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Old 08-13-2013, 12:09 AM   #1
13Stoploss
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Have a Nice Day? Low Power/Spool: '05 WRX 2.12 Stroker w/Blouch16g-XT

I've been lurking for several years. I've found many set-ups that share similar parts and numbers, but which are different enough for me to post my own thread.

My 2.12 stroker w/Blouch td05-16g-XT-7cm2 made 256whp/261wtq at 18.4psi on 91 octane on a DynaPack at Church Automotive in Wilmington, CA. I was hoping for a lot more, and at less than 4500rpm peak tq/5700rpm peak power.

Mods: '05 WRX Wagon, STI 79mm crank, Mahle 92.5mm pistons, Eagle rods, ACL bearings, ARP studs, '13 STI 6MT, Blouch 16g-XT, ETS TMIC, ID1000s, Wahlbro 255 FP, Perrin UP, Cobb SRI w/Airbox and Post-MAF, B&B catted TBE w/ divorced waste gate, Prosport BCS, Cobb APv2. Also has ported OEM TB, ported OEM IM, TGV deletes, ported OEM EM w/ported OEM X-Pipe, and Cobb APv2.

This was a California build. Let me say this again: This was a stock-appearance California build on 91 octane. The Cobb SRI is CARB legal. The ETS TMIC has no label and looks stock'ish. The downpipe has a cat. I know a new header will improve spool and power, but if i ever got pulled over? Not worth the risk to me, let alone the cost. However, 3 weeks ago, I relocated to Washington DC. I have a 93 octane tune from Shawn Church that "should be good for 280 whp." But my goal was 300, and aside from that, I expected to make peak torque w/ a 16g sooner than 4500 rpm at 18 psi.

I have a 93 map, but I have not yet been tuned on 93. I am happy with how the car drives, though it feels laggy, but less so than my old VF39. It's not an apples to apples comparison, but my 2.0L VF39 and STI TMIC Tim Bailey Mustang tune ran 260whp/244wtg at 16.4psi. I expected more from my stroker/16g/ETS TMIC than -4whp/+17wtq.

At my tune on 91, I ran into knock problems, as well as intake temperature problems. Shawn was flabbergasted: My airbox should have done better to isolate the heat, and the city drive after the tune proved better: No issue, lots of cool air. As for the knock, I've searched and found that some folks are running Brisk spark plugs to alleviate the knock. Aside from that, I still want to hit 300whp on 16g and catted DP.

Please air out your intelligent responses. My 16g-XT, even if just a 16g, should at least be spooling quicker peak tq than 4500, right? If I wanted spool this late, I would have gone for the bigger 18g/20g. And with a built bottom end, shouldn't I be able to hit 20lbs boost? Will the Brisk plugs really help with stroker knock? Can I hit 300whp w/stock EM? Should I upgrade to a GS X-Pipe? Do I need a larger turbo inlet? Should I have just got an 18g?

Thanks.
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Last edited by 13Stoploss; 08-15-2013 at 10:34 PM.
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Old 08-13-2013, 12:10 AM   #2
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Last edited by 13Stoploss; 08-13-2013 at 08:22 AM.
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Old 08-13-2013, 01:00 AM   #3
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On my 18g xt stock ej205 with aftermarket headers and upjpe catted downpipe and sti topmountI hits full boost slightly before 4,500. That's with a 8cm hotside and those headers should be hurting my spool slightly I would think.

Something seems wrong with your tune maybe a leak somewhere? If your really looking for power try e-85 if its in your area I know in my case it was night and day powerwise and off boost drivability and I won't ever go back unless the car has to be moved across the country or something.
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Old 08-13-2013, 01:41 AM   #4
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something inst right as you should be RIPPING by 3500

logs would help tell the tale.......but 4500 for a 16g on a stroker???
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Old 08-13-2013, 08:22 AM   #5
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Post 2 updated with graphs.

Anyone?
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Old 08-13-2013, 09:44 AM   #6
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I would check the bpv and see if its leaking. This will also heat up the air and over work the turbo. I would also check the turbo for Any damage. Is this a new turbo on this new build? I have seen foreign debris damage turbine wheels before causing horrible spool.
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Old 08-13-2013, 10:55 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrxsubiemod View Post
I would check the bpv and see if its leaking. This will also heat up the air and over work the turbo. I would also check the turbo for Any damage. Is this a new turbo on this new build? I have seen foreign debris damage turbine wheels before causing horrible spool.
It is a brand new turbo. Not sure how to check on the BPV though...
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Old 08-13-2013, 01:08 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 13Stoploss View Post

It is a brand new turbo. Not sure how to check on the BPV though...
Pressure test the system
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Old 08-13-2013, 11:45 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shortpersonbk View Post
On my 18g xt stock ej205 with aftermarket headers and upjpe catted downpipe and sti topmountI hits full boost slightly before 4,500. That's with a 8cm hotside and those headers should be hurting my spool slightly I would think.

