50/50 Water/meth PI using FrostByte controller + 2 FAILsafes

[Apb_pools]

About to install 4 race valves for port injecting water/meth mix for cooling and power. Want to wring out all of oem turbo before going bigger. Car is struggling on full e85 (83%) so at 50% now waiting for additional fueling.

Oem intake on order from ebay.

[Apb_pools]

Work in progress. Started with 2 but will add 2 more injectors for total of 4. Changed my mind.




Will have two failsafes:

1) If controller/system is off when pwr 12v switched on car
2) If pressure sensor sends signal

both will communicate to ECU and Cobb flashed table to limp car, kinda like FlexFuel did with Cobb1 and Cobb2.

Then I will add a double toggle on/off to kill the meth injection system AND kill the failsafe which is gonna be activated when controller is switched off. To run maps other than the one that will require PI injection on top of DI injection. Should mostly be PnP, like 12v switched and gnd will be stolen/piggyied off any electrical connector having one, eg rear o2 sensor (but hard to reach preferably on top of engine will find something like front o2 lmao--thinking aloud)

That is the plan..

[Apb_pools]

Waiting on drill and tap and some time..

[PhantomxSwami]

I just have a couple bolt ons for now. Have an AEM v3 kit I want to install but not sure where to do it. I have 2 nozzles but maybe spraying from the TMIC would be best? I primarily want to use it for cooling (40:60) because it is 100-110 daily for me and even on my e30 map my CAT rises to 130-140 depending on gear. Any advice? I had the kit installed on my vag 2.7t but just sold the car minus the kit.

[Apb_pools]

Originally Posted by PhantomxSwami

I just have a couple bolt ons for now. Have an AEM v3 kit I want to install but not sure where to do it. I have 2 nozzles but maybe spraying from the TMIC would be best? I primarily want to use it for cooling (40:60) because it is 100-110 daily for me and even on my e30 map my CAT rises to 130-140 depending on gear. Any advice? I had the kit installed on my vag 2.7t but just sold the car minus the kit.

Only theoretical advice, no practical. You may be ahead of me having run meth injection before.

How long?
What did you use?
Every day map w meth injections?

Spraying into TMIC isnt ideal. At all. No room behind either. I have OEM tmic.

I want fueling and some cooling. I plan to have a kill map or send it map with meth injection via 4 valves 625cc each directly into intake runners above tgv using one logic/table. Plus i will plumb a fifth one and its own controller/table logic into hot side of turbine. For cooling and to push turbo a bit more perhaps, 1-2psi late in rpm before it exhausts itself.

That's the plan.

2 failsafes. FrostByte has internal failsafe and pressure sensor failsafe. Switch for both off when not on send it map, plan is to have 400/450/500+ mapping on e50. 400/450 on DI only.

I returned my AEM V3.

[uglywrx]

Sorry that I cant offer any advice, but i can offer some encouragement. Hopefully people start posting more with this gen

[Apb_pools]

Gonna be 50/50 due to meth nature and my desire not to service nozzles and system as much as possible.

[Apb_pools]

[Apb_pools]

Drills and tap ordered from McMaster. I will be doing the drilling and tapping directly into my intake manifold as it sits in the engine. They make drills and taps that remove debris back up a hole.

75$ for two drills and one tap with split tips and spiraled flutes.

[Apb_pools]

Drills and tap ordered from McMaster. I will be doing the drilling and tapping directly into my intake manifold as it sits in the engine. They make drills and taps that remove debris back up a hole.

75$ for two drills and one tap with split tips and spiraled flutes.

[Apb_pools]

Wiring diagram for controller and 2 outputs: pump on/off w own 3D table and injectors x4 (batch) w own 3D table.



3rd output is going to be pressure sensor, same they use on Reflex, industry standard.



That leaves 4th output open for volute injector on turbo, with own 3D logic.

[Apb_pools]

Tap and drills are here too:

[Apb_pools]

This is where we at: OEM Turbo + E60



This is where we wanna be: OEM Turbo stg2 + E50/PI



Just to keep thread alive. I been busy and waiting on turbo.

Notable kills any mustangs that tried, cadillac blackwing v6 and few q50s.

[Apb_pools]

Turbo is here







Arp studs ordered
Gaskets ordered
Appointment 11th of September

Just a small update

[azul89]

Thank you for keeping us in the loop. Which meth kit did you order. My tuner was going to install the AEM kit. Our Goal is e50 for power and 93 as a extra map for when ethanol isnt available. How did tapping the intake manifold go? Would you suggest this route to others? If so there is a manifold on ebay right now. I will snatch that up!

