Free Subaru Logger - Page 3

bofh · 05-24-2005, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by calvinc

time-zones make instant answer/replies quite difficult - you're just gonna have to bear with me... :-)

It's only 7 hours.

But is does mean I can avoid morning drive time radio in the US by streaming 5fm's afternoon show.

As to the cable thing, some USB to serial converters are optoisolated. This could help... However, getting the right tools is always a good plan.

* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.

colby · 05-24-2005, 02:44 PM

I tried to make sense of the obd-2.com website to see what cable you are referring to, but started to get a headache. That site is a nightmare. Let me try and explain the RS-232 to ISO-9141 interface issue:

------------
* RS-232 from your PC signals with +/- 12V (although the voltages seem to get smaller and smaller these days as chipmakers cut corners and nobody seems to care about RS-232 much anymore).
* RS-232 uses "full duplex" where there is a seperate wire for each of the two parties to talk on.

* ISO-9141 from you car uses the +12V supply from you car and signals betwen +12 and 0 V.
* ISO-9141 is "half duplex" where all parties communicate on one wire by taking turns talking and connecting to the wire electrically in a way that if you are not talking, others can talk (open collector signalling in this case).
-------------

You need some small amount of simple electronics to interface between these two systems - they are not electrically equivalent. There are ways you can do it without optocouplers, but optos are just as easy to do and provide some extra margin of safety against damage to the ECU or PC if there are problems.

I chose to make a USB based serial interface to elimate the problems that some laptops have with low RS-232 signaling voltages and to allow the interface to operate at obscure/arbitrary baud rates that most PC UARTs don't support. Many newer laptops don't have serial ports anymore either.

cpturbo · 05-24-2005, 05:51 PM

Does this software work if you have a UTEC installed. I have a Delta Dash cable set-up and a UTEC on my car and the program does not work. I have tried everything.

Thanks

Jaxx · 05-24-2005, 06:43 PM

obd-2 web site is a mess but most of the obd-2 protocol was written by that guy ...

colby · 05-24-2005, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaxx

obd-2 web site is a mess but most of the obd-2 protocol was written by that guy ...

now it all makes perfect sense...

MMBOOST · 05-24-2005, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by colby

now it all makes perfect sense...

hahaha and here I thought I might get flamed for my original complaint. I'm gonna write that guy and offer him some free web authoring!

Cheveyboy · 05-25-2005, 12:13 AM

I have a question.
With the two versions of the cable, wrx or generic, will the wrx one with the powered pin that allows reflashing be safe to use on a car other then a subaru, understading that it will not be able to flash it? Or do we have to buy both cables?

Thanks!

crazymikie · 05-25-2005, 12:26 AM

Depends on what that pin connects to in the other car. If there's nothing there, you are probably okay. OBD standard only specifies a few pins, the rest are left for manufacturer use.

What kind of car?

calvinc · 05-25-2005, 03:00 AM

Quote:

streaming 5fm's afternoon show

5fm rocks - garreth cliff sux!

a guy called adrian mailed me this link:
h*t*t*p*:*/*/*p*r*j*.*p*e*r*q*u*i*n*.*c*o*m*/*o*b*d*i*i*/
(remove all the * in the link - nasioc says i cant post an url until i've made 10 posts)

seems like it would work fine, supports the right protocol and pin 15 isnt neccessary for diagnostics - i'm not an electronics guru. this schematic will not work for reflashes though! get the wrx one from tactrix if you intend to reflash.

calvin.

x99percent · 05-25-2005, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cpturbo

Does this software work if you have a UTEC installed. I have a Delta Dash cable set-up and a UTEC on my car and the program does not work. I have tried everything.

Thanks

Many people use DeltaDash on UTEC-equipped cars without issues. I have never been aware of a problem.

crazymikie · 05-25-2005, 10:51 AM

I have used Deltadash with a UTEC and some of the readings are incorrect. The UTEC fudges signals to change the behaviour of the car (inherent to a piggyback), so the DeltaDash will read the altered signals from the UTEC. On top of this, I believe there is a 3PSI offset for boost readings for some reason.

