Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Friday December 14, 2018
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC General > News & Rumors > Non-Subaru News & Rumors

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads. 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-21-2018, 07:38 AM   #1
AVANTI R5
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 73805
Join Date: Nov 2004
Default Toyota Revive MR2/Celica Hot Gt86 ?




Quote:
Toyota Wants to Build a New Celica or MR2


Toyota wants to revive another sporty car to go alongside the Supra and 86.

Toyota is working hard to get back into the minds of enthusiasts. After 16 years without a high-performance sports car, the automaker is bringing back the Supra nameplate on an impressive rear-drive coupe. Once that's settled, the next vehicle in line could revive one of two famous Toyota models: Celica or MR2.


The 2019 Toyota Supra Lives Up to the Legend

That's what I learned from Masayuki Kai, Assistant Chief Engineer on the Supra project, during my drive of a Supra prototype this week. "We want to have Celica back, we want to have the MR2 back," Kai told me. "The biggest was Supra. Supra was number one, the biggest demand from the market," he continued. "Now that we've brought Supra back, what will come next depends on the market needs."

Kai hinted that the Celica could return as an all-wheel drive compact performance coupe to compliment the rear-drive Toyota GT and Supra. Or perhaps the mid-engine MR2, if a business case can be made. "Or maybe it could be a completely different model," Kai said. "We'll have to wait and see."

Kai points out that today's market makes it more challenging to introduce niche, small-volume performance models. "Sports car are becoming more and more expensive to develop," he told me. "So a single company cannot afford to invest in all the tooling for parts and components, because the volume of sports car is quite small. A sports car requires a lot of specific components that you cannot share with other cars. The suspension components we're using on the Supra, you can't use on a sedan like Camry or Corolla. And as you know, all the homologation issues are also getting more and more complex and difficult."

One potential solution would be to forge another sports car partnership along the lines of Toyota's cooperation with BMW on the Supra and Z4 "I'm quite sure if we did not make this cooperation, they could not have brought the Z4 back on the market alone," Kai told me. "And without their cooperation, we would never have been able to bring back the Supra. So it's clear for us, we needed this partnership."

How, then, does a small automaker like Mazda continue to produce the MX-5 Miata without relying on a partnership with another automaker? I posed the question to Kai. "Maybe if you're developing sports cars over a very, very long time, like Mazda, you have to know how to make it cheaper," he said. "I believe they have a lot of know-how, gathered throughout the development of the MX-5." By contrast, Toyota hadn't been involved in the high-performance sports car market for over a decade. Unlike Mazda, which has been developing the Miata for nearly 30 years, Toyota's clean-sheet new Supra couldn't rely on recent experience in making sports cars.

"I believe there are a lot of things we need to learn from Mazda," Kai told me. "They never stopped developing the MX-5. They continuously developed that car. If you don't do this—like Toyota, stopping the Supra for 16 years—it's extremely difficult to bring it back."
Road Track

Toyota Gazoo trademarks suggest hot 'GR' Yaris and GT86


Toyota Gazoo trademarks suggest hot 'GR' Yaris and GT86
European trademarks have been filed that point to expansion of Gazoo Racing sporting sub-brand

Toyota’s Gazoo Racing sub-brand is set to expand with the names of the first GR-badged variants of the GT86 and Yaris being trademarked across Europe.

If the trademarks signify production performance variants, the limited-run Yaris GRMN will be followed by a more mainstream hot hatch offering tweaked by Gazoo Racing, as well as a more hardcore version of Toyota’s GT86 sports car.

This development fits with Toyota’s aim to spread the influence of its Gazoo Racing division, with the upcoming Supra being honed by the motorsport sub-brand. Also forthcoming is a GR Sport-badged warm Yaris fitted with sporting styling elements inspired by the limited-run GRMN hot hatch.

It’s almost certain that both GT86 and Yaris models would get uprated power over their cooking variants. It is likely that the Yaris would be slightly tamer than the £26,296, 209bhp and 184lb ft Yaris GRMN.

The GR-badged GT86 variant trademark comes near the end of the car’s current life cycle. The GR version could therefore be introduced in the second-generation GT86, due soon if the usual seven-year cycle is any guide. This will help to differentiate the car from the mechanically identical Subaru BRZ, produced in a joint venture between the two brands.

