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Old 08-20-2008, 01:30 AM   #1
neomagus00
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Default Considering moving from saab to subaru

hey all... i'll get right to it.

i currently drive a 2000 saab 9-3 convertible, with mods equivalent to what we call stage 3+ (full turboback, better shocks and springs, ARB upgrades, street/track pads and rotors with braided brake lines, lighter wheels, harder trans and engine mounts, and various braces and poly bushings).

to put it bluntly, it is expensive as hell to maintain, and you really don't get what you pay for in performance (all my performance hardware, not counting installation or maintenance - just the parts cost - is almost $8k).

i want a better bang for my buck, and i want a car that has more than one tuning option (there are 2-3 major saab tuners in the world... not a lot of options). one thing i do like about the saab is that my car is the only one like it in a couple hundred miles - if you see (and hear) a tuned silver saab convertible in northern california, it's probably me. i know that there are more subarus than saabs, but i'd still like to have a distinctive vehicle.

can a subaru fit this bill? this car will begin as a modified daily driver, but will evolve into a street/track and finally (hopefully) a full endurance rally car. i'll stop here before delving into the specific numbers and parts i'm thinking about, but do you guys think a subaru would make me happy?

thanks for any input, links, info, constructive abuse, and so on...
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Old 08-20-2008, 01:37 AM   #2
dub c
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you want a subaru.
there is always ways to make your car stand out...rare hard to find parts are a eeeeezy way to make your car alot different.
im thinking you should do the full luansport carbon wrc replica body haha.
subaru parts compared to other european aftermarket parts are super affordable.
im sure if you search around nasioc a bit more you will see what subaru is all about and how "easy" it is to upgrade.
imo this should be a easy decision haha.

P.s. I would like some specific numbers and parts you are thinking of....
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Old 08-20-2008, 01:47 AM   #3
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Maybe a saabaru?
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Old 08-20-2008, 02:25 AM   #4
fstbckgt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theshadowonme View Post
Maybe a saabaru?
+1


9-2x Aero is mechanically identical to the WRX with a few bonuses, and you get better looks than the wrx wagon and the uniqueness your looking for. Only downside is no sedan




9-2x Aero



WRX
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Old 08-20-2008, 10:38 PM   #5
neomagus00
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dub c View Post
im thinking you should do the full luansport carbon wrc replica body haha.
at $8k, it had better save a couple hundred pounds, at least!

Quote:
subaru parts compared to other european aftermarket parts are super affordable.
this is very good news... this means i can buy better parts for the same cash! to give you some prices of stuff i have now, my suspension kit was $800, my turboback was $1100, and a subframe brace was $250. how do these things compare?

Quote:
I would like some specific numbers and parts you are thinking of....
where i start would depend on what trim level i get. i'm looking at about 1-2 years out right now, unless something happens to the saab (and by the sound of the transmission, that might be sooner rather than later). some things i'm thinking about:

i want an automatic, because i'm just weird like that, but i definitely want paddle shifters. are the shifters on the subarus today as responsive as they'd need to be to truly drive it well? or would i need to get the stick shift and put a pneumatic/electronic system in to get real performance?

i usually drive quite sanely, but the car will definitely see track days, both on and off road. it needs to be durable at extended high rpms and under repeated, extreme braking. my first set of mods will be to add traction (obviously). after that, it depends on what i feel like the car is lacking; my end goal (several years after purchase) is 350+ ft-lbs of torque at all 4 wheels across a wide rev range, with excellent driveability, and with extreme reliability. so my second set of mods may be engine/transmission internals to prep for the power that will be coming later; or, it may be better suspension/lighter wheels/lighter stuff in general, or maybe intake/exhaust mods to start building power.

i could go on for some time... but now you tell me what i need

P.S. do they make the saabaru any more? i think i'd stay away from it because it has a bad rep to anyone that knows about it (at least in the saab community), and if i'm gonna get a wrx, may as well make it a real one. plus, thrashing a saab just feels... odd. i'd know, i've been doing it for a few years
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Old 08-20-2008, 10:41 PM   #6
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Is it legal to do that? How can Saab copy the WRX?
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Old 08-20-2008, 10:49 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malasubidude View Post
Is it legal to do that? How can Saab copy the WRX?
It's one of those partnership vehicles.. like DSM's... but not crappy.
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Old 08-20-2008, 11:19 PM   #8
fstbckgt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malasubidude View Post
Is it legal to do that? How can Saab copy the WRX?
GM who owns Saab held 20% of Subaru until recently so they used their power to get the impreza from Subaru to Saab. i like my 9-2x comes stock with some sti parts, more sound deadening, and a better front end than the blob eye and almost as good looking as the hawkeye
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Old 08-20-2008, 11:23 PM   #9
fstbckgt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neomagus00 View Post
at $8k, it had better save a couple hundred pounds, at least!


this is very good news... this means i can buy better parts for the same cash! to give you some prices of stuff i have now, my suspension kit was $800, my turboback was $1100, and a subframe brace was $250. how do these things compare?


