Subaru tops reliablity charts from Consumer Reports

[b4wantab]

Originally Posted by dwf137

I've heard this multiple times from prius and camry hybrid owners, so assuming they're all the same. If the battery dies, the car won't start, it tells you to check the hybrid system and you gotta tow it to get it fixed. quick google search confirms.

aaand that's part of the reason why I didn't get a hybrid highlander.

Interesting. I didn't look too much at the Rav. We ended up with a CRV AWD hybrid. It has an old-school drive shaft to the rear diff. At certain speeds and loads the engine is directly connected to the diffs. Great vehicle.

Peace,

Greg

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[dwf137]

Originally Posted by JustyWRC

As for "dead" battery, I was using that just as a term. It may still have had a charge and not completely dead; but, at no time did the car drive in EV mode. That's what I'm getting at along with SoDealer's explanation. When I am going to explore off pavement, I don't want to have to worry. And I never will with a Subaru. That's what Subaru will be providing.

Are they making their own new hybrid system? Or still using Toyota's?

[JustyWRC]

Originally Posted by dwf137

Are they making their own new hybrid system? Or still using Toyota's?

Ask me again when the details have been officially released; cause, there will be misunderstandings and semantics involved.

[Pre]

Originally Posted by JustyWRC

I say "off pavement" cause "off road" got everyone in a tizzy thinking rock crawling or something. I'm sure you don't see Subarus. Doesn't mean a good number of them don't. You don't do social media(don't necessarily blame you); but, TONS of pics of folks taking their cars "off pavement". There are even groups. This goes back DECADES. I was going "off pavement" with a 58hp 4WD Justy before there was social internet. Then there are the fun ones that modify their Subarus to go "off road". Been doing THAT for decades going back to the EA motors. With the most powerful one of those being, what, 136hp turbo'd?

Just because you don't see/believe it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen. It's a reputation Subaru has had long before you even probably paid any attention to this company. Soo much so, they FINALLY made a OEM vehicle for those folks, with a warranty. Only to have them modifying those even more.

Maybe you'll see it more when you get to your land in the mountains where there will certainly be more of them.

You and SoulStealer, missed the point like missing the forest for the trees. Math, simple math. Buyers who do this out of 100%? I bet it’s not even 1%. So you’re literally using some < 1% argument. And it sounds like some marketing/advertising/commercial deal. Mfr’s love this “lifestyle” crap and use it in their marketing all the time. CUV’s traversing some gravel/dirt road on a mountain, mom and dad in the front seats, kiddos in the back, and they are going for a camping “adventure”. Man, reality, and marketing are polar opposites. Y’all watch too many commercials.

I go to my land regularly. Was just there last month for 2 weeks. There are so many national forest trails that go around the lake, up mountains, etc, which is why there is a 450RX sitting in my garage. I’ve ridden them frequently, every year. Nope, no Subarus as I said. SXS the most common, that’s the weapon of choice. MX as well. You need 4WD if it’s a 4 wheeler. I see lifted 4X4 trucks, Jeeps, occasionally a Taco. One of my friends took his Acura MDX up one mountain but could only go up 1/3 the way and had to relent, and he’s got the scratches to prove it.

This is about like people quoting track times, the ring, etc, and they’ve never even done a track day. Just pure fodder man.

[JustyWRC]

Originally Posted by Pre

You and SoulStealer, missed the point like missing the forest for the trees. Math, simple math. Buyers who do this out of 100%? I bet it's not even 1%. So you're literally using some < 1% argument. And it sounds like some marketing/advertising/commercial deal. Mfr's love this "lifestyle" crap and use it in their marketing all the time. CUV's traversing some gravel/dirt road on a mountain, mom and dad in the front seats, kiddos in the back, and they are going for a camping "adventure". Man, reality, and marketing are polar opposites. Y'all watch too many commercials.

I go to my land regularly. Was just there last month for 2 weeks. There are so many national forest trails that go around the lake, up mountains, etc, which is why there is a 450RX sitting in my garage. I've ridden them frequently, every year. Nope, no Subarus as I said. SXS the most common, that's the weapon of choice. MX as well. You need 4WD if it's a 4 wheeler. I see lifted 4X4 trucks, Jeeps, occasionally a Taco. One of my friends took his Acura MDX up one mountain but could only go up 1/3 the way and had to relent, and he's got the scratches to prove it.