Something seems wrong with your tune maybe a leak somewhere? If your really looking for power try e-85 if its in your area I know in my case it was night and day powerwise and off boost drivability and I won't ever go back unless the car has to be moved across the country or something.
Thanks, but I'm not interested in E85.

Anyone else got any ideas for why my 16g hits peak tq at 4500?
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Old 08-13-2013, 11:45 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Scotty View Post
something inst right as you should be RIPPING by 3500

logs would help tell the tale.......but 4500 for a 16g on a stroker???
Where do I get logs? How do I post them here?
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Old 08-13-2013, 11:48 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrxsubiemod View Post
Pressure test the system
This is going to sound really dumb, but I'm not sure what you mean by "the system."
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Old 08-14-2013, 12:28 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 13Stoploss View Post
Where do I get logs? How do I post them here?
Logs are just a list of numbers you look at and use when tuning the car. Your tuner would know what they are and should have them. If you have a boost leak, going through those numbers could help confirm it. There must be something wrong though. I have a 2.5 hybrid and 18G-XT w/ 8cm that hits around 3700 rpm on a functionable but not nearly complete map.
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Old 08-14-2013, 01:00 AM   #13
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the op needs to post in his local area forum for somebody local to him to come help him with this issue

somebody who knows their **** could likely just LOOK at the motor and fix the issue and/or look at the logs and figure it out

but he needs logs
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Old 08-14-2013, 01:22 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KpT KiM View Post
Logs are just a list of numbers you look at and use when tuning the car. Your tuner would know what they are and should have them. If you have a boost leak, going through those numbers could help confirm it. There must be something wrong though. I have a 2.5 hybrid and 18G-XT w/ 8cm that hits around 3700 rpm on a functionable but not nearly complete map.
2.5 hybrid will spool quite a bit quicker then a stock ej205, for example i have the same turbo as u buy don't get full spool till 4,400ish on a good day either way this guy needs to log and test for leaks
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Old 08-14-2013, 01:34 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shortpersonbk View Post
2.5 hybrid will spool quite a bit quicker then a stock ej205, for example i have the same turbo as u buy don't get full spool till 4,400ish on a good day either way this guy needs to log and test for leaks

the OP has a 2.1 stroker...it should spool hell outta that terbo

i had a plain jane 16g on my 2.0 and it ROCKED.....i had 22psi below 4k rpm

the OP needs a learned local d000000d to come see wassup with it

im surprised the tuner even tuned it if it was as lame as it is
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Old 08-14-2013, 09:33 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Shortpersonbk View Post
2.5 hybrid will spool quite a bit quicker then a stock ej205, for example i have the same turbo as u buy don't get full spool till 4,400ish on a good day either way this guy needs to log and test for leaks
Like Scotty said he's got the 2.1 stroker. Same strokes = similar spool.
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Old 08-14-2013, 08:56 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KpT KiM View Post

Like Scotty said he's got the 2.1 stroker. Same strokes = similar spool.
Ur still lower on displacement but no point in arguing something is wrong we can all agree
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Old 08-14-2013, 09:39 PM   #18
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My 16gxt spools at about the same RPM on my ej205... but that is due to craptastic tune that will be fixed shortly.
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Old 08-14-2013, 09:46 PM   #19
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My 16gxt spools at about the same RPM on my ej205... but that is due to craptastic tune that will be fixed shortly.
I'm looking at the Cobb Dyno Database right now, and I haven't yet seen a 16g-XT spool peak tq. below 4400rpm. Most of the 18g's I've seen spool quicker and make bigger top end power.

Beginning to think this turbo sucks. Though, judging by all the comments above this, I DO want to get everything checked out and retuned.
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Old 08-14-2013, 09:57 PM   #20
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Pressure testing the system means hooking up a cap and air hose fitting and pressure gage to pressurize it and watch and see if the gauge drops over time.

It is attached to the turbo inlet and helps determine if you have a boost leak somewhere between the turbo and heads. A competent subaru shop should be able to help like scotty said. Aig and a couple other places in maryland would be a good start.