where i start would depend on what trim level i get. i'm looking at about 1-2 years out right now, unless something happens to the saab (and by the sound of the transmission, that might be sooner rather than later). some things i'm thinking about:

i want an automatic, because i'm just weird like that, but i definitely want paddle shifters. are the shifters on the subarus today as responsive as they'd need to be to truly drive it well? or would i need to get the stick shift and put a pneumatic/electronic system in to get real performance?

i usually drive quite sanely, but the car will definitely see track days, both on and off road. it needs to be durable at extended high rpms and under repeated, extreme braking. my first set of mods will be to add traction (obviously). after that, it depends on what i feel like the car is lacking; my end goal (several years after purchase) is 350+ ft-lbs of torque at all 4 wheels across a wide rev range, with excellent driveability, and with extreme reliability. so my second set of mods may be engine/transmission internals to prep for the power that will be coming later; or, it may be better suspension/lighter wheels/lighter stuff in general, or maybe intake/exhaust mods to start building power.

i could go on for some time... but now you tell me what i need

P.S. do they make the saabaru any more? i think i'd stay away from it because it has a bad rep to anyone that knows about it (at least in the saab community), and if i'm gonna get a wrx, may as well make it a real one. plus, thrashing a saab just feels... odd. i'd know, i've been doing it for a few years
the 9-2x was made for the 2005 and 2006 MY's
you'd pay about the same for the wrx turboback and suspension if you want quality parts

and i find it hard to believe that the 9-2x could have a bad rep among the saab community seeing as saabs suck , its a WRX and will have the same problems as any other WRX, so if you want to avoid the 9-2x because you've heard it has problems then you maybe shouldn't be thinking about a subaru either

you just have to realize a 9-2x isn't a saab and if you feel weird thrashing it, its only because it says the word saab on it, not because it is one

Last edited by fstbckgt; 08-20-2008 at 11:31 PM.
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Old 08-21-2008, 01:29 AM   #10
neomagus00
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fstbckgt View Post
you'd pay about the same for the wrx turboback and suspension if you want quality parts
that's fine, i'd choose quality over price any day. i'm also looking at subaru because the modding community is so much bigger - there are, i'm sure, options for a wrx that simply don't exist for a 9-3.

Quote:
and i find it hard to believe that the 9-2x could have a bad rep among the saab community seeing as saabs suck , its a WRX and will have the same problems as any other WRX, so if you want to avoid the 9-2x because you've heard it has problems then you maybe shouldn't be thinking about a subaru either
ah, i was unclear. it has a bad rep amongst saabers precisely BECAUSE it is a subaru with saab skin. saabers are sometimes a bit elitist (i generalise, but you get the point), and if it isn't a 'real' saab, it doesn't 'deserve' to have the badge (again, not all feel like this, but it's a not-uncommon belief). it has nothing to do with the mechanics of the car, i know literally nothing about it.

what's a 'blobeye' vs. a 'hawkeye'? i'm reading, but most of what i know about subarus comes from the unabombers faqs here, and from wrc.
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Old 08-21-2008, 02:40 AM   #11
theshadowonme
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Pwn3d.
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Old 08-21-2008, 03:45 AM   #12
hankchang
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When GM was ending the relationship with Subaru, Saab had a great sale on those 9-2. I think it was below $20k? more than $4000 less than WRX.
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Old 08-21-2008, 04:34 AM   #13
fstbckgt
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if you want a subaru and still want to feel like part of the saab family go for the 92 while other saab owners might not like you, its only beacuse your car is technically the best saab there is
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Old 08-21-2008, 08:55 AM   #14
Drakuun
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fstbckgt View Post
GM held 20% of Subaru
12.7%
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Old 08-21-2008, 09:03 AM   #15
Drakuun
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neomagus00 View Post
it has a bad rep amongst saabers precisely BECAUSE it is a subaru with saab skin. saabers are sometimes a bit elitist (i generalise, but you get the point), and if it isn't a 'real' saab, it doesn't 'deserve' to have the badge (again, not all feel like this, but it's a not-uncommon belief). it has nothing to do with the mechanics of the car, i know literally nothing about it.
Reason #1 I'd go with the Subaru Proper.

Also, maybe look at the Legacy GT .. it's a little more 'saab'ish' in size and scope than the Impreza.

As well, about the above quote, next time some Saab purist gets uppity about a Saabaru, just explain to them the entire reason GM and Saab partnered with Subaru was to save Saab and bring it into a new demographic. It was that or GM was going to cut them loose.


GL with your purchase.
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Old 08-21-2008, 09:19 AM   #16
Carlito2002WGN
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neomagus00 View Post

P.S. do they make the saabaru any more? i think i'd stay away from it because it has a bad rep to anyone that knows about it (at least in the saab community), and if i'm gonna get a wrx, may as well make it a real one. plus, thrashing a saab just feels... odd. i'd know, i've been doing it for a few years
I know about it. I own one. I like it.

Bad rep??? Only among Saab people. If you're a Saab lover, then you are probably a purist. If you are a Saab purist, then you will obviously not like a Subaru in Saab clothing (that is exactly what it is). If you don't want one, that's fine. But, understand that they are exaclty the same thing as the car that you came here to inquire about.