This is about like people quoting track times, the ring, etc, and they've never even done a track day. Just pure fodder man.

I might take you up on that "bet" of <1%. I'll see what I can dig up. I think you are missing how many Subarus are sold versus RAV4s and CRVs and the like. I'd maybe agree of 1% of those(mainly cause they find out they are NOT as capable) lol. Funny again you don't see it so you must be correct in your guess about how many people do "use" their Subaru. Now, I am in no way saying it's even 50%. But, how many people buying GRCs are truly using the car AS intended? Not just speeding up and down the road in a fun/fast car? Watching commercials...... Guess you're ignoring whom your talking to. I. myself have certainly utilized all but my 2WD Justy. I get to talk to folks all the time about their "adventures" in their car(don't take "adventure" out of context. Again, they are not rock crawling these things. THAT is certainly the <1%.).


Well, I really have no idea where your land is and the way you described it, I just guessed. I have family in Nebraska and Wyoming and flew into Denver on a visit. Of course you can't spit and not hit a Subaru anywhere near Denver. But, just an hour drive north and it's a barren wasteland of no Subarus. I was surprised in that as I was going further north.


And it's not even totally about the level I'm talking about. It's plain and simply the capability ANY time. Every single year after our snow dusting, we get an influx of customers that are tired of being stuck in the snow. Cannot even guess the last time I heard someone stuck in a Subaru. Yes, I know it happens. I do watch the news about snow storms and see the occasional Subaru stuck. I didn't say the people KNOW how to use it. They just want to use it. And many more than you think actually do. You want to think you're right about numbers.......have you seen anything showing such low numbers? Or is it simply because the ones you see aren't doing it? Until you actually look....maybe at some social media groups that share their adventures.....heck, there are even groups for imported Sambars that modify them to do more "off road"......you're just blabbing about something you disagree with. Even "simple math" would be factual; but, you're just guessing(badly) and have yet to provide any proof of your assertions.






Just put your cursor on the scroll down and hold on. It just goes on and on and on and on.......




https://www.google.com/search?sca_es...h=819&dpr=2.22

[SoDealer]

Originally Posted by Pre

You and SoulStealer, missed the point like missing the forest for the trees. Math, simple math. Buyers who do this out of 100%? I bet it’s not even 1%. So you’re literally using some < 1% argument. And it sounds like some marketing/advertising/commercial deal. Mfr’s love this “lifestyle” crap and use it in their marketing all the time. CUV’s traversing some gravel/dirt road on a mountain, mom and dad in the front seats, kiddos in the back, and they are going for a camping “adventure”. Man, reality, and marketing are polar opposites. Y’all watch too many commercials.

I go to my land regularly. Was just there last month for 2 weeks. There are so many national forest trails that go around the lake, up mountains, etc, which is why there is a 450RX sitting in my garage. I’ve ridden them frequently, every year. Nope, no Subarus as I said. SXS the most common, that’s the weapon of choice. MX as well. You need 4WD if it’s a 4 wheeler. I see lifted 4X4 trucks, Jeeps, occasionally a Taco. One of my friends took his Acura MDX up one mountain but could only go up 1/3 the way and had to relent, and he’s got the scratches to prove it.

This is about like people quoting track times, the ring, etc, and they’ve never even done a track day. Just pure fodder man.

The least offroaded ICE Subaru SUV:

https://www.autoblog.com/reviews/202...ss-first-drive


"And it probably won't surprise you that among people who frequent the great outdoors, the Subaru Forester is one of the top choices. Subaru says 36% of Forester owners use their vehicles to carry outdoor equipment, which is tops in the industry, and nearly 25% of them go camping – only the Jeep Cherokee is higher, and barely so. The segment average is around 17%. And for those compact SUV shoppers who actually go off-road, the Forester is again second only to the Cherokee, with about 17% of owners, or double the segment average."

[dwf137]

Originally Posted by JustyWRC

Ask me again when the details have been officially released; cause, there will be misunderstandings and semantics involved.

So... Toyota.

Very curious about how they're going to differentiate themselves when they're hamstrung by buying another manufacturer's system.

[Straight6]

I am not surprised. Second to none REAL AWD system, fantastic boxer motors and overall top class engineering at an affordable price.

[JustyWRC]

Originally Posted by dwf137

So... Toyota.

Very curious about how they're going to differentiate themselves when they're hamstrung by buying another manufacturer's system.