Mike

x99percent · 05-25-2005, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazymikie

I have used Deltadash with a UTEC and some of the readings are incorrect. The UTEC fudges signals to change the behaviour of the car (inherent to a piggyback), so the DeltaDash will read the altered signals from the UTEC. On top of this, I believe there is a 3PSI offset for boost readings for some reason.

I agree.

It's not that they are "incorrect"... DD is reporting *exactly* what the ECU is seeing (UTEC-modified MAF and MAP signals).

- The UTEC tweaks the MAP sensor signal going to the ECU to avoid hitting fuel cut.
- The MAF value that the ECU sees is tweaked by the UTEC's fuel map and OLF injector settings.
- Ignition timing values logged from the ECU are obviously not being used if you are using a UTEC ignition map... regardless, the knock correction and IAM values read from the ECU can be used as an indication of how "happy" the ECU is with the UTEC tune.

However, I don't think this the problem cpturbo is experiencing.

cpturbo · 05-25-2005, 12:15 PM

Delta dash and UTEC installed work fine together. It's the"Free Subaru Logger" that will not work with the Delta dash cable and a UTEC installed. At least I think that is the reason. I will not unplug my UTEC to find out. I will, however, connect my delta dash cable to a friends car and try the Free logger.

Thanks for the help
CP

CMJ · 05-25-2005, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cpturbo

Delta dash and UTEC installed work fine together. It's the"Free Subaru Logger" that will not work with the Delta dash cable and a UTEC installed. At least I think that is the reason. I will not unplug my UTEC to find out. I will, however, connect my delta dash cable to a friends car and try the Free logger.

Thanks for the help
CP

The Delta Dash cable does work, I use it.

chewbakarox · 05-25-2005, 04:08 PM

guru's, please educate an engine management n00b: can this tool be used to tell if my cobb AP is having any ill effects on my engine (knocking/detonation)? i checked out the screenshots of the software, and it shows multiple A/F readings that you can monitor......can i somehow use these to determine how safely my engine is running?

TIA.

cpturbo · 05-25-2005, 05:19 PM

To answer the previous posters question. Yes, as long as the software can report on Knock correction and the IAM; however, it could mean that you have a tank of bad gas.

Now for my question.

To the people using the Delta Dash cable. Do you also have a UTEC installed? Thanks

CP

chewbakarox · 05-25-2005, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cpturbo

To answer the previous posters question. Yes, as long as the software can report on Knock correction and the IAM; however, it could mean that you have a tank of bad gas.

Now for my question.

To the people using the Delta Dash cable. Do you also have a UTEC installed? Thanks

CP

what is IAM? and does anyone know if the software track knock correction? TIA.

willguidry · 05-25-2005, 09:06 PM

The software does report the knock sensor timing.

One question for all though. Have ANY of you figured out how to have this fecker actually LOG your data?

Cause, I tried everything, and it won't write anything to the .csv file I tell it save it to.

CMJ · 05-25-2005, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willguidry

The software does report the knock sensor timing.

One question for all though. Have ANY of you figured out how to have this fecker actually LOG your data?

Cause, I tried everything, and it won't write anything to the .csv file I tell it save it to.

Pay more attention

You will not be able to save you log files until the next revision is released.

calvinc · 05-26-2005, 04:48 AM

Quote:

Delta dash and UTEC installed work fine together. It's the"Free Subaru Logger" that will not work with the Delta dash cable and a UTEC installed.

state the facts please. until someone on this forum has tried both and actually says "i tried it and deltadash works but tari dl1 didnt", this means nothing.

deltadash and tari dl1 use exactly the same communications protocol. i dont see how its possible for 1 to work and not the other.

somebody please try them both on a UTEC and put this to rest. if the tari software doesnt work i'd like to know.

regards,
calvin.

r0nm4n · 05-26-2005, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by calvinc

state the facts please. until someone on this forum has tried both and actually says "i tried it and deltadash works but tari dl1 didnt", this means nothing.

deltadash and tari dl1 use exactly the same communications protocol. i dont see how its possible for 1 to work and not the other.

somebody please try them both on a UTEC and put this to rest. if the tari software doesnt work i'd like to know.

regards,
calvin.

