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Old 02-06-2010, 10:32 AM   #51
424wrx
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nobody wants that mess. ugly cracker box. keep it overseas.
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Old 02-06-2010, 11:10 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a2cpc View Post
I am not a large fan of the Smart for anything but city driving, but I can't believe the way people rag on this car. I would love to see what the c class would look like if it had the same wreck with a vehicle twice its size.(C-Class 3567LBS, Smart 1900+lbs). Little guy always looses.
It would look far better b/c it has a crumple zone. We already went over that.
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Old 02-06-2010, 11:13 AM   #53
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And the smart car is smaller than....everything, so it always loses.

Quote:
Originally Posted by a2cpc View Post
I am not a large fan of the Smart for anything but city driving, but I can't believe the way people rag on this car. I would love to see what the c class would look like if it had the same wreck with a vehicle twice its size.(C-Class 3567LBS, Smart 1900+lbs). Little guy always looses.
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Old 02-06-2010, 06:51 PM   #54
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Quote:
But yeah, there are cheaper, safer, nearly as efficient alternatives on the market. Toyota Yaris, Nissan Versa, Honda Fit, Ford Fiesta, et
Indeed; I don't see the point of the Smart when there is no price or fuel economy savings over larger, more practical cars. Its only big plus is easier city parking.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JuggernautTCW View Post
- the crash test video was smart vs c300 which isnt considered as a "large vehicle on American roads".
Yup; I had a C as a loaner a few times and it was not much bigger than our Impreza
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Old 02-06-2010, 10:34 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragnapebble View Post
I purchased a 2008 smart fortwo 3 weeks ago and we're very please with the car.

To the person who only got 36 mpg: you must have a lead foot or don't know how to shift properly. We Average 43 mpg and once we add cruise control we expect it to be around 50, based on other owner's experiences.

To the people who don't think this car is safe? Did you see the Youtube video of the Top Gear test? They ran a smart at 70mph head-on into a concrete barrier. Due to the excellent Tridion cell design the tester was able to open and close the passengers side door! Try that with any other car!
Here's the link to the video:
Also see the safeandsmart.com site for stories of people who have been in crashes with their smart cars. One crash witness, a state policeman, said that in any other car the people would have been killed.

You must admit that insurance companies are hard-headed businessmen. Well, the full coverage cost on our almost new smart car compared to our 1996 Saturn that died? It only went up $200/year. A testament to the real world insurance company data in the last two years about how safe and comparatively cheap they are to repair!

So everyone, please hold your opinions unless they're based on actual experience, not prejudice!

OK, now hit me with your best shot! !

Jack
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Old 02-06-2010, 11:38 PM   #56
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Apparently the Mercedes engineers in California (where the smart was initially designed in 93-94), found a way around your "Laws of Physics"! Read the smart owners crash stories that disprove your thinking at safeandsmart.com. Or you could just continue in blissful ignorance.
Seriously... please read the letters.

Jack
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Old 02-06-2010, 11:55 PM   #57
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Seems SMART is pretty proud of these Californian engineers... .

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Old 02-07-2010, 02:05 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragnapebble View Post
I purchased a 2008 smart fortwo 3 weeks ago and we're very please with the car.

To the person who only got 36 mpg: you must have a lead foot or don't know how to shift properly. We Average 43 mpg and once we add cruise control we expect it to be around 50, based on other owner's experiences.

To the people who don't think this car is safe?
Did you see the Youtube video of the Top Gear test? They ran a smart at 70mph head-on into a concrete barrier. Due to the excellent Tridion cell design the tester was able to open and close the passengers side door! Try that with any other car!
Here's the link to the video: YouTube- Smart Car Crash Test
Also see the safeandsmart.com site for stories of people who have been in crashes with their smart cars. One crash witness, a state policeman, said that in any other car the people would have been killed.

You must admit that insurance companies are hard-headed businessmen. Well, the full coverage cost on our almost new smart car compared to our 1996 Saturn that died? It only went up $200/year. A testament to the real world insurance company data in the last two years about how safe and comparatively cheap they are to repair!

