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Old 05-10-2013, 04:31 PM   #26
wrx wagone
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Dunno about the rest of those mods, but the Tein coilovers will be the bottleneck.
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Old 05-10-2013, 04:43 PM   #27
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Potato.
Dear Sir, I wish to subscribe to your newsletter. Sarah on the switchboard says your line rings busy. Please write back at your convenience.

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Old 05-10-2013, 05:27 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrx wagone View Post
Dunno about the rest of those mods, but the Tein coilovers will be the bottleneck.
you're right, I have Teins on my Miata and it doesn't even make 100hp.
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Old 05-10-2013, 05:29 PM   #29
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Dear Sir, I wish to subscribe to your newsletter. Sarah on the switchboard says your line rings busy. Please write back at your convenience.

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You wasted money on your new logo.
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Old 05-12-2013, 12:12 PM   #30
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Nothing to really talk about. It seemed to be going well. Ran into a few boost leaks. Fixed most of them, however I still have a pretty good one. The BOV is leaking pretty good at higher boost levels. We ran a boost leak test and I could feel air coming out of it around 20 psi and far more at 25psi. ( i didnt really check it at anything under 20).

We kept turning up the boost controller to see if it would help at all. No dice. Torque would increase but it would still taper down to 15-16 psi by redline.. On the last run I turned the controller down by 3 full turns. HP stayed the exact same but lost 20 ft lbs because the peak boost was lower. The torque peak in this session was 284ftlbs. but turned it down to 264ftlbs.

This turbo should hold 23 easy and only taper to about 20 by redline but I am seeing high peak but boost levels drop quick to around 15... even with this ***** boost leak the car put an end result of 259awhp and 264awtq. Once I square this leak away I will go back and turn it back up a bit. should be in the 280 neighborhood which is what I was expecting.

Also keep in mind the humidity was quite high since it was raining on and off and sometimes down pouring.. Def not power making conditions.

This dual piston design of the Forge BOV confuses me. They offer different spring rates for the large spring (it has the blue one rated for 23-30psi in there) but the one that seems ta have the problem is the smaller one. There is a chamfer type seal (good seal/weak spring) for the small piston and then just a thin walled cylinder mating to a flat surface for the larger piston (terrible seal/good spring).. WTF Forge.. The small piston is so easy to push up, once that moves it relies on a very thin wall pushing down on a flat surface to seal which is not an adequate sealing surface...

Last edited by naCAnItihS; 05-12-2013 at 12:17 PM.
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Old 05-12-2013, 12:20 PM   #31
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BPV FTW

Quote from Tom at Wicked when I asked about a particular BOV...."They all leak".
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Old 05-12-2013, 12:32 PM   #32
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My JDM bpv was solid upwards of 25 psi. I am now using a tial q that hasn't leaked yet.
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Old 05-12-2013, 02:13 PM   #33
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IME, no VF will hold that much boost at redline even on a 2.0, but it should be higher than you are seeing

Were those numbers corrected or uncorrected? What was the WCF?

The Forge valve spring is for keeping it shut at idle. I see them leak often under boost leak tests, but not really too bad in actual use. It should be easy to know if it has a boost leak or not, as the MAF voltage would be artificially high and the car would be running much richer than expected whenever it was leaking.

With the VF22 being an ancient turbo, I would look at the wastegate and make sure it is not worn out.

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Old 05-12-2013, 06:12 PM   #34
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I'll pretty much echo what Matt has already said. Most VF's on 205's sit around 16-18 psi at redline. But remember, top end boost isn't always an indication of power or airflow either

I'm curious if those numbers were corrected or not and what the WCF was. Also, just like Matt said if the BOV is leaking, the car just runs inexplicably rich with inflated g/s.
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Old 05-12-2013, 09:04 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by Georgethefierce View Post
you're right, I have Teins on my Miata and it doesn't even make 100hp.
Exactly.
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Old 05-12-2013, 09:43 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naCAnItihS View Post
end result of 259awhp and 264awtq

hrm...

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Originally Posted by Black94Snake View Post
I don't think it'll break 260. Mustang dynos always read low.
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Originally Posted by BlazeRex View Post
Also, just like Matt said if the BOV is leaking, the car just runs inexplicably rich with inflated g/s.
If it's a BOV, yes... BPV, not so much. I guess it all depends on how he has it setup.
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Old 05-12-2013, 10:16 PM   #37
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I've had VF39s and 22s easily hold 20 psi right out to redline on 2.0s. The car definitely has some boost leaks, not sure how much the BOV is playing into it. It falls to 15 psi quick, right when it should be making peak hp. If it would hold at least 18, it'd make 275 whp. I just did one a few weeks back that made 278 on a vf39. Good point on the wastegate Matt, that's something else worth checking out. Oh and this is uncorrected, corrected was 3 whp less, the weather was nasty.

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Old 05-12-2013, 11:34 PM   #38
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hrm...

If it's a BOV, yes... BPV, not so much. I guess it all depends on how he has it setup.
You had me, he didn't break 260, but he said he had a BOV and it was leaking I'm assuming he means atmospheric.

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Originally Posted by JTPerryR1 View Post
I've had VF39s and 22s easily hold 20 psi right out to redline on 2.0s. The car definitely has some boost leaks, not sure how much the BOV is playing into it. It falls to 15 psi quick, right when it should be making peak hp. If it would hold at least 18, it'd make 275 whp. I just did one a few weeks back that made 278 on a vf39. Good point on the wastegate Matt, that's something else worth checking out. Oh and this is uncorrected, corrected was 3 whp less, the weather was nasty.
Logs? I've personally never seen this in real life. I've only heard of one instance, ever. I in all honesty would love to see that done in a 3rd gear pull.

