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Old 12-31-2010, 10:47 PM   #1
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Default 08 STi steering rack into RS?

I have the opportunity to buy an 08 STi steering rack, and I'm wondering if if can be fitted in my swapped 2000 RS? I know a lot of things changed with the introduction of the new chassis, but is the rack still the same/similar?
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Old 01-01-2011, 12:44 AM   #2
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No, the racks for the turbo cars changed in 05. To fit it to an RS or to an 04 or older turbo, you'd need the modern crossmember.
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Old 01-01-2011, 01:54 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by williaty View Post
No, the racks for the turbo cars changed in 05. To fit it to an RS or to an 04 or older turbo, you'd need the modern crossmember.
I see. If I could get the crossmember, is it a big task to swap everything out? Will it require dropping the engine or anything? Are there any other parts required to swap crossmembers? And will that rack bolt up to my steering column, or will I need an adapter of some sorts?

Thanks for the help so far.
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Old 01-01-2011, 01:57 AM   #4
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Engine would have to come out. Would bolt to existing steering column. Beyond that, I have no idea.
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Old 01-01-2011, 03:17 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by williaty View Post
Engine would have to come out. Would bolt to existing steering column. Beyond that, I have no idea.
Thanks for the help, I think I'm going to have to skip this project for now.
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Old 01-01-2011, 10:21 AM   #6
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just look for an 04 sti rack.
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Old 01-01-2011, 11:43 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by williaty View Post
Engine would have to come out. Would bolt to existing steering column. Beyond that, I have no idea.
Engine doesn't have to come out at all. Just support it either up top, or with my ghetto method of a block of wood on the jack underneath the oil pan (carefully)

I was able install the cross member this way without having to remove the motor.

It is a pretty involved process though, but compared to the cost of a Q-Rack, its a great, cheap steering upgrade. Lots of parts to unhook, tie rods, front control arms, swaybar, etc. But I love my 07 STi rack in my bug eye. Of course, while you are in there, install Whiteline steering rack bushings.
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Old 01-01-2011, 03:14 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Arnie View Post
Engine doesn't have to come out at all. Just support it either up top, or with my ghetto method of a block of wood on the jack underneath the oil pan (carefully)

I was able install the cross member this way without having to remove the motor.

It is a pretty involved process though, but compared to the cost of a Q-Rack, its a great, cheap steering upgrade. Lots of parts to unhook, tie rods, front control arms, swaybar, etc. But I love my 07 STi rack in my bug eye. Of course, while you are in there, install Whiteline steering rack bushings.
I've got some whiteline bushings already, I guess I would have to buy the 08 specific ones. I'll be doing a transmission swap at the same time (to an 04 STi trans), so I don't think it would be too much extra time spent.

However, I have seen that some people have had to use adapters for the steering column (and the ones I have seen were fairly ghetto), but I just want to confirm what williaty is saying. Will the rack bolt up to my column using unmodified stock parts?

Thanks again for all the help everyone.
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Old 01-02-2011, 05:45 AM   #9
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PM dumbuglydragon. He has one of the newer racks on his RS. He helped me install mine. I don't think he had any issues with the column.

They changed to so much with the 08's, though. I'm not sure if they changed the rack as well.
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Old 02-12-2011, 02:41 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by williaty View Post
Engine would have to come out. Would bolt to existing steering column. Beyond that, I have no idea.
This was replied to at the bottom but this is BS. Do you just write anything that comes to mind and give it as information or fact? I understand that the RS has some smaller clearance but a full engine pull is ridiculous. If you have the equipment to pull an engine it may be easier if you want to lift the motor slightly, but even then I don't even think that will make a difference. I'm sorry if that was harsh but wow. It's so disturbing when people decide to not go through with a project because of wrong information like yours, or even worse, when others go through with a project and pull their engines because of information like yours.
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Old 02-12-2011, 02:42 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by williaty View Post
No, the racks for the turbo cars changed in 05. To fit it to an RS or to an 04 or older turbo, you'd need the modern crossmember.
they did change but you don't need the modern cross member. The mounting points are the same but you only need 2 longer bolts. I have an 05 STi steering rack in my 04 WRX
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Old 02-12-2011, 03:09 PM   #12
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they did change but you don't need the modern cross member. The mounting points are the same but you only need 2 longer bolts. I have an 05 STi steering rack in my 04 WRX
So, the steering rack from an 07 and earlier would fit in the RS cross member and all I would have to change it bolts? I'll have to try to dig up the part diagrams I guess, as that would make the project worthwhile.