[Apb_pools]

Originally Posted by azul89

Thank you for keeping us in the loop. Which meth kit did you order. My tuner was going to install the AEM kit. Our Goal is e50 for power and 93 as a extra map for when ethanol isnt available. How did tapping the intake manifold go? Would you suggest this route to others? If so there is a manifold on ebay right now. I will snatch that up!

So my kit is an amalgamation of 4 different parts to make something which works up to my standards. AEM kit didn't cut it, i had purchased one and then returned it.

My aux fueling kit:

controller frostbyte or cortex (fully programmable 3D tables)
pro meth big pump
devils own 2.5gal tank
usrt race valves x5
pro meth nozzles 425cc x5
maybe forgetting some things

As said previously it will have two failsafes. Pressure and system on/off which should communicate back to a ecu table to trigger limp mode. Once tested and proven to work i am considering switching the pump to an external fuel pump so that i can run ethanol mix or regular fuel. I am not a fan of meth and would rather use one fuel for convenience.







I should be getting 4an lines and connectors tonight so some time tomorrow i will connect it all up and mock it outside of car to test run and see the spray pattern with distilled water.

[Apb_pools]

Youtube video testing at 20hz (poss up to 60) and 160-170psi and 30%, 60% and 90% then to 20% then off. Yes leaks, fixed them all but this only testing w distilled water.

2022 subaru wrx auxiliary fueling w 3D tunable controller - meth injection - YouTube

2022 subaru wrx auxiliary fueling w 3D tunable controller - meth injection - YouTube

90% at 60hz and 160psi through 425cc nozzle

YouTube (Short URL)

YouTube (Short URL)

The application for this is universal but for my car i will switch to an ethanol compatible external fuel pump and plan to inject more of the same mix that would be in my tank. Also pump is installed incorrectly, should be reversed for gravity flow from tank, have learned that since. Plan to make this PnP like Cobb makes their flex kits, with oem style connectors for most of electrical connections requiring switched 12 and gnd. Unfortunately this still involves tapping intake or finding another way of accessing the intake--->combustion chamber.

[Apb_pools]

Hmm..



Full build? Dont wanna blow a tranny..

https://m.youtube.com/shorts/y8tWWRf1mIM

[Apb_pools]

[Apb_pools]

I did some bench testing.

Tested nozzle flow at different pressures. Looks like that more pressure flows more, all other things equal. I did not measure exactly except by looking at it visually and comparing and it seems like 30%+ more flow at 160psi than you get at 100psi. Pumps are adjustable w a small allen wrench.

As i understand this the best configuration would be to have:

1. smallest possible nozzle
2. highest possible pressure
3. achieving req flow at 66-75 duty cycle


Nozzle mounting location matters as well. Best location would be right at the turbo snail charge side with no need for intercooler w proper software control of fueling and feedback loop (racing solutions). Next best is right post fmic and pre iat, amateur racing solutions and enthusiasts. Lastly the worst option is the intake runners or tgv-like plate inserts due to being post iat and providing only fueling without cooling effect curing compensation, car enthusiasts looking for pnp solutions.

Since this is not a race car, i dont care so much about iat compensations and mine will be mounted in the intake runners. This all started w needing more fuel, cooling was secondary. One runner is hard to reach and will have to be plumbed differently.

I have an extra oem intake that i can tap and send anyone who wants it, but i will need a core or you are buying the intake too, not just paying for tapping it. This is because inevitably i will not need one of the two intakes i have, one on car and one outside.

Hopefully if i have time i will try tapping intake today.

Also, forgot to add that best mounting location for this would be in the engine bay and keeping it all in there for safety.

[Apb_pools]

More testing today. Testing my 318cc/min nozzles (N0500) at 160psi and 25hz. They each flowed 421-424cc/min, spread of 3 average of 3 tests.

So thats ~1700cc/min out of 4 nozzles, quite alot. Will order smaller nozzles, more like 150-175cc to retest for myself as i am aiming at no more than 1000cc at 100%.

[Apb_pools]

Double post.

[Apb_pools]

Tapped intake. Easy peasy like butter. Its all plastic.



This one will be on ebay for sale. It can be sold like this (plugged) or with aux fueling setup. If anyone interested let me know. Options are: open, nozzles installed npt, alloy bung installed npt to 8mm nozzle.

I will be tapping my intake WHILE IN THE CAR and inserting nozzles. Its all plastic and i bought tap and drill that remove debris up top, so there was nothing falling into engine and if there was its plastic.





Mockups for fmic setup.

[Apb_pools]

Didnt secure them completely cuz this is not something should be screwed and unscrewed but secured once.

Have caps too.



Long tip smaller nozzles coming soon for my own install. I will be using only two solenoids due to limited fueling need.

[Apb_pools]

Apparently we can fire proper fuel injectors too. This is good news but it also requires a mounting solution.