Toyota presented a hint at what the next GT86 could look like with a Gazoo Racing influence in the GR HV concept, revealed at last year’s Tokyo motor show. The brand also showed a hypercar concept using the GR badge, named Gazoo GR Super Sport, which is mooted for a motorsport entry after the introduction of the Le Mans hypercar class.
Autocar.co.uk
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
AVANTI R5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Old 09-21-2018, 08:28 AM   #2
obielando
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 487077
Join Date: Jun 2018
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Ohio
Vehicle:
2013 WRX
WRB

Default

I hope so. I'd love to see a mid - engine awd collaboration. Between Subaru and Toyota.
obielando is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2018, 09:49 AM   #3
ptclaus98
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 87888
Join Date: May 2005
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Chattanooga, TN
Vehicle:
1992 Toyota MR2
Backwards Camry

Default

****ing dumb idea. Build a new Celica on the 86 chassis with a turbo engine, push it up firmly in the 30-40k segment. Make the S-FR the Miata fighter we deserve. Boom, job done.
ptclaus98 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2018, 11:36 AM   #4
Pre
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 139693
Join Date: Feb 2007
Default

MR2! Miss that car.
Pre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2018, 02:06 PM   #5
4S-TURBO
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 67807
Join Date: Aug 2004
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Castle Grayscale
Default

They replaced the Celica with the Scion tC and sold the FR-S alongside the tC. Did they forget that happened?
4S-TURBO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2018, 04:20 PM   #6
godfather2112
Papi Chulo
Moderator
 
Member#: 53794
Join Date: Jan 2004
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Boner kill city
Vehicle:
... White Magic
Jesus Underwear

Default

The MR2 will come mid engine with some underpowered 4 banger boxer motor that sells well for the first year and then everyone hates it.
godfather2112 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2018, 06:45 PM   #7
Sid03SVT
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 183032
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: CT
Vehicle:
OLD Family Wagon

Default

Cool, so if you were longing for an impreza coupe, or awd brz, you're all set! thanks to Toyota's aggressive badge engineering campaign.

Seriously though; if Toyota got in bed with FCA, took the 4c but put a Toyota mill & trans in it, it could be a decent car/mr2 replacement, however that would be pretty expensive from a Toyota standpoint, maybe Lexus? Are there any chea... I mean not super expensive MR cars out there nowadays? They wouldn't want to cannibalize gt86 sales with a similarly priced MR 2 seater, Would they?

I think it will flush out to (if it happens) gt86 (fr na coupe - entry level), Celica (fa na/turbo coupe - middle ground), supra (fr turbo coupe - top tier toyota). As much as I love the mr2, unless there is another manufacturer out there looking for that type of car, likely 2.0l+/- turbo, it isn't going to happen.
SGP wrx w/coupe treatment = celica gt4
Current impreza w/coupe treatment = celica all-trac
So in essence that is the most likely action. As for the second gen FA24DIT gt86... I honestly don't see it happening, unless the MR2 is na and becomes the entry level option.

But I bet the new gt86 with have eyesight & lane keep assist standard, and a hybrid option.
Sid03SVT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2018, 06:48 PM   #8
subyski
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 202642
Join Date: Nov 2007
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Centennial, Colorado
Vehicle:
08 Impreza,80Vette
68 Impala, 15 SantaFe

Default

I think Kai is trying to find an excuse. Mazda continues to build the Miata because they want to and not try to maximize every penny of profit or chase every single sale. He said the Miata is produced cheaper because of know how over 30 years. While partially true, it is still a completely stand alone chassis which is not cheap, especially the effort put into making the current gen that light. I'm still suprised the Miata still survived through Mazda's financial hardships and lackluster sales over the years.

It is hard to believe that one of the largest auto manufacturers can't produce more affordable performance on their own. The Supra seems more BMW than the 86 is a Subaru. How about a hot hatch Corolla? The TNGA platform is capable.
subyski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2018, 10:57 PM   #9
Nateness
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 51339
Join Date: Dec 2003
Vehicle:
1993 RX-7 R1
Brilliant Black

Default

To be fair, Mazda is probably offsetting some of the development cost for the MX5 chassis by selling them to Fiat to rebadge as the Spider.
Nateness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-24-2018, 11:06 AM   #10
justincredible
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 83633
Join Date: Mar 2005
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: The Mountains
Vehicle:
2012 bright green
box

Default

I wouldn't mind a new MR2, but they've gotta have that little trunk in the back like the SW20 and AW11. That's where the Spyder fell flat (that and only offering the lesser of 2 engines).
justincredible is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2018, 07:50 AM   #11
AVANTI R5
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 73805
Join Date: Nov 2004
Default Revived Toyota MR2 to be built with Subaru?



Quote:
Rumors of a Toyota MR2 revival have been swirling around for a while, but that’s nothing new. Separately and more recently, the grapevine’s been buzzing about a mid-engine Subaru. The latest reports from Japan say what’s so obvious and perfect that it jut might be true — Toyota and Subaru are working on a mid-engined sports car together.



