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Old 12-21-2013, 12:49 PM   #251
cianuro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by satrya View Post
Squirrel finders are typically placed between the cutoff shield and the lens, meaning that they redirect some of the light that were not blocked by the shield, and would originally point down around the foreground. Beam pattern is about compromises. Anything above the horizontal cutoff can become glare to oncoming drivers. However, projectors, especially with clear lens, need to generate as much brightness close to the cutoff as possible (coming from below). This makes the contrast between objects below and above the cutoff very dramatic. In the absence of other light source, this makes objects right above the cutoff absolutely invisible, and objects right below the cutoff very bright. In halogen projectors, this is compensated by bending some of the light above. For illustration sake, let's say the intensity of light at the center, going from top to bottom is as follows with a halogen bulb; high up @1, middle up @1.5, right above the cutoff @1, right below the cutoff @8, middle down @3, very bottom @2. (Since the numbers are hypothetical, I won't bother with units) Relative to 8, the middle up intensity of 1.5 allows the driver to see some objects above. From oncoming traffic, 1.5 is still acceptable relative to other light source (e.g. street lighting, signs, etc.). Suppose one replaces the halogen bulb with an HID bulb. And assume the beam pattern is not affected. It is, but let's ignore that for this discussion. Then, the intensity numbers that used to be 1, 1.5, 1, 8, 3, 2; all get amplified to, say, 3, 4.5, 3, 24, 9, 6. Nevermind the fact that the foreground (middle down to very bottom) has been amplified from 2~3 to 6~9, which is a bad thing for distance visibility. Aside from that, the driver sees an "improvement" because distance lighting now is much brighter (@24), and the trees light up better. However, 3 ~ 4.5 is too much for oncoming traffic. For that reason, squirrel finders in a halogen projector must be disabled when fitting an HID bulb. When reversing a shield to convert between LHD & RHD, that squirrel finder now bounces light behind the cutoff shield in a different way. Best way is to grind it off, or to replace it with a sheet metal plate.
Ok. So off it is. Would bending it flat against the cutoff plate give the same result since it's facing the bulb? I'm trying to avoid opening them again, but since they're not mounted to the car, I guess it's my best option. I can bend the squirrel finder without opening it, so I'll try that first.

I did notice a difference between the squirrel finder being in a different position. There's some glare coming from the headlight already installed, which has the same setup, but with the squirrel finder facing the lens. With the JDM headlight, this glare is not there, just the light bleed over the cutoff I mentioned.

I used the same as the OP, OEM STi projectors, TSX lens and matsu ballast with phillips D2S 4300K. The JDM headlights came off an STi, so it already had the projectors, and I just turned the plate and added the TSX lens. I'll try bending first before opening the headlight and take pics before and after to compare. If it doesn't work, I'll just open them and grind it off.

Thanks for all the info.
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Old 12-21-2013, 01:53 PM   #252
satrya
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You're welcome. If you open it, another option is to paint it with flat black high temp paint.
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Old 12-21-2013, 10:45 PM   #253
cianuro
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You're welcome. If you open it, another option is to paint it with flat black high temp paint.
Ok. Took some pics. Pressing the squirrel finder against the cutoff plate made no difference whatsoever... The top beam is the JDM headlight with TSX lens and squirrel finder facing the D2S, and the lower beam is the USDM headlight, with OEM STi projector, same TSX lens, and squirrel finder facing the lens.

Before (squirrel finder at its normal angle, but facing the D2S instead of the lens)



After (squirrel finder pressed against the cutoff plate)



As you can see, the light bleed stayed the same. Also, I don't know if it's noticeable from the phone pics, but there's some luminance above the cutoff from the lower beam, where as the top beam hardly shows any.

This is the headlight. Notice there are 2 strips of light above the area where the light is coming out of. If I cover that with a finger, the light bleed is no longer visible.



Would the washer mod fix this? Or at least hide it more? I don't think painting the squirrel finder will change anything seeing that bending it didn't make a difference. Any tips?

It's almost midnight here... I'm thinking about baking them open again to test the washer mod, but the last time I tried it messed up the cutoff with just 1 washer, so I'll perform all my tests before mounting it all back.

Last edited by cianuro; 12-21-2013 at 10:55 PM.
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Old 12-21-2013, 10:48 PM   #254
cianuro
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Pics fixed...

Last edited by cianuro; 12-21-2013 at 10:56 PM.
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Old 12-22-2013, 01:12 AM   #255
satrya
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The distance between the projector and the wall is too close to make any useful determination. Also note that at this distance, the step looks very blotched. My e55r also does that at that distance, and even shows red and orange color around the fuzzy cutoff. But at a long distance (e.g. 5 cars ahead), the cutoff is crisp and has a deep blue/purple hue on the edge.

