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Old 09-08-2016, 03:24 PM   #26
Integra96
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Originally Posted by Jard View Post
Reasons to buy (instead of lease) an electric car:
Buying a used Leaf makes great sense, actually.

3 year old originally $36,000 car for $12,000, with remaining factory and battery warranty, no maintenance.
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Old 09-08-2016, 03:26 PM   #27
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Some people would like to have one car that can do everything, so currently EV don't work for them because maybe once a month they take a jaunt up to the mountains or to visit family. Having to buy a second car because your EV can't do everything you need is completely counterproductive.
Right. Hence "99%", "most", and exceptions listed.
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Old 09-08-2016, 03:27 PM   #28
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Buying a used Leaf makes great sense, actually.

3 year old originally $36,000 car for $12,000, with remaining factory and battery warranty, no maintenance.
I agree that makes a lot more sense. JGard was talking about a bunch of cars that haven't been out for 3 years so new would be the only option. With the incentives that manufacturers are offering, the speed of tech changes, and having never owned an electric before, I think leasing makes more sense for new vehicles.
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Old 09-08-2016, 03:48 PM   #29
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I want an electric car as a third vehicle. May end up getting a Tesla if they drop the whiz-bang **** and just make a useful well thought out product with a little bit of Honda style design ingenuity thrown in. I don't need a door that closes or opens by itself, and I prefer to have an actual door handle on my car.

The X could have been great if they had dropped the lambo doors and automatic features.
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Old 09-08-2016, 03:48 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by cwb124 View Post
Some people would like to have one car that can do everything, so currently EV don't work for them because maybe once a month they take a jaunt up to the mountains or to visit family. Having to buy a second car because your EV can't do everything you need is completely counterproductive.
Maybe those people can rent a car for the weekend, etc. Still cheaper than keeping a 2nd car.
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Old 09-08-2016, 03:52 PM   #31
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Maybe those people can rent a car for the weekend, etc. Still cheaper than keeping a 2nd car.
Just like people who buy pick-up trucks to haul a couple bags of mulch every spring when it makes more sense to buy a car and rent a truck when you need it. That's not a viable solution for most people for whatever reason.
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Old 09-08-2016, 03:52 PM   #32
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Right. Hence "99%", "most", and exceptions listed.
I think it's a lot less than 99%.
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Old 09-08-2016, 04:10 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cwb124 View Post
I think it's a lot less than 99%.
How about 87%?
Quote:
Skeptics sometimes doubt whether electric vehicles will catch on. They compare them to gas-powered cars, trucks, and SUVs, bemoaning the fact that EVs have shorter driving ranges and higher sticker prices. However, a new study shows that the biggest obstacle standing between EVs and mainstream consumers may really be a lack of information.

The study was carried out by a team of researchers from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. It reveals that 87 percent of vehicles registered in the U.S. could be magically converted to electricity overnight, and the country would be just fine.

In numerical terms, that means that more than 226 million of the country's 260 million registered vehicles could go electric now, and we'd have the capability to pay for them, keep them charged, and get where we need to go.

To reach that conclusion, the team led by MIT's Jessika Trancik spent four years poring over a variety of statistics, including the distances that people drive in a given day. They looked at detailed, GPS-based data from drivers in California, Georgia, and Texas and conducted nationwide surveys about transportation habits.

In doing so, not only did they discover that EVs would meet the needs of most motorists, but also that going electric wouldn't cost car owners any more money than if they were to keep driving their current gas-powered vehicles:

"[T]he team found that the vast majority of cars on the road consume no more energy in a day than the battery energy capacity in affordable EVs available today. These numbers represent a scenario in which people would do most of their recharging overnight at home, or during the day at work, so for such trips the lack of infrastructure was not really a concern. Vehicles such as the Ford Focus Electric or the Nissan Leaf--whose sticker prices are still higher than those of conventional cars, but whose overall lifetime costs end up being comparable because of lower maintenance and operating costs--would be adequate to meet the needs of the vast majority of U.S. drivers."

They also realized that there's not much difference between travel habits in different parts of the country. Trancik explains that, "The adoption potential of electric vehicles is remarkably similar across cities, from dense urban areas like New York, to sprawling cities like Houston. This goes against the view that electric vehicles--at least affordable ones, which have limited range--only really work in dense urban centers."

And of course, switching to electricity would dramatically reduce America's dependence on oil and its greenhouse gas emissions. Converting 87 percent of gas-powered vehicles to EVs would reduce U.S. gasoline consumption by 60 percent and cut transportation-related emissions by 30 percent. (As the statistics suggest, converting the country's most pollution-prone vehicles--mostly those used for commercial purposes--isn't feasible yet.)

All that said, Trancik and her colleagues note that electric vehicles aren't always capable of meeting drivers' needs. On long road trips, or when extreme weather reduces a battery's driving range, motorists would need back-ups. However, those occasions would be rare, and needs could usually be met with a short-term car rental or ride-share.