So everyone, please hold your opinions unless they're based on actual experience, not prejudice!

OK, now hit me with your best shot! !

Jack
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragnapebble View Post
OK,

I just got all the expected rebuttal arguments re "no crumple zone', "head on crash at a combined speed of 140", etc.
When Jay Leno took a smart car for a test drive he commented on its small size being a problem in a bad crash. Then he made the excellent point that since it is so small and handles so well, you're much more likely to avoid that bad crash in this car compared to many "land cruisers".
So I'll still bet on my ability to avoid a crash in this car, rather than be in a Hummer and say 'to hell with the little guy, I'll be OK".

As Subaru owners you likely already have seen their excellent handling help you to avoid an accident.
My wife and I are "empty nesters", so the smart car is all we need most of the time. We have a Chrysler minivan for the times we need the space.
Our troops are dying in Iraq and Afghanistan because of our need for foreign oil. Elaine and I are trying to help cut our dependence in any way we can.
A valid argument could be made that people buying Hummers, etc are committing treason! Sorry, a little off-topic there. But seeing one person commuting to work in a huge vehicle Really makes me mad... some people are selfish to the point of insanity!

If you were to go to the smartcarofamerica.com site you'd see that a lot of owners love this car.

Jack
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragnapebble View Post
Obviously this is like religion or politics, people believe what they believe and that it!
I'll just make one more comment. Here's a letter from a smart car crash survivor, posted on the safeandsmart.com site:

Few people can say that their car saved their life but I CAN! Last October, I was on my way to work about 4:00 am, driving about 60 to 65 mph, southbound, on a freeway, when my beautiful blue smart fortwo, which was only 6 months old, smashed head-on into the middle of a "parked" truck that was facing westbound across two lanes. The truck had been involved in a prior accident. This truck had rear-ended another truck and then spun around across two freeway lanes. Neither of these trucks had any lights on. No interior or hazard lights... nothing. No warning for me as I came speeding across a hill and into what I thought at the time was a wall because of how hard the impact was. When I tried to open the door, I looked down and saw that my left wrist was broken (due to how I had been holding the steering wheel). I reached over with my right hand and opened my door with no problems. As I crossed the freeway, I saw my hazard lights were flashing away. They were the only lights anyone could see. This ensured that no one else was going to be blindsided. The police officer that came to the emergency room of the hospital to give me the accident report said, "I've never seen a small car like yours hold up so well. Most people don't walk away from a head-on collision like yours even in a regular sized car. We usually pry people out cars your size but your little car did not collapse in on you. Amazing, since you hit a parked vehicle on the freeway!" I told him that I specifically checked out the accident ratings on the smart car before I purchased it but little did I know that I was going to be the "dummy" that you see in accident experiments in horrific crashes. The entire front end of my car was gone to the doors. From the doors back, you would never know that I was in a crash. Even the roof had no damage.
I couldn't wait to buy another smart fortwo using the insurance funds. Luckily, I was able to buy another smart fortwo in the same color as the one I lost and I didn't have to wait another year! But...I would have!
Karen Spahn

So I'll bet on my smart fortwo in an accident over all other small cars and most larger ones!

Jack
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragnapebble View Post
Apparently the Mercedes engineers in California (where the smart was initially designed in 93-94), found a way around your "Laws of Physics"! Read the smart owners crash stories that disprove your thinking at safeandsmart.com. Or you could just continue in blissful ignorance.
Seriously... please read the letters.

Jack
Total Posts
Total Posts: 4
Posts Per Day: 3.05



SmartUSA Shill / IP check... please.



Also, that YouTube video you posted is the edited version that omits the extremely negative conclusion.

Here's the rest:
http://www.YouTube.com/watch?v=ju6t-yyoU8s#t=3m35s

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fifth Gear
Tiff: Perhaps most surprising was the obvious energy absorbing properties of the concrete. The Corsa's greater mass moved the blocks more than the Smart; but in both cases the concrete didn't necessarily deliver the killer blow you might have thought.