A nice example of a Saabaru:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1269577

Some more:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=857686

Ask these people what they think:
http://saab92x.com/

Carlos

Last edited by Carlito2002WGN; 08-21-2008 at 09:29 AM.
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Old 08-21-2008, 09:35 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neomagus00 View Post

what's a 'blobeye' vs. a 'hawkeye'? i'm reading, but most of what i know about subarus comes from the unabombers faqs here, and from wrc.
Its the type of head light style on the car, that then corresponds with the year.. Their is also a bugeye..

01 - Bugeye
02 - Bugeye
03 - Bugeye
04 - Blobeye
05 - Blobeye
06 - Hawkeye
07 - Hawkeye
08 - Hawkeye
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Old 08-21-2008, 09:36 AM   #18
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Take a look at the Legacy GT. Its a lot more refined then the 02-07 Impreza, it has a bit more class I guess you could say it also has a pretty large aftermarket. Its not uncommon to see the 400 AWHP Legacy GT thread pop up on here and I'm sure there are plenty over on the legacygt forum...

And in my opinion can be made to look much better then a Saab....just my opinion though...





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Old 08-21-2008, 09:47 AM   #19
Carlito2002WGN
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I've always loved the Legacy. That is a very nice example.
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Old 08-21-2008, 11:55 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by Drakuun View Post
12.7%
It was 20% but they sold about 8% to Toyota and rest sold to the market.
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Old 08-21-2008, 11:57 AM   #21
neomagus00
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i'm thinking i maybe made a mistake mentioning saab. i have no wish to stay with saab; in fact i think it's time i tried something new. i have no animosity towards them, i just think it isn't for me. (and i am by no means a saab purist or elitist, it just happened to be my first car)

i never considered the legacy, but after thinking about it, i think i want something sportier. i can go classy when i'm older - i want performance right now . keep in mind this thing will be a full road-illegal race machine a few years down the road. that means that while the legacy may develop as much power as a wrx with the right tuning on both, power isn't everything - gotta have control, and i'm trusting that subaru puts the best car they have onto the dirt in europe for wrc. or is this completely wrong - will a heavily modified legacy actually outperform a heavily modified wrx?
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Old 08-21-2008, 12:20 PM   #22
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[quote=elhockey3;23409497]Its the type of head light style on the car, that then corresponds with the year.. Their is also a bugeye..

01 - Bugeye 01 was was still the gc8 body
02 - Bugeye
03 - Bugeye
04 - Blobeye
05 - Blobeye
06 - Hawkeye
07 - Hawkeye
08 - Hawkeye[/QUOTE

i fixed it
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Old 08-21-2008, 03:12 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malasubidude View Post
Is it legal to do that? How can Saab copy the WRX?
Where have you been hiding since 2005?
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Old 08-21-2008, 04:23 PM   #24
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[quote=novacivic;23411469]
Quote:
Originally Posted by elhockey3 View Post
Its the type of head light style on the car, that then corresponds with the year.. Their is also a bugeye..

01 - Bugeye 01 was was still the gc8 body
02 - Bugeye
03 - Bugeye
04 - Blobeye
05 - Blobeye
06 - Hawkeye
07 - Hawkeye
08 - Hawkeye[/QUOTE

i fixed it
Only in the USDM, in JDM land the 01 was a Bugeye so he was sorta right.
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Old 08-21-2008, 05:10 PM   #25
CynicX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neomagus00 View Post
i'm thinking i maybe made a mistake mentioning saab. i have no wish to stay with saab; in fact i think it's time i tried something new. i have no animosity towards them, i just think it isn't for me. (and i am by no means a saab purist or elitist, it just happened to be my first car)

i never considered the legacy, but after thinking about it, i think i want something sportier. i can go classy when i'm older - i want performance right now . keep in mind this thing will be a full road-illegal race machine a few years down the road. that means that while the legacy may develop as much power as a wrx with the right tuning on both, power isn't everything - gotta have control, and i'm trusting that subaru puts the best car they have onto the dirt in europe for wrc. or is this completely wrong - will a heavily modified legacy actually outperform a heavily modified wrx?
Keep in mind Subaru's rally heritage was born off the Legacy and then they transitioned to the Impreza. If modified equally I believe the Impreza will come out on top but not by a lot...

Stock the Legacy GT and WRX are neck to neck in performance. The Legacy GT Spec B performs a lot better then the WRX. And the WRX STI handles a little better then the Legacy GT Spec B....

2008 WRX's got a lot better handling then previous years, and supposedly 2009 are going to be even better...

Its cool if the Legacy isnt your thing. I figured coming from a Saab you may want something a little more respectable (not that a WRX isnt). I've grown tired of driving mine (WRX) because it seems as if EVERYONE wants to race. It was fun at first but now its just annoying and sometimes scary (people trying to show off)...I think with a LGT I could have kept the speed and kept it under the radar of the Honda/Acura crowd....
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