I would imagine the 08+ rack is a bit different though, since almost everything in the car changed for 08. Any idea about that?
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Old 02-12-2011, 04:17 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arco View Post
This was replied to at the bottom but this is BS. Do you just write anything that comes to mind and give it as information or fact? I understand that the RS has some smaller clearance but a full engine pull is ridiculous. If you have the equipment to pull an engine it may be easier if you want to lift the motor slightly, but even then I don't even think that will make a difference. I'm sorry if that was harsh but wow. It's so disturbing when people decide to not go through with a project because of wrong information like yours, or even worse, when others go through with a project and pull their engines because of information like yours.
I would pull the engine. It's *easy* to pull the engine in an RS. Less than 100 minutes to come out, about 180 minutes to go back in. For your effort, you then get to be able to get in there, see what you're doing easily, reach things from both sides, and not have whatever you're supporting the engine with in your way. If you support the engine from the oil pan, you're going to have a jack in the way. If you support the engine from an engine hoist, you're going to have the legs of the hoist in the way.

However, I think what's really going on here is that you're mistaken about what would be required for this guy to swap racks. The engine has to come out because the crossmember that the engine sets on has to come out. See below.

Quote:
Originally Posted by arco View Post
they did change but you don't need the modern cross member. The mounting points are the same but you only need 2 longer bolts. I have an 05 STi steering rack in my 04 WRX
You're missing something here. The rack-to-crossmember mounting interface is different for the 04-and-older turbos vs the 05-and-newer turbos. They have to match. The part numbers for the crossmembers are different between 04 and 05. They're visually hugely different. The way the rack bolts to them is different. You HAVE to pair them properly.

Here, this is what the bushings for an 04 and older bushings look like:


Here's what the 05-07 style bushings look like:



As you can see, the methods of mounting between the two different years of racks are entirely different. The shape of the rack must be matched to the shape of the crossmember. To take an RS, which has the old style crossmember and old style rack, and drop the new-style rack into it, you also have to swap the new-style crossmember into it.
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Old 02-18-2011, 08:54 PM   #14
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I'm sorry but I haven't had the chance to respond. I do thank you for doing your research and your input but I must correct you. Although the part numbers for the racks and numbers do not match, they still work out.

I understand that shapes of the racks and the bushings are different as well, and it was clearly pointed out with your pictures. The bushings need to match the specific year of the rack to fit, but the pairing of the rack and bushings can fit either cross members.

Have you tried this out to verify it for yourself? Did you actually compare both cross members and both racks to each other? From the results of your research I am assuming you have not. I have done the physical fitment and comparisons already and am in fact using an 05 STi steering rack on my 04 WRX using my stock 04 crossmember. I also have a friend who has used an 06 STi steering rack in his 93' GC. He would have used the RS cross member which would have fit as well but he has a wrx motor swap and needed the accommodation for the uppipe. What he is using now is actually an early 90's turbo Legacy cross member. But remember for the RS, the u-joint needs to be modified.

Here are some pictures of the wrx and the 05-07 sti steering rack. The STi rack is on the top. The mounting locations are the same. The L bracket on the left adds two extra holes for the additional mounts on the newer cross member. The major difference of the newer rack is the addition of the holes for better stability and bracing.