Vicki: But, here's the rub. The cars may have stood up to the severity of the crash surprisingly well, but the humans inside wouldn't. No matter what you drive, rapidly decelerating from higher speeds is something your internal organs simply cannot cope with. The chilling truth is: the people inside both cars would have been very unlikely to have survived.

Tiff: So, how much stick can a Smart take? A lot; but that can't be said for its passengers.
Whether you're a corporate shill for Smart USA or an overly enthusiastic owner, the blood of every person sold (by your use of propaganda) on the "safety" of the Smart Fortwo that is critically or fatally wounded in a Smart crash, is on your hands.
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Old 02-07-2010, 02:41 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragnapebble View Post
Our troops are dying in Iraq and Afghanistan because of our need for foreign oil. Elaine and I are trying to help cut our dependence in any way we can.
A valid argument could be made that people buying Hummers, etc are committing treason!
Why do I get the odd impression that you teach English lit at a community college somewhere?
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Old 02-07-2010, 03:55 AM   #60
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Oh come on, the driver would just walk away from this!
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Old 02-07-2010, 04:00 AM   #61
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The Smart Cars always reminded me of Captain Pikes roller chair thing from old Star Trek...

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Old 02-07-2010, 10:15 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HB_Dad View Post


Oh come on, the driver would just walk away from this!
Maybe it it was a Smart he would have.
I find two things funny with all this:
1. the inexplicable pathological hatred. I haven't seen anything so irrational since a black guy tried to sit at a lunch counter in Alabama.
2. Scrappy and company are the first to holler about vehicle choice when anyone baggs on SUV or other large wasteful cars.
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Old 02-07-2010, 10:20 AM   #63
Len
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragnapebble View Post
Apparently the Mercedes engineers in California (where the smart was initially designed in 93-94), found a way around your "Laws of Physics"! Read the smart owners crash stories that disprove your thinking at safeandsmart.com. Or you could just continue in blissful ignorance.
Seriously... please read the letters.

Jack
I think you should enjoy your Smart as what it is, a cute boutique euro sub-mini. But you should really know that in terms of passive safety, it's a pretty horrible car.

As pointed out many times by others in this thread, having a rock solid structure with no crumple zone is a recipe for disaster. You want something other than your body to dissipate the energy released in a crash, and the Smart has almost nothing to aid you in this regard. In order for you to survive, the car must necessarily sacrifice itself. The fact that you can throw a Smart at a concrete wall and the passenger cell survives in tact is actually the opposite of what you want.

It is not true that mass automatically equals safety, (if that was true, a pick up truck with concrete blocks on its bed would be safer than the one without, but that's obviously not true) but in the case of Smart its diminutive size does seem to be a major drawback in making the car crash worthy.
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Old 02-07-2010, 10:46 AM   #64
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The Smart isn't a bad (city) car; just not competitive in either price or mileage which are typically the top two things people look for in small efficient cars.
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Old 02-07-2010, 10:54 AM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragnapebble View Post
Apparently the Mercedes engineers in California (where the smart was initially designed in 93-94), found a way around your "Laws of Physics"! Read the smart owners crash stories that disprove your thinking at safeandsmart.com. Or you could just continue in blissful ignorance.
Seriously... please read the letters.

Jack
I humored you and read some of those stories and I'm still not impressed. Most of them read along the lines of, "Yeah, I was on the highway and I got rearended at 10 mph and the car just needed a new bumper" or something similar.

