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02-14-2013, 02:56 PM | #126 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 283711
Join Date: May 2011
Chapter/Region:
NESIC
Location: Newport
Vehicle:2012 STI sedan Black with scratches |
I ordered parts for my AWIC today from frozenboost and summit. Corky Bell's book was good like 20 years ago, a lot has changed. He even says in the book that AWIC setups are no good/unreliable for daily drivers, and he has a total boner for VATN turbos that are impractical. All that book is good for is learning that compressed air is hot, you should use an intercooler and some other basics about how an engine works.
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02-21-2013, 05:42 PM | #127 |
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Join Date: May 2011
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NESIC
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I mounted my pump up today, I can't weld so this is what I ended up with
I used 1/8th in. aluminum bar stock to actually mount it to the car. It's suspended by the 2 bars on the top and held in it's mount with neoprene wrapped bolts. I did it like that so that vibration from the car wouldn't shake the pump up as much. |
02-21-2013, 05:45 PM | #128 |
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Join Date: May 2011
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NESIC
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There is still about 1/4" of space above the bolt heads underneath the ballast for the HID.
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03-05-2013, 09:38 AM | #129 |
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Vehicle:07 FXT 4eat vf37 Obsidian Black Pearl |
I'm starting to collect parts for my AWIC project and I have one question- how are you wiring the pump?
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03-05-2013, 03:07 PM | #130 |
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Join Date: May 2009
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MAIC
Location: York, pa
Vehicle:2002 hybrid 16gxt '03 Lifted TS |
I used one of those "add a fuse" deals in the dash fuse box. That allows me to unplug it if needed.
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03-05-2013, 03:44 PM | #131 |
Scooby Newbie
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Are you using the bilge pump or the Bosch pump? Do you know how much current it draws?
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03-05-2013, 08:42 PM | #132 |
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Member#: 210371
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MAIC
Location: York, pa
Vehicle:2002 hybrid 16gxt '03 Lifted TS |
I'm using the Bosch Cobra pump. No idea what it draws.
Scratch that. Looked on their website and it says it will draw 2.5 to 3.5 amps with 317GPH. http://www.frozenboost.com/product_i...5c2760e01416c1 |
03-10-2013, 05:16 PM | #133 |
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I built a wiring harness for the pump, the pump and relay are fused, and the fans for the heat exchanger are also relayed/fused on a separate circuit. I have a switch inside the car to turn the fans on or off if my water temp goes above ambient. I'll be able to put up some more pics of my build when I get my car back tomorrow. I popped the motor and got a built block dropped in.
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03-10-2013, 05:20 PM | #134 |
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I'm using the meziere wp136s which is a purpose built remote water pump, they're designed to be run continuously and have a better tolerance for higher operating temps. Even though my pump is mounted inside of my fender it still gets hot in there. I don't have any idea what the current draw is, but the pump comes with a 20a fuse, so never more than that. I upgraded my alternator to a 270a dc power engineering one a while ago so I don't have to sweat adding anything electrical to my car.
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03-10-2013, 05:24 PM | #135 |
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It's just a 30a relay with 2 fuses, one 20a to the battery, and one 5a to the relay coil hotside. I heatshrink and solder everything. |
03-10-2013, 05:26 PM | #136 |
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I put all of my extra relays underneath my engine bay fuse panel, it just pops right up if you release all of the tabs around it, and then put a little bit of foam tape around the relays so they don't vibrate around all over the place. It keeps everything clean, safe and in one place in case you need to t/s a blown fuse or relay on stuff you added to the car.
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03-10-2013, 05:37 PM | #137 |
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You don't even have to use a soldering iron on this stuff either, you can just use a cheap butane torch like I do, AND you can use that on your heatshrink. It's way faster than using an iron, the harnesses only took me like 10 minutes to build once I set out all of my materials.
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07-15-2013, 11:03 AM | #138 |
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What is the longest (to fill the whole bumper opening without showing end tanks) heat exchanger made? I still am really interested in this on my daily but not sure if it would be an advantage to a fmic. I also don't really like having to take the fmic off every time I want to do something but even this is easier than a sti one to take off.