Since 2013, ToMoCo head honcho Akio Toyoda and chief sports car engineer Tetsuya Tada has been talking about a “three sports car brothers” lineup within Toyota. When the S-FR concept was revealed in 2015, most pundits, including JNC, presumed it meant a smaller car slotting below the GT86 and a more powerful car like the upcoming Supra above it. But what if that smaller car was mid-engined?

Rumors of a mid-engined Subaru have been circulating since 2016, this year both the Three Brothers and the MR Subie theories got another round at about the same time. And as we reported in April, Toyota and Subaru have already begun working on the next-gen 2.4-liter BRZ/86 together.

What’s more, the car could be a hybrid, which would be a first in the affordable end of the sports market. Response claims it’ll be powered by a 1.6-liter boxer, found on the Japanese-market Crosstrek and Levorg, coupled with an electric motor for a total of 300 PS (296 hp). The report also says it will also sport a VIZIV concept-inspired front end and debut in 2020 or 2021. Time will tell whether the rumor amounts to anything.
http://japanesenostalgiccar.com/news...t-with-subaru/
AVANTI R5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2018, 10:43 AM   #12
SCRAPPYDO
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 873
Join Date: Feb 2000
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: www.testdrivemylife.com
Vehicle:
2018 Leg / Ridgeline
Datsun 71 240Z & 68 2000

Default

As much as a new celica would make me swoon, probably not going to happen.

Solution

Take that awesome looking little corolla hatch and give us a Corolla GTS with 220 HP, a LSD, and some real suspension tuning.
SCRAPPYDO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2018, 11:18 AM   #13
mhoward1
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 9481
Join Date: Aug 2001
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: FFR Challenge #43
Vehicle:
1832 Steam Buggy
Wood

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SCRAPPYDO View Post
As much as a new celica would make me swoon, probably not going to happen.

Solution

Take that awesome looking little corolla hatch and give us a Corolla GTS with 220 HP, a LSD, and some real suspension tuning.
So much agreement.

bring back the Levin GT/Corolla SR-5/FX16
mhoward1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2018, 12:16 PM   #14
KC
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 442
Join Date: Oct 1999
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: RI/SE Mass
Vehicle:
17 Imp Spurt
00 S2k | 14 BRZ (SSC)

Default

The obvious hurdle to the MR2 making a return is the recent changes to pedestrian accident mitigation standards. You know all those similiar front ends we're seeing with quite the veritcal and large front openings on cars? Yeah, that design is to mostly limit the damage inflicted on pedestrians.

The low to the ground angular designs are a thing of the past due to it. I'd love to see a return to the wedge designs (MR2/XT/SVX/Stratos)... but that ain't happening anytime soon.

--kC
KC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2018, 12:50 PM   #15
SCRAPPYDO
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 873
Join Date: Feb 2000
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: www.testdrivemylife.com
Vehicle:
2018 Leg / Ridgeline
Datsun 71 240Z & 68 2000

Default

stooopid pedestrians.
SCRAPPYDO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2018, 01:32 PM   #16
Hondaslayer
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 4562
Join Date: Feb 2001
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Auburn, WA
Vehicle:
2014 Electric Datsun
2005 Adventure van

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KC View Post
The obvious hurdle to the MR2 making a return is the recent changes to pedestrian accident mitigation standards. You know all those similiar front ends we're seeing with quite the veritcal and large front openings on cars? Yeah, that design is to mostly limit the damage inflicted on pedestrians.

The low to the ground angular designs are a thing of the past due to it. I'd love to see a return to the wedge designs (MR2/XT/SVX/Stratos)... but that ain't happening anytime soon.

--kC



Wedge cars were a thing of the past (in the US) back when they were new.
Hondaslayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2018, 02:32 PM   #17
YungBoba
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 450808
Join Date: Jul 2016
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Vehicle:
2017 WRX Premium
WR Blue Pearl

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SCRAPPYDO View Post
As much as a new celica would make me swoon, probably not going to happen.

Solution

Take that awesome looking little corolla hatch and give us a Corolla GTS with 220 HP, a LSD, and some real suspension tuning.
The Corolla XRS and Matrix XRS in the early and mid-2000s were fun. They used the same 2ZZ-GE engine from the Celica GT-S which was good for 170-190hp depending on the application. While that doesn't sound like much, also consider that cars back then were much lighter and didn't have all the tech, infotainment, and fancy cameras/sensors/safety features that they do nowadays. It was much more refreshing to have a "sporty-ish" Corolla with a decent motor, as opposed to the the common Corolla "S" which was basically just visual and cosmetic parts tacked on to make it look sportier, while offering no real performance upgrade.