Getting logs of your car involves an access port or a tatrix cable and laptop if you are open souce tuned. It reads the data stored about rpms, boost, maf, etc.

That data is then analyzed to determine possible issues and plot a "virtual" dyno plot.

In your situation and technical ability, it sounds like you need more professional advice than can be found on the forum. Find a good shop and tuner, and im sure you will get it straightened out.
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Old 08-15-2013, 04:06 PM   #21
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Yea having a boost leak test done might be helpful. At least it would let you cross some things off the list of possible issues.
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Old 08-18-2013, 09:46 AM   #22
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Pressure testing the system means hooking up a cap and air hose fitting and pressure gage to pressurize it and watch and see if the gauge drops over time.

It is attached to the turbo inlet and helps determine if you have a boost leak somewhere between the turbo and heads. A competent subaru shop should be able to help like scotty said. Aig and a couple other places in maryland would be a good start.

Getting logs of your car involves an access port or a tatrix cable and laptop if you are open souce tuned. It reads the data stored about rpms, boost, maf, etc.

That data is then analyzed to determine possible issues and plot a "virtual" dyno plot.

In your situation and technical ability, it sounds like you need more professional advice than can be found on the forum. Find a good shop and tuner, and im sure you will get it straightened out.
Sorry for the dummy speak...

Anyway, I've contacted Six Star Speed, IAG Performance, Element Tuning, MachV, and Dynamic Power Solutions all in the DC area. Only one shop has got back to me, and it wasn't very helpful.
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Old 08-18-2013, 09:49 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sultanofsubguns View Post
My 16gxt spools at about the same RPM on my ej205... but that is due to craptastic tune that will be fixed shortly.
Did you get retuned yet? Curious for results.
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Old 08-18-2013, 03:19 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 13Stoploss View Post
Did you get retuned yet? Curious for results.
No, Cobb Tuning Surgeline is slammed so I can't get in until the 29th for the new tune. I'll be sure to post up when it gets done though.
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Old 03-02-2014, 11:17 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 13Stoploss View Post

My 2.12 stroker w/Blouch td05-16g-XT-7cm2 made 256whp/261wtq at 18.4psi on 91 octane on a DynaPack at Church Automotive in Wilmington, CA. I was hoping for a lot more, and at less than 4500rpm peak tq/5700rpm peak power.


This was a California build. Let me say this again: This was a stock-appearance California build on 91 octane. The Cobb SRI is CARB legal. The ETS TMIC has no label and looks stock'ish. The downpipe has a cat. I know a new header will improve spool and power, but if i ever got pulled over? Not worth the risk to me, let alone the cost. However, 3 weeks ago, I relocated to Washington DC. I have a 93 octane tune from Shawn Church that "should be good for 280 whp." But my goal was 300, and aside from that, I expected to make peak torque w/ a 16g sooner than 4500 rpm at 18 psi.

I have not yet been tuned on 93. I am happy with how the car drives, though it feels laggy, but less so than my old VF39. It's not an apples to apples comparison, but my 2.0L VF39 and STI TMIC Tim Bailey Mustang tune ran 260whp/244wtg at 16.4psi. I expected more from my stroker/16g/ETS TMIC than -4whp/+17wtq.

At my tune on 91, I ran into knock problems, as well as intake temperature problems. Shawn was flabbergasted: My airbox should have done better to isolate the heat, and the city drive after the tune proved better: No issue, lots of cool air. As for the knock, I've searched and found that some folks are running Brisk spark plugs to alleviate the knock. Aside from that, I still want to hit 300whp on 16g and catted DP.

*LONG OVERDUE UPDATE, though no dyno.

I talked to IAG in Westminster, MD. My up-pipe had a crack. We suspect that this may have led to lag and heat. Changed to Invidia up pipe. Also changed to Perrin turbo inlet. Then, because DC roads suck butt, and because I smashed my B&B downpipe on a metal grate at 12 mph, I changed to catted Invidia Q300 TBE. And a Crawford AOS.

There is no more lag. This 16g/6MT stroker is a beast at 3500 rpm, give or take 200 rpm. I still don't think I've made my 300 whp goal, but I've fixed the lag issue. I suspect that I could be in the 285-290 range. The reason I haven't dyno'd? My last oil change was little silvery. Heads don't look so good. My builder is on board to completely honor a new short block. When that time comes, I've identified a badasser turbo that I plan to use.
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