Also, what is the largest that fits up there? The type 14 (I believe) that everyone uses is really small it seems. Eventually I will be upgrading to a full race twin scroll Borg Warner 8070 and want to future proof anything I do. I like this idea a lot but I'm a little worrie dab out hot humid Chicago summers and traffic etc and it heat soaking? I'm speed density so I gotta keep temps under control quickly. |
07-15-2013, 06:07 PM | #139 | |
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Quote:
We have a heat exchanger design that was designed to fit a subaru like a big front mount...so like 28" across on the core. Shoot a pm if you want pricing info. |
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08-05-2013, 02:35 PM | #140 | |
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Quote:
I do not like heat exchangers with tubes and end tanks like a radiator. If you use an infrared thermometer you can see that the temperatures are highest in between the inlet and outlet and lowest towards the corners away from the inlet and outlet. To me, this says that the flow has stagnated at the corners and those parts are not effectively exchanging heat. That's just my experience, others may have different findings. : ) |
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08-11-2013, 03:33 PM | #141 |
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^^ I like it. I also know people that swear by oil coolers in some type of series. Most of the aftermarket SC heat exchanger makers build them like mini intercoolers, however. Probably a good part of that is due to ease of fabrication.
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05-17-2014, 09:40 AM | #142 |
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Vehicle:2010 LR WRX MPS powered. |
Off topic, but has anyone used the existing AC system to cool the water? I'm thinking like a high pressure/low pressure chiller. Obviously using water alone wouldn't work in a system like this due to freezing, and that means you lose the thermal conductivity of water as well. A 50/50 mix of ethylene glycol and water may be the best idea (propylene glycol is less thermally conductive IIRC) due to its thermal conductivity and relatively non-corrosive nature. Utilizing the existing pump and possibly removing the cabin AC should keep power loss to a minimum, especially on a heavily modified engine. The other thing I see is an issue with the JWAC/water-air intercooler. Obviously if you lose thermal conductivity properties of the fluid, you must increase size. I'm thinking maybe 2.5-3 times as large.
Also, why not utilize some existing engine system to pump the water? Hydraulic motor running off the lubrication system? The only issue I see is that flow will increase with engine RPM. You don't necessarily want excessive flow because the cooling fluid needs time to absorb intake heat. A variable flow control valve should solve the issue and I don't see how an aftermarket EMS wouldn't be able to control it. Pardon my thinking out loud, but this thread really got me thinking about reducing IAT's. I know that some people are going to say you're better off using a nitrous or water sprayer or something of the sort, but I don't want to discuss something already in use today, I want to discuss something that, feasible or not, could advance the industry. |
05-17-2014, 06:09 PM | #143 | |
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Quote:
peltier coolers and a thermostat on the tank would be far easier, simpler, less complicated and work better the reason things like this arent done are that they are way too complex and failure prone,,,which is why air/liquid intercoolers arent used much on production vehicles |
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05-18-2014, 06:20 PM | #144 |
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Killerchiller. Works, proven technology. Complex.
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05-27-2014, 12:32 AM | #145 | |
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Quote:
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05-29-2014, 11:50 PM | #146 |
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Vehicle:2002 WRX |
Scotty's talking about a peltier to cool the water in an AWIC system, not to use it as an intercooler.
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06-01-2014, 01:55 AM | #147 | |
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Quote:
There HAVE been systems that used the AC compressor for intercooling, Ford used one on one of their show Mustangs as I recall. They chilled a reservoir and it could be used for short bursts "on demand" if memory serves. It was only good for short bursts. I think, but am not sure, that Mercedes has also done something with freon intercoolers with some of their supercharged cars. Heat is heat though and all you end up doing is moving it from one place to another, it has to be radiated so long pulls are tough. At least with water you can up the capacity to sink heat with a larger water tank and ice works for drag racing. Weight is a problem though... |
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06-08-2014, 06:47 PM | #148 | |
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Quote:
Anyways, it'll be cheaper, easier and less complex to use the existing A/C system. |
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06-13-2014, 09:26 PM | #149 | |
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Quote:
The AC seems a good way to go but I don't think it'll be continuous cooling, don't forget the load from the compressor when it's running and it won't like high RPM. |
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06-15-2014, 09:02 PM | #150 |
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It cools the water down below ambient while you are cruising around, obviously it won't work at wot because the ecu disables the ac clutch. It would be akin to having an $800 endless bag of ice and would be awesome if you daily your car. I already sit at 6* above ambient and as soon as I spray meth it drops it 20* or more below ambient. If I already had the turbo I want I would be putting this in my car right now. Got a spot picked out for it and everything. Peltiers burn out quick if you can't keep them cool and they draw a lot of power which would require a larger alt. feasible for me since I already have one, but not a lot of people are willing to drop $600 for a 270A alt. on top of that peltiers are suuuuuper inefficient. I already use my ac when it's hot so why not...
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