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Old Yesterday, 08:33 PM   #526
shikataganai
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Originally Posted by quentinberg007 View Post
That is something Iíve pondered lately. Why are people so obsessed with having the fastest car around a track or in a drag? None of us debating the merits of this car are professional racers. We donít get to work faster or win money by buying a car that gets to 60 a half second quicker. Why wrap up so much money in a slightly more capable sports car when it is vastly underutilized on the street and 99% of us would get better lap times by doing more driver training?
It's because we don't buy cars in a vacuum. We buy them to show off to our buddies, and quoting 'Ring times or 0-60 is one way to dick swing over the BBQ.
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Old Yesterday, 08:46 PM   #527
heavyD
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A ZL1 Camaro w/10 speed destroys some supercars that cost 100 times more on the track.

But you and I both know that 90%+ of the people who buy Mustangs, Camaros, Porsches, Corvettes, Supras, etc will never take it up the track, and if they do it's likely autox and non competitive purposes.

If someone is trying to buy a track monster, yeah I doubt they are buying this Supra. It's about finding a good drivers car with great balance, feedback, and power.
Problem with Camaros is that when you aren't driving them really fast they kind of blow because they are massive cars and visibility is poor. Worst of all they are hideously ugly with the new front end. The Mustang is great and all providing you option up for the Recaro seats and track pack which adds considerable price and I'm sure I'm not the only former Mustang owner that wasn't exactly enamoured with the quality of build that comes out of Flat Rock. The Supra will be smaller, lighter, as fast or faster and of higher quality. The if you want to save $5k and get an equal performing, lower quality car then have at it. Some people want a nicer car over the cheapest means to go fast.
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Old Yesterday, 08:50 PM   #528
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If you want the cheapest means to go fast / best performance for the buck etc.... why even shop new cars? Let some idiot take the hit then dump more money into go faster bits. That new car feeling last a few weeks at most. First door ding/scratch/chip etc... and it's gone.
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Old Yesterday, 09:05 PM   #529
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The problem is so convoluted. The Supra was glorified as a car far more than it ever deserved. It was never as good as people remember it being. So nothing made today would ever make people happy. The NSX crashed and burned trying to be something it is not. This new Supra has yet to write its story, but if I were to judge it by the styling alone, it looks like it is trying to hard. It is VERY japanese looking which is not a bad thing, but it lacks the finesse of the 90s Supra and the 90's FDRX7.

I am sure if they put most of the tricks learned in developing the FRS into his car they will have a competent machine, but the lack of a manual just tells you how far they have strayed from the right path.
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Old Yesterday, 09:05 PM   #530
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Originally Posted by quentinberg007 View Post
That is something Iíve pondered lately. Why are people so obsessed with having the fastest car around a track or in a drag? None of us debating the merits of this car are professional racers. We donít get to work faster or win money by buying a car that gets to 60 a half second quicker. Why wrap up so much money in a slightly more capable sports car when it is vastly underutilized on the street and 99% of us would get better lap times by doing more driver training?
To be honest, most people donít want to throw down $50k-$60k only to have some douche canoe in his camaro, mustang, corvette, cpoíd M series hand it to him on public roads and freeways. Letís be real, most wont track a car or even do spirtited drives. Most dick around on the streets and freeways.

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Originally Posted by Hondaslayer View Post
If you want the cheapest means to go fast / best performance for the buck etc.... why even shop new cars? Let some idiot take the hit then dump more money into go faster bits. That new car feeling last a few weeks at most. First door ding/scratch/chip etc... and it's gone.
This guys gets it.
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Old Yesterday, 09:11 PM   #531
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Originally Posted by shikataganai View Post
It's because we don't buy cars in a vacuum. We buy them to show off to our buddies, and quoting 'Ring times or 0-60 is one way to dick swing over the BBQ.


We do generally use them in a vacuum, though. I guess I donít get how buying something that you ultimately had no part in developing or building gives you any dick to swing.

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Originally Posted by godfather2112 View Post
To be honest, most people donít want to throw down $50k-$60k only to have some douche canoe in his camaro, mustang, corvette, cpoíd M series hand it to him on public roads and freeways. Letís be real, most wont track a car or even do spirtited drives. Most dick around on the streets and freeways.

But if you enjoy the aesthetics and the way the slower car drives, who gives a **** what some douche canoe who wants to street race you thinks?