Lemme say this. The steering shaft of an Outback. The window switches. The keyless entry system......many more examples.

[YungBoba]

Originally Posted by Pre

CUV’s traversing some gravel/dirt road on a mountain, mom and dad in the front seats, kiddos in the back, and they are going for a camping “adventure”.

So, just out of curiosity. For this specific demographic that you described, what vehicle would you recommend for them?

[dwf137]

Originally Posted by JustyWRC

Lemme say this. The steering shaft of an Outback. The window switches. The keyless entry system......many more examples.

Right... but as far as the actual drivetrain.

With hybrids, Toyota is all-in on the engine powering the front wheels, the electric motor powering the rear. Is that going to be different with the Subaru?

[JustyWRC]

Originally Posted by dwf137

Right... but as far as the actual drivetrain.

With hybrids, Toyota is all-in on the engine powering the front wheels, the electric motor powering the rear. Is that going to be different with the Subaru?

Gah. They need to hurry up and "reveal" it. I'm not even sure I shoulda said what I just said. Don't think you got the "hint" I tried to give.

[Russ_G93]

The steering shaft alone is a Major Hint

[Pre]

Originally Posted by JustyWRC

I might take you up on that "bet" of <1%. I'll see what I can dig up. I think you are missing how many Subarus are sold versus RAV4s and CRVs and the like. I'd maybe agree of 1% of those(mainly cause they find out they are NOT as capable) lol. Funny again you don't see it so you must be correct in your guess about how many people do "use" their Subaru. Now, I am in no way saying it's even 50%. But, how many people buying GRCs are truly using the car AS intended? Not just speeding up and down the road in a fun/fast car? Watching commercials...... Guess you're ignoring whom you’re talking to. I. myself have certainly utilized all but my 2WD Justy. I get to talk to folks all the time about their "adventures" in their car(don't take "adventure" out of context. Again, they are not rock crawling these things. THAT is certainly the <1%.).

People that buy GRC’s or any performance car as mostly, just as you described. It’ll never see a road circuit/track, never see a mountain or canyon road unless it’s a once in 5 years vacation or something. They get used like a Prius, a commuter. The most performance thing they do is stomp on the pedal on a highway on-ramp, stomp on the pedal from a stop light, or 3 honks on the highway type nonsense.

Well, I really have no idea where your land is and the way you described it, I just guessed. I have family in Nebraska and Wyoming and flew into Denver on a visit. Of course you can't spit and not hit a Subaru anywhere near Denver. But, just an hour drive north and it's a barren wasteland of no Subarus. I was surprised in that as I was going further north.

In the mountains, national forest, next to a massive lake. Very rural. It’s SXS country, and 4WD country (trucks mostly)

And it's not even totally about the level I'm talking about. It's plain and simply the capability ANY time. Every single year after our snow dusting, we get an influx of customers that are tired of being stuck in the snow. Cannot even guess the last time I heard someone stuck in a Subaru. Yes, I know it happens. I do watch the news about snow storms and see the occasional Subaru stuck. I didn't say the people KNOW how to use it. They just want to use it. And many more than you think actually do. You want to think you're right about numbers.......have you seen anything showing such low numbers? Or is it simply because the ones you see aren't doing it? Until you actually look....maybe at some social media groups that share their adventures.....heck, there are even groups for imported Sambars that modify them to do more "off road"......you're just blabbing about something you disagree with. Even "simple math" would be factual; but, you're just guessing(badly) and have yet to provide any proof of your assertions.

Well I didn’t mention snow driving, winter driving, etc. You brought off “off pavement”. Snow driving, sure, Subaru is a great option, or any decent AWD system by multiple mfr’s.

Social media is a plague on society. The combination of that nonsense and the 6” piece of glass = futile. I’ve seen the lifted Crossteks and Outbacks on social media, set up for “overlanding” etc. That’s exactly what I’m talking about. You think you’re average Subaru buyer is putting a lift kit on them and hitting ruts? Not a chance in hell. It’s like you said yourself, about like GRC or CTR owners, hitting the track, single digit %. Just because some people do it on social media and blabber about it doesn’t mean it’s even remotely common. Real off road stuff = powersports vehicles, or 4X4, and ground clearance. That doesn’t mean rock crawling either. I understand your point, really do, it’s just trotted out entirely too much via advertisement and the overwhelming majority, performance car, Subaru, whatever, they are doing to drive it to the stores and their job and that’s it.