Whether the report will convince more drivers to opt for EVs remains to be seen. Today, electrics account for less than one percent of cars in America. Compared to countries like Norway--where 24 percent of new cars sold are electric and the country is considering plans to ban gas and diesel car sales by 2025--we've got a long way to go.
http://www.thecarconnection.com/news...ith-no-problem
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Old 09-08-2016, 04:13 PM   #34
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Buying a used Leaf makes great sense, actually.

3 year old originally $36,000 car for $12,000, with remaining factory and battery warranty, no maintenance.
That's the damn truth.

I saw one at Carmax that was only a couple years old with less than 20k miles on it and they only wanted $12k for it.

Definitely not a car you buy new.
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Old 09-08-2016, 04:17 PM   #35
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That's the damn truth.

I saw one at Carmax that was only a couple years old with less than 20k miles on it and they only wanted $12k for it.

Definitely not a car you buy new.
Couple of years ago you got something like 16k cash back in rebates and tax subsidies.
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Old 09-08-2016, 04:29 PM   #36
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My household has had a LEAF (leased, returned) and now a RAV4 EV. We like 'em. I also like my Land Cruiser. Different tools for different uses.
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Old 09-08-2016, 04:35 PM   #37
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There's the i3, as ugly as it is, kinda neat
you forgot the i8

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Old 09-08-2016, 04:43 PM   #38
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Couple of years ago you got something like 16k cash back in rebates and tax subsidies.
$7.5k Federal. Cali has $2.5k for 36+ month leases and purchases. Other states have varying incentives. Colorado has a $5k rebate good for new and used-but-not-registered-in-CO-before EVs. This is great except it used to be $6k until this year.
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Old 09-08-2016, 04:43 PM   #39
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i8 isn't an EV, so I left it off on purpose
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Old 09-08-2016, 04:56 PM   #40
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Just like people who buy pick-up trucks to haul a couple bags of mulch every spring when it makes more sense to buy a car and rent a truck when you need it. That's not a viable solution for most people for whatever reason.
Actually, it's a very viable solution. They want a truck, and that's perfectly fine. Just don't let them kid you that they need a truck.
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Old 09-08-2016, 05:10 PM   #41
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$7.5k Federal. Cali has $2.5k for 36+ month leases and purchases. Other states have varying incentives. Colorado has a $5k rebate good for new and used-but-not-registered-in-CO-before EVs. This is great except it used to be $6k until this year.
You also have to have the tax liability to make use of all those credits.
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Old 09-08-2016, 05:20 PM   #42
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Actually, it's a very viable solution. They want a truck, and that's perfectly fine. Just don't let them kid you that they need a truck.
Well yeah it's viable as in doable...but not viable in the sense that people actually DO it. Lots and lots of sparkly clean truck beds rolling around out there.
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Old 09-08-2016, 05:51 PM   #43
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You also have to have the tax liability to make use of all those credits.
1) Lease if you don't have the tax liability. Credits get passed to the lessee as a reduction in the capitalized cost.

2) Personally, I have 99 problems but lack of tax liability certainly isn't one.
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Old 09-08-2016, 06:36 PM   #44
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Bah, buying a lightly used Leaf S for $10k is the way to go. Nice examples in excellent condition with 10-20k miles can be had for this much or even less. SV or SL for a couple grand more.
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Old 09-08-2016, 06:39 PM   #45
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Bah, buying a lightly used Leaf S for $10k is the way to go. Nice examples in excellent condition with 10-20k miles can be had for this much or even less. SV or SL for a couple grand more.
Yup, even if you have to repair the battery pack in a few years you're looking at around $2,000 (repair / replace individual cells) Still ahead of a gasser.
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Old 09-08-2016, 06:41 PM   #46
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There's the i3, as ugly as it is, kinda neat
Have you sat in one?



Absolutely love the interior.
It's the ****ing future maaaaan
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Old 09-08-2016, 06:41 PM   #47
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Yup, even if you have to repair the battery pack in a few years you're looking at around $2,000 (repair / replace individual cells) Still ahead of a gasser.
You won't have to replace the battery in a few years - they're extremely reliable. Just make sure you have 12 bars when you buy it and there's several years of battery warranty left. Way better than a gasser and I'd argue the best car purchase going for cost of ownership, reliability, etc.
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Old 09-08-2016, 06:42 PM   #48
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Yeah, I've driven one. It was fun to drive. But then I got back into my '11 X5 and was immediately like "holy crap this is so much nicer". Those seats are very meh and the design is just a little out there.
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Old 09-08-2016, 06:44 PM   #49
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You won't have to replace the battery in a few years - they're extremely reliable. Just make sure you have 12 bars when you buy it and there's several years of battery warranty left. Way better than a gasser and I'd argue the best car purchase going for cost of ownership, reliability, etc.
Absolutely, especially up here in the PNW. TX/AZ might get the diminished battery, even then you're still getting 70 miles to a charge. More than enough for most peoples DD.
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Old 09-08-2016, 06:45 PM   #50
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The rear seats in the LEAF were surprisingly awesome for a rear facing baby seat, something about how they are angled.
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