And just consider for a minute what you're reading. That website is a lovefest for Smart car owners, and that's fine, but it's a bit one sided. Where is the other side of the coin, the fatality stories? (Yeah, yeah, dead people can't talk).

http://northeast-nc.injuryboard.com/...oogleid=268572

In any event, I find it curious that your first four posts on this website were in this very thread. You obviously have some vested interest in defending the Smartcar, whether you're an employee of Smart or just a rabid owner.
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Old 02-07-2010, 10:56 AM   #66
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Originally Posted by HB_Dad View Post
exactly the incompatibility I was speaking of in my earlier posts. Immediately we point the finger at the smart car in this instance. But why not look at the semi for things you could change to improve the OTHER driver's survivability no matter what car its hitting.

I'd also like to know why a Smart car hit a Semi truck head-on in the first place. I think that data is more important that what kind of car it was.
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Old 02-07-2010, 10:59 AM   #67
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Originally Posted by Dirty25RS View Post
exactly the incompatibility I was speaking of in my earlier posts. Immediately we point the finger at the smart car in this instance. But why not look at the semi for things you could change to improve the OTHER driver's survivability no matter what car its hitting.

I'd also like to know why a Smart car hit a Semi truck head-on in the first place. I think that data is more important that what kind of car it was.

To be fair, I don't think that's an actual Smart car and it's surely not in the US. If you want to see the other pictures in the series, including pictures of the deceased driver, I suggest Googling "Smart car death" and it should be one of the first links. HIGHLY NSFW.
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Old 02-07-2010, 11:04 AM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FaastLegacy View Post
To be fair, I don't think that's an actual Smart car and it's surely not in the US. If you want to see the other pictures in the series, including pictures of the deceased driver, I suggest Googling "Smart car death" and it should be one of the first links. HIGHLY NSFW.
Yeah, that is definitely not a smart car. I'm also fairly certain that just about any smaller vehicle would have suffered a very similar fate in that situation.

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Old 02-07-2010, 11:46 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by Yotsuya View Post
1. the inexplicable pathological hatred. I haven't seen anything so irrational since a black guy tried to sit at a lunch counter in Alabama.
2. Scrappy and company are the first to holler about vehicle choice when anyone baggs on SUV or other large wasteful cars.
Wow. Way to trivialize and diminish the oppression suffered my millions by comparing it to a discussion about cars!?

I doubt many folks on here care about whether or not someone buys a SMART--I certainly don't care if someone buys a SMART or a Suburban--different people have different needs. That is the beauty of a free country.

I think the issue is making specious claims. "Our H2 handles like a Lotus, just look at this video fragment."
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Old 02-07-2010, 11:48 AM   #70
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Old 02-07-2010, 12:59 PM   #71
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^
Every time I see video like this, I'm thinking about small car bouncing back to next line right in a front of incoming semi truck.
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Old 02-07-2010, 01:21 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by Euclid View Post
Yeah, that is definitely not a smart car. I'm also fairly certain that just about any smaller vehicle would have suffered a very similar fate in that situation.

I think just about any size vehicle would have suffered a similar fate. Crash an Excursion head on into a semi and you're still going to die*.

* and this doesn't even account for the fact that 6500+ GWVR trucks don't meet the same safety standards as automobiles, so the Excursion may well be not the safest passenger-vehicle choice despite its girth
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Old 02-07-2010, 02:34 PM   #73
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Quote:
Vicki: But, here's the rub. The cars may have stood up to the severity of the crash surprisingly well, but the humans inside wouldn't. No matter what you drive, rapidly decelerating from higher speeds is something your internal organs simply cannot cope with. The chilling truth is: the people inside both cars would have been very unlikely to have survived.

I think what they should have said, is that ANY car, because it is true for any car, yours mine, that H1, whatever.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HB_Dad View Post


Oh come on, the driver would just walk away from this!
no driver would walk away from this, regardless of the vehicle, even if it was a smart car (which the pictured vehicle wasn't).
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Old 02-07-2010, 02:36 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samagon View Post
I think what they should have said, is that ANY car, because it is true for any car, yours mine, that H1, whatever.



no driver would walk away from this, regardless of the vehicle, even if it was a smart car (which the pictured vehicle wasn't).
depends...
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Old 02-07-2010, 02:38 PM   #75
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