Last edited by quentinberg007; Yesterday at 09:19 PM.
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Old Yesterday, 09:55 PM   #532
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Originally Posted by quentinberg007 View Post
We do generally use them in a vacuum, though. I guess I donít get how buying something that you ultimately had no part in developing or building gives you any dick to swing.

One could ask the same questions about rooting for professional sports teams...
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Old Yesterday, 10:25 PM   #533
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For me, there are a couple of reasons I care about the car's performance even if I'm never going to utilize it to full capacity legally regularly.

1) I don't buy anything unless I think it's the best my money can buy. I'm extremely price sensitive to most things. Performance in cars enables the following, so getting the best deal is important
2) I enjoy driving fast. I do it legally and illegally, and right up to the razor edge in both cases. There's a right hand turn here that I routinely take at 60 and try to push that boundary. It's not blind and I can see people coming, but there's no way I don't end up in the other lane going that fast with all 4 wheels broken loose. Adrenaline is an addictions of mine. The more reckless, the bigger the rush.
3) I enjoy feeling superior to people and there's nothing more satisfying than someone pulling up next to me with the same ego complex and coming out the victor. I don't egg people on to race, but when they do it to me, I get damn near sex levels of satisfaction beating them.

I'd prefer to buy only new cars, just because I'm a romantic about it. Something special to me when you're the only driver of a brand new vehicle. Otherwise, yeah, used market is definitely the way to go.

Last edited by BeepBoop; Yesterday at 10:30 PM.
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Old Yesterday, 10:30 PM   #534
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One could ask the same questions about rooting for professional sports teams...

Not going to get an argument from me on that. I have coworkers/friends/neighbors that will get so pissed off about the trajectory of the local college football team and it is super weird to me. They are adults in their 40s and 50s screaming about how kids in their early 20s messed up a play.
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Old Yesterday, 10:38 PM   #535
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So it's quicker, lighter, more powerful, and cheaper.
And it took 20 years to get it marginally quicker, marginally lighter, marginally more powerful (stock) and .... NOT cheaper?

--kC
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Old Yesterday, 10:42 PM   #536
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And it took 20 years to get it marginally quicker, marginally lighter, marginally more powerful (stock) and .... NOT cheaper?

--kC


Inflation adjusted for 20 years it is considerably cheaper.
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Old Yesterday, 10:49 PM   #537
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Originally Posted by quentinberg007 View Post
Inflation adjusted for 20 years it is considerably cheaper.
If you're going to apply that to this car, ALL cars are extremely cheap considering the improvements they've made, the standard equipment they come with, and the cost of them now vs inflation of yesteryear.
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Old Yesterday, 10:57 PM   #538
shikataganai
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Originally Posted by BeepBoop View Post
For me, there are a couple of reasons I care about the car's performance even if I'm never going to utilize it to full capacity legally regularly.

1) I don't buy anything unless I think it's the best my money can buy. I'm extremely price sensitive to most things. Performance in cars enables the following, so getting the best deal is important
2) I enjoy driving fast. I do it legally and illegally, and right up to the razor edge in both cases. There's a right hand turn here that I routinely take at 60 and try to push that boundary. It's not blind and I can see people coming, but there's no way I don't end up in the other lane going that fast with all 4 wheels broken loose. Adrenaline is an addictions of mine. The more reckless, the bigger the rush.
3) I enjoy feeling superior to people and there's nothing more satisfying than someone pulling up next to me with the same ego complex and coming out the victor. I don't egg people on to race, but when they do it to me, I get damn near sex levels of satisfaction beating them.

I'd prefer to buy only new cars, just because I'm a romantic about it. Something special to me when you're the only driver of a brand new vehicle. Otherwise, yeah, used market is definitely the way to go.

Go spend some time in a trauma ICU and grow the **** up.
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Old Yesterday, 11:09 PM   #539
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Originally Posted by shikataganai View Post
Go spend some time in a trauma ICU and grow the **** up.

Don't bother with the troll... He's made only 8 post on NASIOC, and all of them exist on this thread. He's just a fool trying to piss people off.
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Old Yesterday, 11:20 PM   #540
thill
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Originally Posted by BeepBoop View Post
For me, there are a couple of reasons I care about the car's performance even if I'm never going to utilize it to full capacity legally regularly.