I have a UTEC and tari dl1 works perfectly. I do not have Delta Dash however.

willguidry · 05-26-2005, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMJ

Pay more attention

You will not be able to save you log files until the next revision is released.

Huh...I'm sorry...It's my mistake. I thought when someone puts a feature into the feature notes, it means it's a functional piece of a software package.

*taken from http://www.tari.co.za/products.htm*

Features

Features currently available:
- view saved log files
- view live data

So yeah..... logging isn't too hard to enable in any application. It's like the first thing you learn when coding. If someone could write an application like this, they could have easily included logging like they advertised.

TPIWWL (This Program is Worthless without Logging)

crazymikie · 05-26-2005, 10:01 AM

No offense, but I think the fact that someone is doing this for _free_ would warrant a little more support from the community. The author didn't even post the link up here.

Also, I believe the release notes were reffering to the ability to open saved log files from other apps. I'm not sure.

willguidry · 05-26-2005, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazymikie

No offense, but I think the fact that someone is doing this for _free_ would warrant a little more support from the community. The author didn't even post the link up here.

Also, I believe the release notes were reffering to the ability to open saved log files from other apps. I'm not sure.

Oh, well... it's rather misleading then. It wouldn't even allow you to copy and paste the data from the LIVE monitor. Which, you can select it, so that means code was put in to disable COPY....which leads me to believe he is going to try and make some money off this.

WHICH, as a member of OPENECU and opensource in general is a no-no.

/shrug

I like the app, but not gonna pay money just to have a log feature. I'll just stick with printscreens.

Thanks anyhoo.

DammitBevis · 05-26-2005, 10:40 AM

That program isn't open source is it? Either way, you know what they say about looking a gift horse in the mouth. If you want a freebie program, the source is posted on openecu that makes a simple linux based SSP logger. It's pretty raw, but you can change what it logs in the source without a degree in c programming. It runs in cygwin on a windows machine, just compile and go.

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05-24-2005, 02:44 PM	#52
colby Scooby Newbie Member#: 15918 Join Date: Mar 2002 Chapter/Region: NWIC Location: Seattle, WA Vehicle: 08 STI/02 PGT WRX DGM / Orange	I tried to make sense of the obd-2.com website to see what cable you are referring to, but started to get a headache. That site is a nightmare. Let me try and explain the RS-232 to ISO-9141 interface issue: ------------ * RS-232 from your PC signals with +/- 12V (although the voltages seem to get smaller and smaller these days as chipmakers cut corners and nobody seems to care about RS-232 much anymore). * RS-232 uses "full duplex" where there is a seperate wire for each of the two parties to talk on. * ISO-9141 from you car uses the +12V supply from you car and signals betwen +12 and 0 V. * ISO-9141 is "half duplex" where all parties communicate on one wire by taking turns talking and connecting to the wire electrically in a way that if you are not talking, others can talk (open collector signalling in this case). ------------- You need some small amount of simple electronics to interface between these two systems - they are not electrically equivalent. There are ways you can do it without optocouplers, but optos are just as easy to do and provide some extra margin of safety against damage to the ECU or PC if there are problems. I chose to make a USB based serial interface to elimate the problems that some laptops have with low RS-232 signaling voltages and to allow the interface to operate at obscure/arbitrary baud rates that most PC UARTs don't support. Many newer laptops don't have serial ports anymore either.

05-24-2005, 05:51 PM	#53
cpturbo Scooby Specialist Member#: 49175 Join Date: Nov 2003 Vehicle: 2004 STI WRB	Does this software work if you have a UTEC installed. I have a Delta Dash cable set-up and a UTEC on my car and the program does not work. I have tried everything. Thanks

05-24-2005, 06:43 PM	#54
Jaxx Scooby Guru Member#: 177 Join Date: Aug 1999 Chapter/Region: NWIC Location: Austin, Texas, USA Vehicle: The 93 W/EJ20K-sold Subaru-less :(	obd-2 web site is a mess but most of the obd-2 protocol was written by that guy ...

