it another couple months, buyers will be there banging down doors throwing cash on the floor. Be patient.
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Old 05-13-2020, 11:36 PM   #6
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That's impressive.
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Old 05-14-2020, 12:09 AM   #7
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That's considerably better, toyota. How they got permission from daddy bimmer to step on the toes of the z4 is beyond me
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Old 05-14-2020, 07:37 AM   #8
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Is it only me that noticed, but those dyno graphs don't show Torque and HP crossing at 5252. Both graphs are inconsistent where Torque and HP cross too. 2020 crosses at around 4,400 RPM and the 2021 graph crosses around 4,900 RPM. Seems like being on the same dyno that should at least be consistent.

Any one have thoughts on this?
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Old 05-14-2020, 08:15 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kayen View Post
Is it only me that noticed, but those dyno graphs don't show Torque and HP crossing at 5252. Both graphs are inconsistent where Torque and HP cross too. 2020 crosses at around 4,400 RPM and the 2021 graph crosses around 4,900 RPM. Seems like being on the same dyno that should at least be consistent.

Any one have thoughts on this?
Dyno scaling - look at the values on the left (HP) and the values on the right (TQ), they are out of alignment to fit the data on the output chart.
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Old 05-14-2020, 08:19 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sid03SVT View Post
Dyno scaling - look at the values on the left (HP) and the values on the right (TQ), they are out of alignment to fit the data on the output chart.
Ahh Thanks. Makes sense now.
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Old 05-14-2020, 09:13 AM   #11
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Not digging the auto only thing, no matter how fast it is. Zero practicality too. RS3/M240 > Supra. I just don't see the hype here.
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Old 05-14-2020, 09:38 AM   #12
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I would not consider an RS3 practical. Sure, a half of a practical is more than zero, but the car is just too small.
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Old 05-14-2020, 10:24 AM   #13
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The slow sales were not the HP ratings but the bump up will help along with 4 cyl bargain model for average driver who wants cool look. Methinks the 4cyl model will replace the Toytoat 86/BRZ
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Old 05-14-2020, 11:45 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RealDealTarheel View Post
I would not consider an RS3 practical. Sure, a half of a practical is more than zero, but the car is just too small.
it would be nice to have a long wheelbase version of the rs3 right around the wrx size.
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Old 05-14-2020, 12:35 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shake-rattle-n-roll View Post
it would be nice to have a long wheelbase version of the rs3 right around the wrx size.
Yeah, biggest complaint I have with my S3 is the back seat leg room. Luckily I only put one child back there, but I don't like how cramped she is.
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Old 05-14-2020, 12:54 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BeepBoop View Post
That's considerably better, toyota. How they got permission from daddy bimmer to step on the toes of the z4 is beyond me
Itís only a simple tune. Toyota has the rights to tune the Ecu how they like.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Straight6 View Post
Not digging the auto only thing, no matter how fast it is. Zero practicality too. RS3/M240 > Supra. I just don't see the hype here.
M240 isnít Iím the same ballpark. Suspension is different, lack of LSD, some steering dynamic differences, and the tuning of the transmission is different. I drove one before buying the M2 and itís definitely noticeable difference. Iíd take an M2 over the Supra. Interior quality is much better, itís a hell of a lot quieter, etc. Only real downside is that any aftermarket parts come with an aftermarket BMW price tag. You can get a catted downpipe for the Supra for like $450. The Z4 equivalent is like $1k plus
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Old 05-14-2020, 02:44 PM   #17
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The power increase results from a few modifications:
  • New cylinder head & exhaust manifold design (6 individual ports instead of 2 merged ports - see below diagram), improving flow & "heat management". I believe it now uses the same cylinder head as the Z4 M40i.
  • New piston design reducing the compression ratio from 11:1 to 10.2:1 to safely allow for more boost pressure
  • Revised tune to increase boost and take advantage of the lower compression & revised head/exhaust manifold
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Old 05-14-2020, 03:26 PM   #18
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Very very interesting to see that exhaust ports are back to 6. Before you know it the next iteration will be back to twin turbos like the N54. Exciting times yes, but MT is still needed.
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Old 05-14-2020, 04:25 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Masterauto View Post
The slow sales were not the HP ratings but the bump up will help along with 4 cyl bargain model for average driver who wants cool look. Methinks the 4cyl model will replace the Toytoat 86/BRZ
Or force the twins to stay naturally aspirated...


BlitZ
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Old 05-14-2020, 05:00 PM   #20
vapore0n
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Is the price also up?
Because I could see the initial model being low on power on purpose. To keep the price low on initial release. Sort of how the new Corvette is also priced lower than expected.
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Old 05-14-2020, 05:02 PM   #21
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Or add a third model. 300 hp, $30s, 3 pedals, 3 doors, 3k lbs.
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Old 05-15-2020, 12:46 AM   #22
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DeLeno said some things.
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Old 05-15-2020, 06:20 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scooby-Doode View Post
Very very interesting to see that exhaust ports are back to 6. Before you know it the next iteration will be back to twin turbos like the N54. Exciting times yes, but MT is still needed.
I hope not, twin turbo would take this right off the menu after the revisions put it square in my sites.
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Old 05-15-2020, 07:59 AM   #24
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^^ Why? What’s wrong with TT. S58’s a great motor. S55 not so much, but not because of TT. N54 was great motor.
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Old 05-15-2020, 08:47 AM   #25
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You guys know I truly hate AT cars for driving in general including VW's DSG, but the AT on the Supra is actually pretty smart especially in MT mode. I would not want this car as my only hobby car, but next to my other MT cars, it has earned a spot in my 4 car garage.

Plus this thing looks and sounds so wild in stock form, it is actually cool just owning one.
I have a JB4 on mine with Eventuri intake. No other performance mods planned.. acceleration and handling is fast as she looks. No BS like 86/BRZ crap.

I think M2's look like donkeys. I would much rather have a TT-S or just get the TT-RS if rear seats was okay. But I prefer MT so my Golf-R stays (given VW/Audi).
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