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Old 02-19-2011, 12:01 AM   #15
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I can't tell from your pictures but does the newer rack still have the ears on the rack itself immediately adjacent to the bushing/shackle location?

What I'm getting at here is that there's a possible difference between "can be made to fit" and "done right".
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Old 02-19-2011, 04:59 AM   #16
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Can you explain the ears of the rack? I've never encountered that term.

Well I wanted to ask, What differentiates something "made to fit" or something "done right"? I see what you're getting at but in regards to the newer steering rack, does "making it work" with 100% success rate of performance of the 2004 STi rack not qualify it as "doing it right"? Or must one have to spend the extra money for another cross member to "do it right"? I'm just saying... Either way you choose i've said my peace and I'll still be happy using my STi quicker steering rack at the track.

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Old 02-19-2011, 05:35 AM   #17
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No, simply getting it to bolt up and align right doesn't count as "done right". "Done right" is as strong or stronger than stock in every measurable way with more rigid control of position in all conditions up to loads experienced in an impact.

The ears are the bits that surround the ridge on the subframe and the shackle to prevent all lateral movement of the rack. They form a channel for the steering rack bushing on the left side to nestle in. They are the only thing providing positive registration of the rack to the subframe in the old-style racks. If the new-style racks do not have the ears and you rely on just the two bolts to provide lateral registration, you're definitely playing fast and loose with safety as you've got two bolts in single shear with a long moment being the only thing standing between you and complete loss of steering.
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Old 05-18-2011, 09:32 PM   #18
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I mostly lurk around this forum since my interest is mostly off road but I just needed to say that I agree with arco on this. I personally put a 05 sti rack in my 02 wrx and have been more than completely satisfied with it. I rally crossed the car until I sold it to a buddy of mine that also took to a Dirty impreza meet at California City, and that place is ROUGH!

What i'm trying to get at is that I think that the point you are trying to make Williaty is slightly invalid. The ears on the old style rack provide the same role as the two mounting places not the bolts themselves. The ears hold the bushing in place that in turn hold the U shape brake from having lateral movement. The newer racks have practically have the "bracker" directly attached to the rack which I've actually felt gave better lateral feedback that the stock 02 wrx set up.

I understand that you are saying that if you mount an 05 rack with an 05 cross member you get the best overall result but from what arco and I did, you get you get the at least the same lateral restraint (if not more cause of the solid mounting points instead of the brackets) as I would have had with the 02 rack but with the STI turning ratio.

just my 2 cents...

here is a link to my installation
http://www.dirtyimpreza.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=16532
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Old 05-18-2011, 11:09 PM   #19
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A while after this came up, I sent some emails around. All of the rebuilders of Subaru racks and all of the makers of quick racks for Subarus universally advised against doing this without modification to the rack. Interestingly, the modification they wanted to do wasn't to add flanges to it like an actual old-style rack but to significantly reinforce the ears on the new style rack because they all felt the ears weren't strong enough for lateral registration.

So, it sounds like this is in the category of things that are physically possible that are probably a bad idea.
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Old 07-14-2011, 02:38 AM   #20
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Quote:
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Ocard, not all the pictures are showing up on your link, can you re-host them?
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Old 07-19-2011, 02:14 PM   #21
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Ocard: Thanks for replying to the thread and adding more info. Also thanks for the agreement.

Williaty: To each their own. If you feel that it is not safe then do what you will. I am many other have completed this swap with ease and have been running them for quite some time. If our experience is not "enough" to suit you then so be it. No harm no foul, it's all your call to do whatever you please to your car. Thanks for your input still.
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Old 07-22-2011, 12:25 AM   #22
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I will agree with williaty. I put an 05 sti SR in my bugeye...but now i need that L-bracket because I hear a slight clink when cornering hard w/ decent steering input. It needs the L-bracket with 275 hoosiers.

Does anyone have a part number for that L bracket? thanks!!
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