05-25-2005, 12:13 AM	#57
Cheveyboy Scooby Specialist Member#: 34773 Join Date: Apr 2003 Chapter/Region: South East Location: Charlotte NC Vehicle: 2013 WRX STi SWP	I have a question. With the two versions of the cable, wrx or generic, will the wrx one with the powered pin that allows reflashing be safe to use on a car other then a subaru, understading that it will not be able to flash it? Or do we have to buy both cables? Thanks!

05-25-2005, 12:26 AM	#58
crazymikie Scooby Specialist Member#: 56321 Join Date: Mar 2004 Chapter/Region: NESIC Location: Hopkinton, MA Vehicle: 2006 Honda El Camino Green	Depends on what that pin connects to in the other car. If there's nothing there, you are probably okay. OBD standard only specifies a few pins, the rest are left for manufacturer use. What kind of car?

05-25-2005, 10:51 AM	#61
crazymikie Scooby Specialist Member#: 56321 Join Date: Mar 2004 Chapter/Region: NESIC Location: Hopkinton, MA Vehicle: 2006 Honda El Camino Green	I have used Deltadash with a UTEC and some of the readings are incorrect. The UTEC fudges signals to change the behaviour of the car (inherent to a piggyback), so the DeltaDash will read the altered signals from the UTEC. On top of this, I believe there is a 3PSI offset for boost readings for some reason. Mike

05-25-2005, 12:15 PM	#63
cpturbo Scooby Specialist Member#: 49175 Join Date: Nov 2003 Vehicle: 2004 STI WRB	Delta dash and UTEC installed work fine together. It's the"Free Subaru Logger" that will not work with the Delta dash cable and a UTEC installed. At least I think that is the reason. I will not unplug my UTEC to find out. I will, however, connect my delta dash cable to a friends car and try the Free logger. Thanks for the help CP

05-25-2005, 04:08 PM	#65
chewbakarox Scooby Specialist Member#: 25478 Join Date: Oct 2002 Chapter/Region: SCIC Location: I fart 15 psi. Vehicle: 2003 WRX Sport Wagon PSM	guru's, please educate an engine management n00b: can this tool be used to tell if my cobb AP is having any ill effects on my engine (knocking/detonation)? i checked out the screenshots of the software, and it shows multiple A/F readings that you can monitor......can i somehow use these to determine how safely my engine is running? TIA.

05-25-2005, 05:19 PM	#66
cpturbo Scooby Specialist Member#: 49175 Join Date: Nov 2003 Vehicle: 2004 STI WRB	To answer the previous posters question. Yes, as long as the software can report on Knock correction and the IAM; however, it could mean that you have a tank of bad gas. Now for my question. To the people using the Delta Dash cable. Do you also have a UTEC installed? Thanks CP

05-25-2005, 09:06 PM	#68
willguidry Scooby Specialist Member#: 16388 Join Date: Mar 2002	The software does report the knock sensor timing. One question for all though. Have ANY of you figured out how to have this fecker actually LOG your data? Cause, I tried everything, and it won't write anything to the .csv file I tell it save it to.

05-26-2005, 10:01 AM	#73
crazymikie Scooby Specialist Member#: 56321 Join Date: Mar 2004 Chapter/Region: NESIC Location: Hopkinton, MA Vehicle: 2006 Honda El Camino Green	No offense, but I think the fact that someone is doing this for _free_ would warrant a little more support from the community. The author didn't even post the link up here. Also, I believe the release notes were reffering to the ability to open saved log files from other apps. I'm not sure.

05-26-2005, 10:40 AM	#75
DammitBevis Scooby Newbie Member#: 3569 Join Date: Jan 2001 Chapter/Region: MWSOC Location: St. Louis MO, USA Vehicle: 2006 STi AW	That program isn't open source is it? Either way, you know what they say about looking a gift horse in the mouth. If you want a freebie program, the source is posted on openecu that makes a simple linux based SSP logger. It's pretty raw, but you can change what it logs in the source without a degree in c programming. It runs in cygwin on a windows machine, just compile and go.