[Pre]

Originally Posted by YungBoba

So, just out of curiosity. For this specific demographic that you described, what vehicle would you recommend for them?

If it’s just going to be some dirt road man, you could literally do that in an AWD minivan and have all the room, and then some, for children, camping gear, name it. A compact or full size truck with a tonneau so you have a bed to store all your camping gear, the same. Or the overlanders wet dream, a Sprinter or the like. If you really want to go where you want, 4X4 truck. If you plan a trip, you cannot control Mother Nature, rain, mud, etc, that follows suit.

[mcarb002]

As someone who has a minivan and just recently went to a BLM trail with my family on a dirt road. It’s doable of course, but it’s not ideal. The Sienna at least rides very low and you could feel the car was not happy being off pavement. I’d rather just get a used rig. Old 4Runner or Taco. That’s 100% what I will do when my kids get older and it justifies as we’d do more “outdoorsy” stuff. Sienna will be fine for the occasional adventure.

Sprinter van is apples to oranges. Nobody needs that much space unless you have a third kid+. It’s basically an airport shuttle bus that fits like 12 people and the 4x4 can take you off road. Plus it puts you on a whole different pricing bracket. I think bare bones the 4x4 diesel starts at like 60+ last time I checked. Might even be more now with how popular they’ve gotten the past few years. Lady in my old neighborhood had one but it was justified as she had like 6 fregging kids. It never saw any off-roading.

[YungBoba]

Originally Posted by Pre

If it's just going to be some dirt road man, you could literally do that in an AWD minivan and have all the room, and then some, for children, camping gear, name it. A compact or full size truck with a tonneau so you have a bed to store all your camping gear, the same. Or the overlanders wet dream, a Sprinter or the like. If you really want to go where you want, 4X4 truck. If you plan a trip, you cannot control Mother Nature, rain, mud, etc, that follows suit.

What if someone doesn't want to drive a minivan? Aside from the perception of it being a "lame mom car", there are other reasons I can think of as to why someone wouldn't want to drive one. If you're a family of 4 (2 adults 2 kids) then a third row isn't necessary. They're also larger and heavier than most small to medium-sized crossovers, and are generally more expensive.

For what it's worth, I like minivans. I grew up in minivans. My folks had an MPV, then multiple Odysseys. I went on a trip with a bunch of friends last month and we had a Pacifica Hybrid as a rental. It was awesome, super comfortable, well-appointed, and handled inclement weather with relative ease. But I do think there are reasons why someone would choose something like, say, a Subaru Outback over a minivan. The Outback is about 1,000lbs lighter and 10 inches shorter (shorter can be a good thing depending on who you ask and their use case, in this case I'm talking a family of 4 with no need for a third row) while having almost identical cargo capacity compared to a Sienna and being $10K cheaper ($29K vs $39K for the base model of both cars).

Same thing with a truck: not everyone wants to drive a truck, for various reasons. If you're a family of 4 who takes 2 camping trips a year and don't do any serious hauling, a truck is overkill. You'd rather have more interior space and a more comfortable ride vs. a bed that you'll rarely use.

Again, I'm talking about regular boring families from the suburbs, not serious offroad enthuasiasts. While I agree that there are some folks who drive a lifted Crosstrek/Forester/Outback/etc. who think they are hot **** and plaster their car all over Instagram and think that they can conquer any mountain, those folks are in the minority. Your regular suburban mom/dad who drives an Outback probably didn't buy their car thinking that it's a serious rock crawler that can compete with a true 4x4. They bought their car because they need 1 car that can do a little bit of everything (even if it's not exceptional at any one specific thing), and IMO Subarus have always been fantastic in that regard, especially at the lower trims (base/Premium) where they are great value propositions.

[dwf137]

love our highlander. boring CUV.

i don't think it's the best thing in the world, but it fits a lot of stuff and has ground clearance for driving in snow.

fits the bill.

i don't care what anyone thinks of what I drive. it works for me.

[JustyWRC]

Originally Posted by Pre

People that buy GRC’s or any performance car as mostly, just as you described. It’ll never see a road circuit/track, never see a mountain or canyon road unless it’s a once in 5 years vacation or something. They get used like a Prius, a commuter. The most performance thing they do is stomp on the pedal on a highway on-ramp, stomp on the pedal from a stop light, or 3 honks on the highway type nonsense.