1) I don't buy anything unless I think it's the best my money can buy. I'm extremely price sensitive to most things. Performance in cars enables the following, so getting the best deal is important
2) I enjoy driving fast. I do it legally and illegally, and right up to the razor edge in both cases. There's a right hand turn here that I routinely take at 60 and try to push that boundary. It's not blind and I can see people coming, but there's no way I don't end up in the other lane going that fast with all 4 wheels broken loose. Adrenaline is an addictions of mine. The more reckless, the bigger the rush.
3) I enjoy feeling superior to people and there's nothing more satisfying than someone pulling up next to me with the same ego complex and coming out the victor. I don't egg people on to race, but when they do it to me, I get damn near sex levels of satisfaction beating them.

I'd prefer to buy only new cars, just because I'm a romantic about it. Something special to me when you're the only driver of a brand new vehicle. Otherwise, yeah, used market is definitely the way to go.
Your one special snowflake aren't you??
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Old Yesterday, 11:22 PM   #541
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Originally Posted by heavyD View Post
Problem with Camaros is that when you aren't driving them really fast they kind of blow because they are massive cars and visibility is poor. Worst of all they are hideously ugly with the new front end. The Mustang is great and all providing you option up for the Recaro seats and track pack which adds considerable price and I'm sure I'm not the only former Mustang owner that wasn't exactly enamoured with the quality of build that comes out of Flat Rock. The Supra will be smaller, lighter, as fast or faster and of higher quality. The if you want to save $5k and get an equal performing, lower quality car then have at it. Some people want a nicer car over the cheapest means to go fast.
+1 for truth. for spirited driving, I think the Camaro 1SS 1LE is unbeatable when it comes to new car value. it is an absolute joy to drive on a windy, desolate road. in the city, it's a nightmare. i can't see ****, the nose is long, and it's really wide.

for me personally, I just can't get rid of it. i keep considering trading it in for something else, but nothing i've driven can touch that spirited driving experience for ~$50k. i gave up trying to convince myself to get rid of it and just bought a older lexus as a daily.

i bet the Supra is a lot nicer as a daily, but so are lots of other cars. doesn't seem that much better/cheaper than a Lexus RC 350, and those sold like ****.
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Old Today, 12:09 AM   #542
hkerekes
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Originally Posted by nate.the.great View Post
+1 for truth. for spirited driving, I think the Camaro 1SS 1LE is unbeatable when it comes to new car value. it is an absolute joy to drive on a windy, desolate road. in the city, it's a nightmare. i can't see ****, the nose is long, and it's really wide.

for me personally, I just can't get rid of it. i keep considering trading it in for something else, but nothing i've driven can touch that spirited driving experience for ~$50k. i gave up trying to convince myself to get rid of it and just bought a older lexus as a daily.

i bet the Supra is a lot nicer as a daily, but so are lots of other cars. doesn't seem that much better/cheaper than a Lexus RC 350, and those sold like ****.
This.


Its exactly why i still daily my boss 302. Yeah its wide, long, and terrible to park but its a ****ing riot to drive. Now that my commute to work is long it kind of sucks but whatever. The main problem is the coilover stiffness and the suspension noise.

I hope to get an ev for commuting to make it more tolerable.
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Old Today, 12:22 AM   #543
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Originally Posted by quentinberg007 View Post
Not going to get an argument from me on that. I have coworkers/friends/neighbors that will get so pissed off about the trajectory of the local college football team and it is super weird to me. They are adults in their 40s and 50s screaming about how kids in their early 20s messed up a play.
I usually interpret their over obsession as a lack of being busy with worthwhile things in their lives.
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Old Today, 02:07 AM   #544
nate.the.great
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This.


Its exactly why i still daily my boss 302. Yeah its wide, long, and terrible to park but its a ****ing riot to drive. Now that my commute to work is long it kind of sucks but whatever. The main problem is the coilover stiffness and the suspension noise.

I hope to get an ev for commuting to make it more tolerable.
somehow over time the annoying parts almost become endearing. the kids see riding in it as a treat, and when my son has a bad day, we drive until he's ready to talk. i can't help but smile every single time i drive it. so many other cars like my B8 S4 felt so competent, but driving it never elicited any emotion. i also never realized how many other people enjoy seeing an american muscle car just out and about. (it's almost always old white people, but that's ok, haha)

i still remember the first time I ever saw and heard a boss mustang. it was back in '96 so maybe it was the Shinoda? either way, they fired it up indoors during a demo at the Ford HQ in Dearborn, and it was awesome. i'm sure that perfect automotive mix of sound, feel, look, public reaction, etc... is different for every person, but man once you find it, it's hard to let go no matter how annoying it is.

EV sounds like a good choice, I would have gone that route as well, but we're out of garage spots, and I didn't want to charge it outdoors.
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