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Old 03-12-2019, 01:36 PM   #751
Norm Peterson
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'08 Mustang GT (the toy)

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie-III View Post
Looks pretty decent.
I believe the basic premise of this thread is, can you currently lock the brakes/invoke the ABS?
If yes, better brakes gain little until you increase tire grip.
The big catch here is that when poo actually is about to happen, only a little "gain" can mean the difference between contact and only soiled underwear.

In fact, this is precisely the logic behind today's "brake assist" nannies - the system applies the brakes more rapidly than an unsure driver will ever do, shortening the stopping distance by getting you up to max deceleration sooner. But aside from brake assist not being under the driver's control, it really isn't any different from installing pads with stronger 'bite', that develop a similarly high amount of braking from less pedal pressure and generally less pedal stroke.

Whether it's artificially increasing the rate of hydraulic system pressurization or increasing the 'mu' of the pads/rotors, they're just different ways of getting brake torque up to where you need it sooner than with standard mu pads and average-driver rates of pedal application.


There is one caution . . . once you've driven a car equipped with pads that have noticeably stronger bite than OE or mass-market OE replacement (especially mass-market bargain ceramics), you may never want to go back. The necessary pedal modulation is something that most people should be capable of learning.


Norm
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Last edited by Norm Peterson; 03-12-2019 at 01:44 PM.
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Old 04-15-2019, 02:51 PM   #752
AFdot7
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This is a very helpful post and I can see your point. I ended up upgrading my stock cast iron brakes to a Wilwood kit mainly because I was having a terrible time with my OEM brakes leaking, uneven wear, and eventually both rear calipers seized up. I had bought the car used with only a few thousand miles on it, but you could tell the car sat idle a lot. I made the upgrade because the timing was right and I got a great deal. I did noticed a huge difference and I'm glad I upgraded, but you make a good point.
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Old 04-28-2019, 11:01 PM   #753
goodolmrwilson
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JBP

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Davenow,

Great thread. Thanks. Tried to explain all this to my 16 yo son a while back, but it seemed to really sink in after he read your post and some of the replies!

He just saved himself (and me) a bunch of cash.

I did let him paint his calipers and get a set of shiny cross drilled rotors though Now everybodys happy

Peace.
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Old 04-29-2019, 09:16 AM   #754
Norm Peterson
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'08 Mustang GT (the toy)

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Quote:
Originally Posted by goodolmrwilson View Post
Davenow,

Great thread. Thanks. Tried to explain all this to my 16 yo son a while back, but it seemed to really sink in after he read your post and some of the replies!

He just saved himself (and me) a bunch of cash.

I did let him paint his calipers and get a set of shiny cross drilled rotors though Now everybodys happy

Peace.
Have him read my post #751 above.

Pads with stronger initial bite will get you stopped a tiny bit shorter because the amount of braking force at the contact patches ramps up faster. It may only be a small thing, but it's there.


Norm
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Old 05-18-2019, 08:57 PM   #755
boosterlimitedtb
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Just swapped a 255 into an 02 RS. Would my stock brakes be enough to stop with this extra power I'm getting?
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Old 05-20-2019, 09:38 AM   #756
Charlie-III
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boosterlimitedtb View Post
Just swapped a 255 into an 02 RS. Would my stock brakes be enough to stop with this extra power I'm getting?
As a DD/AutoX car?
Yes.

Fresh fluid, maybe SS lines, better pads and decent tires are a good start.

Track car, maybe upgrade other bits.
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Old 05-20-2019, 10:15 AM   #757
Jack
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boosterlimitedtb View Post
Just swapped a 255 into an 02 RS. Would my stock brakes be enough to stop with this extra power I'm getting?
For the street, the question becomes: "Can I invoke ABS?". If yes, then your brakes do everything you need. If you're on the track, you can certainly boil brake fluid, in which case you'd first want to consider higher dry boiling point fluid and if that doesn't work, then consider what class you're in and only then, consider bigger brakes. If you're in showroom stock, doing time trials, something to remember is that during practice, brake ducts are legal. I ran them for many years on various cars, just blowing into the back of the calipers/center of the disks. Come time trial time, snip the zip ties, remove the ducts and instant-legal.

The question isn't the extra power.....it's how fast are you going where you have to slow down. A 165 hp car going 120 mph needs the same braking power as a 5000 hp car going 120 mph.
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