In the mountains, national forest, next to a massive lake. Very rural. It’s SXS country, and 4WD country (trucks mostly)



Well I didn’t mention snow driving, winter driving, etc. You brought off “off pavement”. Snow driving, sure, Subaru is a great option, or any decent AWD system by multiple mfr’s.

Social media is a plague on society. The combination of that nonsense and the 6” piece of glass = futile. I’ve seen the lifted Crossteks and Outbacks on social media, set up for “overlanding” etc. That’s exactly what I’m talking about. You think you’re average Subaru buyer is putting a lift kit on them and hitting ruts? Not a chance in hell. It’s like you said yourself, about like GRC or CTR owners, hitting the track, single digit %. Just because some people do it on social media and blabber about it doesn’t mean it’s even remotely common. Real off road stuff = powersports vehicles, or 4X4, and ground clearance. That doesn’t mean rock crawling either. I understand your point, really do, it’s just trotted out entirely too much via advertisement and the overwhelming majority, performance car, Subaru, whatever, they are doing to drive it to the stores and their job and that’s it.

Which circles me all the way around back to my broken record point. Subaru offers what it has always offered. Capability. It's WHY they have the reputation they do. And recently. FINALLY, decided to actual build on that some more....with the Wilderness Family. Why not bank on what people were doing elsewhere? Not everyone does it? Of course. That's why it's a line now(trim, but, they are going to market it differently) for those that will. For those that won't. they have the rest. Toyota provided you with the GRC because you will. Those that won't get something else; but, is still available to those that kinda.

What Subaru offers is a car that can for those that will. And a car good enough for those that kinda. And a safe, reliable car for those that don't and just want a good car.

I would like what you described your land to be. Especially to have a watercraft and have fun on the lake(and SCUBA). I am just one that also wants to be near "more" as well. Certainly not where you are. That time I was down there(3rd time), yeah, I wasn't loving the traffic. lol

[mcarb002]

Originally Posted by dwf137

love our highlander. boring CUV.

i don't think it's the best thing in the world, but it fits a lot of stuff and has ground clearance for driving in snow.

fits the bill.

i don't care what anyone thinks of what I drive. it works for me.

This is the way. Everyone’s circumstance and list of priorities is different.

[YungBoba]

Originally Posted by dwf137

love our highlander. boring CUV.

i don't think it's the best thing in the world, but it fits a lot of stuff and has ground clearance for driving in snow.

fits the bill.

i don't care what anyone thinks of what I drive. it works for me.

Originally Posted by mcarb002

This is the way. Everyone's circumstance and list of priorities is different.

Pretty much this.

Some people will never like crossovers/CUVs, and that's fine. Nobody is forcing them to. Not everything has to appeal to everyone. But there is definitely a place in the market for them and a (rather large) demographic for which those types of vehicles make perfect sense. Just like how there's a place in the market for sports cars, hybrids, minivans, EVs, 4x4s, small city cars, hot hatches, crazy trucks with 700HP+ from the factory, etc.

[Brahmzy]

Reliable. LOL!

Yeah, no.

Typical paid CR deal here - it was just Subarus turn.

[SoDealer]

Originally Posted by Brahmzy

Reliable. LOL!

Yeah, no.

Typical paid CR deal here - it was just Subarus turn.

Clearly you don't know how CR works or you'd realize how stupid your comment is, but even if CR was on the take...there's zero chance Subaru is outspending Toyota or Honda... or anyone else for that matter for this recognition.

[Kostamojen]

Or maybe Toyota/Lexus and Honda's reliability has just gone down that much.

[Brahmzy]

Originally Posted by SoDealer

Clearly you don't know how CR works or you'd realize how stupid your comment is, but even if CR was on the take...there's zero chance Subaru is outspending Toyota or Honda... or anyone else for that matter for this recognition.

We're talking hundreds of billions of dollars here. I think all sorts of **** is always afoot with any of these ratings. If you think these are always on the up n up, you're clearly naive. Everything has an agenda and everything is manipulated.

And yes, Toyota quality has nosedived on certain models.

That's the thing too, certain metrics don't reflect a lot of the truth. Base Foresters, Outbacks and Crosstreks have had pretty great reliability. Low torque boring appliances - and those are the top sellers. The flagship SUV Ascent? Reliably disaster since its release, yet this metric doesn't sway the whole?