I had a 7th-generation Celica GT, the very last generation before they killed it off completely. It was fun, but it's a shame they killed off the Celica GT-Four/Alltrac. Evo vs. STi is what most people think of when they think of Japanese rally rivalries, but the Celica GT-Four also kicked some serious ass in WRC back in the day. If they were to bring the Celica back, I'd like to see it in that form: AWD and boosted with rally pedigree.
YungBoba is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2018, 02:36 PM   #18
thill
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 377200
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: North Pole
Vehicle:
17 Focus RS
Stealth Grey

Default

Unfortunately an AWD Celica released in the near future would likely be closer to a CUV than a sportscar I suspect.

All the cool kids are doing it..
thill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2018, 02:41 PM   #19
Hondaslayer
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 4562
Join Date: Feb 2001
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Auburn, WA
Vehicle:
2014 Electric Datsun
2005 Adventure van

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thill View Post
Unfortunately an AWD Celica released in the near future would likely be closer to a CUV than a sportscar I suspect.

All the cool kids are doing it..
Eclipse Cross....


Though I do hope that Mitsu is considering bringing back a proper Eclipse GSX.
Hondaslayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2018, 02:47 PM   #20
thill
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 377200
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: North Pole
Vehicle:
17 Focus RS
Stealth Grey

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hondaslayer View Post
Eclipse Cross....


Though I do hope that Mitsu is considering bringing back a proper Eclipse GSX.
Yes and Ford is killing off cars, GM is killing off cars.. I don't want the driving dynamics of a CUV.

And for some of you, use I have driven a Porsche Macan. It's a good vehicle. But drive that, and then back to back drive a Cayman or 911.. Or a Lotus Evora.
thill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2018, 02:57 PM   #21
Hondaslayer
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 4562
Join Date: Feb 2001
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Auburn, WA
Vehicle:
2014 Electric Datsun
2005 Adventure van

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thill View Post
Yes and Ford is killing off cars, GM is killing off cars.. I don't want the driving dynamics of a CUV.

And for some of you, use I have driven a Porsche Macan. It's a good vehicle. But drive that, and then back to back drive a Cayman or 911.. Or a Lotus Evora.
You're comparing daily drivers with sports cars.


Think about that.
Hondaslayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2018, 04:31 PM   #22
thill
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 377200
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: North Pole
Vehicle:
17 Focus RS
Stealth Grey

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hondaslayer View Post
You're comparing daily drivers with sports cars.


Think about that.
I guess my point is that I am concerned that companies will kill off sports cars in favor of sporty SUV's. And my point is that no sporty SUV I have driven can communicate the way a sports car can due to things like ride height, weight, center of gravity, tires, etc.

And hey, I would happily daily drive a 911
thill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2018, 08:47 PM   #23
Hondaslayer
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 4562
Join Date: Feb 2001
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Auburn, WA
Vehicle:
2014 Electric Datsun
2005 Adventure van

Default

I doubt that.


People looking for a Cayman / 911 are not likely to buy a Macan / Cayenne to replace it.


However, they are very likely to buy one as a wife/mistress/DD/winter car. As long as there is a demand for sports cars, there will be sports cars. As long as these CUV's have decent profit margins (IIRC better than sedan / hatch already) the manufacturers can keep making low margin cars like the BRZ etc....


That said, I loved my Forester XT once I lowered it. It was an Impreza wagon with a better hatch.
Hondaslayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Yesterday, 11:09 AM   #24
SirBrass
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 207263
Join Date: Apr 2009
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Northern PA
Vehicle:
2019 WRX Limited
World Rally Blue

Default

But if you want a daily that can double as a sports car, there's always the Panamera. Too bad they don't make it with a proper MT, though.

Back on topic, I really hope the MR2 is revived. Okay, change the front end profile, that's fine. But a light, squirrelly turbo (or high revving NA even, that's just fine too) h4 w/ great balance and high power to weight MR coupe with an MT?

OH please please please please please!!!
SirBrass is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Yesterday, 11:22 AM   #25
bugatti0628
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 447323
Join Date: May 2016
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SirBrass View Post
But if you want a daily that can double as a sports car, there's always the Panamera. Too bad they don't make it with a proper MT, though.

Back on topic, I really hope the MR2 is revived. Okay, change the front end profile, that's fine. But a light, squirrelly turbo (or high revving NA even, that's just fine too) h4 w/ great balance and high power to weight MR coupe with an MT?

OH please please please please please!!!
the weight of the engine over the rear wheels will help with the traction as well. I hope toyota and subaru get the mr2 correct this time.
bugatti0628 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:53 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2018 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2017, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.