I can't tell what those bright spots are on the last picture, especially the one reflected by the high beam reflector.

One non-scientific way to test whether the squirrel finder produces glare or not, is to stand about 1 car ahead, and look at the low beams. Any standing position should be good, as it will be far enough from the horizontal cutoff plane. If it looks uncomfortable at night, then the squirrel finder and/or any other source of light bleeding up may be too much. If someone has one of the newer OEM LED DRL in their vehicle, that same level of brightness from that vantage point is too much for a squirrel finder.
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Old 12-22-2013, 09:24 AM   #256
cianuro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by satrya View Post
The distance between the projector and the wall is too close to make any useful determination. Also note that at this distance, the step looks very blotched. My e55r also does that at that distance, and even shows red and orange color around the fuzzy cutoff. But at a long distance (e.g. 5 cars ahead), the cutoff is crisp and has a deep blue/purple hue on the edge.

I can't tell what those bright spots are on the last picture, especially the one reflected by the high beam reflector.

One non-scientific way to test whether the squirrel finder produces glare or not, is to stand about 1 car ahead, and look at the low beams. Any standing position should be good, as it will be far enough from the horizontal cutoff plane. If it looks uncomfortable at night, then the squirrel finder and/or any other source of light bleeding up may be too much. If someone has one of the newer OEM LED DRL in their vehicle, that same level of brightness from that vantage point is too much for a squirrel finder.
Did some tests last night after my post, but I didn't take any pics... It was past 2am when I finished...

Basically, the top beam shows a bit of light over the cutoff, and that looked almost the same, if not more, at a longer range, which is why I took the pics from a short distance, plus I wanted to have both beams in the same pic to compare. They are phone pics, so there's not much clarity, but the light bleed I mention can be seen from them.

I baked the headlight open to mess with the projector. First, I made the squirrel finder completely flat against the plate using pliers... Nothing changed. Since I didn't want to mess around with paint, I used some black tape to cover the squirrel finder... No change either.

I started testing by adding washers. I went from 3 washers to 1 washer. At short range, they all looked about the same, but the bleed was smaller. With 3 washers, the light bleed was visible at short range, same distance as the beam pics from my last post, but at long range, the cutoff seemed super sharp, and the light bleed was complete gone. Also, I finally see that blue colored line over the cutoff.

With 2 washers, the light bleed was gone at long range, but the edge of the cutoff looked as if it was bit mice. It looked a bit distorted, and the colored line above the cutoff was sort of blurry and distorted as well. Using 1 washer didn't make the slightest difference.

As for the headlight pic, there's light reflected through the headlight lens, not the projector or high beam reflector, that's right in the middle of the pic, shaped like an incomplete 8. Analyzing it as an 8, what I meant was that, if I cover the upper half of the light pattern, the light bleed disappears. I'm not paying that much attention to this because, looking at my already installed headlights, they do the same thing and look exactly the same, even though the squirrel finder is different in both.

I'll take some more pics tonight, before I start messing around with the second headlight.
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Old 12-22-2013, 10:22 AM   #257
satrya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cianuro View Post
At short range, they all looked about the same, but the bleed was smaller.
The optics of a projector is not a fixed pattern scaled from one distance to another. This is expected, just as how one would expect that the focus of a projected image on a nearby screen and a farther screen will have different focus.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cianuro View Post
With 3 washers, the light bleed was visible at short range, same distance as the beam pics from my last post, but at long range, the cutoff seemed super sharp, and the light bleed was complete gone. Also, I finally see that blue colored line over the cutoff.
Distance sharpness is a good target. It means most of the light gets thrown as far as possible afaik. A little bit of blue will show up. Too much blue is an indication of too much spacing away from the ideal too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cianuro View Post
As for the headlight pic, there's light reflected through the headlight lens, not the projector or high beam reflector, that's right in the middle of the pic, shaped like an incomplete 8. Analyzing it as an 8, what I meant was that, if I cover the upper half of the light pattern, the light bleed disappears. I'm not paying that much attention to this because, looking at my already installed headlights, they do the same thing and look exactly the same, even though the squirrel finder is different in both.
I didn't realize that the blue hazy "8" is brighter than those small bright-ish spots that appear to have come out of the high beam reflector and the top part of the projector. The glare from the hazy thing is likely the reflection of the light that would have gone to the foreground, but bounced off the flat surface just below the low beam projector.

Looks like you're on the right track.
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Old 12-27-2013, 08:46 PM   #258
cianuro
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Finally done... Had a set of Phillips D2S 6000K, but one of them wasn't working, so I'm waiting on the replacement... Pic taken with 4300K Phillips D2S.

JDM STi HID Headlights OEM
Matsuchita Ballasts
No squirrel finder



Now, to make the beam leveler system work with the WRX...
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