Also, you really can't compare uncorrected to corrected at all. Then everyone would be going on the dyno when its 10* out and making 20whp extra consistently on their stage 2 cars I will almost always go by the corrected numbers. They're not perfectly adjusted, but they're much better than uncorrected in preventing huge power swings from summer to winter, providing a much better measuring instrument.
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Old 05-13-2013, 09:06 AM   #39
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Quite a rough day in General, Weather and the entire day just seemed against us. Very interested to see what you're making after the boost leaks are taken care of, I would really like to see you at 270-285.
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Old 05-13-2013, 10:38 AM   #40
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hrm...

If it's a BOV, yes... BPV, not so much. I guess it all depends on how he has it setup.
Yes Keith it is an actual BOV not a BPV. It is the Forge Dual-Piston BOV. It has the blue (23-30 psi spring with one shim). I also took it apart after the dyno and cleaned it, re-greased the o-rings, and cleaned up the sealing surfaces with some 400 then 2000 grit sand paper. I also replaced the gasket with and STI one (steel core with the black material over it). It came in a full engine gasket set from subaru.

Seems to hold about 1.6 BAR in 4th for quite a while (havent gone to redline with it yet).

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Quite a rough day in General, Weather and the entire day just seemed against us. Very interested to see what you're making after the boost leaks are taken care of, I would really like to see you at 270-285.
Well maybe Ill just scrap the whole thing Allen haha. Id like to see what you make after an intercooler upgrade. Sux blowing up the OEM one haha
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Old 05-13-2013, 10:39 AM   #41
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Also the JDM gears in the trans have a much shorter gear ratio than the USDM trans. Maybe I should be doing 4th gear pulls?
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Old 05-13-2013, 10:48 AM   #42
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Well maybe Ill just scrap the whole thing Allen haha. Id like to see what you make after an intercooler upgrade. Sux blowing up the OEM one haha
That is if I can manage to get one, haha. I'd really like to see decent numbers out of my car with a new intercooler. Subaru really dropped the ball on changing the design. I was happy with my torque numbers though, they seemed pretty spot on.

Interesting idea talking about the gear set, maybe you should be doing 4th gear pulls. Also did you try the red spring at all? Any luck?
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Old 05-13-2013, 10:56 AM   #43
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That is if I can manage to get one, haha. I'd really like to see decent numbers out of my car with a new intercooler. Subaru really dropped the ball on changing the design. I was happy with my torque numbers though, they seemed pretty spot on.

Interesting idea talking about the gear set, maybe you should be doing 4th gear pulls. Also did you try the red spring at all? Any luck?

Ya I tried it. Does the same thing but doesnt blow off until 14 psi or so.. so I took it back out so it doesnt ruin the turbo.
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Old 05-13-2013, 10:58 AM   #44
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Ya I tried it. Does the same thing but doesnt blow off until 14 psi or so.. so I took it back out so it doesnt ruin the turbo.
Wow thats a little high! Hopefully you can figure something out. Weird design on Forge's part.
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Old 05-13-2013, 11:31 AM   #45
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All that futzing around w springs and shims is why I try and get everyone to use a normal BPV unless they have a dire need for a atmospheric valve. You end up having to shim the **** out of it and then you get poor low boost ventilation.

What are your actual gear ratios and effective FD? That will tell you if you should do pulls in 3rd or 4th.

If the boost is dropping hard, and its not a huge obvious boost leak, it is likely the wastegate. A drop like that would be near untuneable if it was all boost leak related IMO.

Good luck getting your mechanical issues sorted out, that is my least favorite part about tuning in general.

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Old 05-13-2013, 12:32 PM   #46
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All that futzing around w springs and shims is why I try and get everyone to use a normal BPV unless they have a dire need for a atmospheric valve. You end up having to shim the **** out of it and then you get poor low boost ventilation.
I love my Perrin BPV. fits awesome and doesn't give me any BS.
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Old 05-13-2013, 04:24 PM   #47
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Why not just cap the OEM one? For the $1.00 or so I spent on it, it works wonderful.
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Old 05-13-2013, 05:37 PM   #48
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Why not just cap the OEM one? For the $1.00 or so I spent on it, it works wonderful.
Cap??
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Old 05-13-2013, 09:32 PM   #49
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Cap??
Cap off the pressure source on the face and drill into the side of the body of the valve.
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Old 05-14-2013, 10:24 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by BlazeRex View Post
Cap off the pressure source on the face and drill into the side of the body of the valve.
That sounds completely stupid. Sry to be blunt but no.


Figured out the problem. I put a cheater spring on the WG actuator, and ran a hose from the compressor to the WG and it boosted 1BAR (14.7psi) the whole way. I then hooked up the MBCS and Peaked a bit high 1.8bar (26psi) but held 1.4bar (20psi) to redline.

Thanks Matt for suggesting the WG might be crap. Looks like I need to get an aftermarket one and upgrade the stock 8psi actuator to a 15psi actuator.


Also, the gear set is a Version 6 type RA Gear Ratio: (Ratios -- 3.083 / 2.062 / 1.545 / 1.151 / 0.825) 3.90FD

Last edited by naCAnItihS; 05-14-2013 at 10:32 AM.
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