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Old 07-13-2016, 11:59 PM   #26
binny
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slide View Post
I was just looking at my "stage 2" dyno graph from my '13 Sti and comparing it to my initial tune dyno on my gtx3576r and noticed I made more tq on the Gtx3576r than I did on the stock turbo at its peak tq rpm for the stocker (3750 rpm).



I don't know if that sentence makes sense. I read it 3 times and it sounds confusing unless you already know what I am talking about.

Yes but that's on a dyno where the turbo has a s*** ton of time to spool up, if you are on the road and stab the throttle @ that RPM the stocker would eat the GTX (until it catches up and flys by)
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Old 07-14-2016, 12:10 AM   #27
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Oh... Ok... But thats not how it felt to me.
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Old 07-14-2016, 01:12 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by binny View Post
Yes but that's on a dyno where the turbo has a s*** ton of time to spool up, if you are on the road and stab the throttle @ that RPM the stocker would eat the GTX (until it catches up and flys by)
That isn't exactly how an engine works w/regard to turbo response... the OEM turbo will likely spool faster when you punch it, but the GTX turbo is moving a larger mass of air at a lower pressure level. You're also comparing a built motor to a stock motor, so it becomes apples to oranges somewhere along the line, in my mind.

His dyno chart shows him reaching OEM boost levels around 4440 RPM and peak (29.8 PSI) boost around 4950 RPM. That is MUCH slower than all relevant VF-series turbos. He is, however, making 335 ft-lb of torque at 4400 RPM.

All-in-all, it's a very peaky package with a powerband in the 4500-7000 range - not exactly what the OP is looking for, but the strengths of the GTX-series turbos really do show, here. Even outside of the powerband, I bet the car is a TON of fun to drive.
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Old 07-14-2016, 11:02 PM   #29
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So if all P18 housings are the same, the vf22 (P20) will actually spool later than vf39? And the vf35 (P15) will spool faster?

I'm a bit hesitant to get a vf35 because it spooled like a td04 on that forrester guy's dyno. But maybe it is the only way.
Ok somone compared the two and P15 is bigger than td04. What an easter egg hunt.

Quote:
The VF35 has a very small exhaust turbine, but it's still a great deal larger than the TD04L-13G that comes stock on the WRX. Holding them next to each other, the stock turbo looks like a donut and the VF35 looks like a turbo.

Last edited by joek92; 07-15-2016 at 12:17 AM.
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Old 07-15-2016, 09:41 AM   #30
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What is it you really want to achieve here?
You seem to be bouncing around. Not that long ago you sounded like you were going to go w/the VF22 because you found something on iwsti.

Your description of what you want has been very vague.
What are your WHP and WTQ goals?
- Start with that FIRST.
- Then look for turbos in the power range
- Then start looking for the minor differences between the turbos that fall within that power range.

For instance, since you mentioned this earlier:
Element Tuning said the 16G does not spool as fast as the VF34(?). While true, they are in the same power band range but the VF34 is great for low end spool but the 16G gives a little more in the mid-band power.

And how well everything works together is all in the prep and the tune.
Everyone always talks about how fast the TD04 spools but a properly tuned VF34 w/basic support mods out-spools a stock TD04.

Last edited by Samurai Jack; 07-15-2016 at 09:49 AM.
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Old 07-15-2016, 12:28 PM   #31
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Goals:
Peak tq in 3rd gear at or below 3k rpm
Safe tuned at or below 18psi
93 oct
No power or tq goals

I want a turbo for my 07 sti EJ257 that spools faster than stock vf43/39. Right now I think it's the vf35.

You're right, I am bouncing around. The more I learn the less I know.

vf22 - seemed ideal but now I don't know. Tuner said all vf's are about the same until you push them hard. Also discovered that p20 is actually bigger than p18.

Assume td04 is too small for the 2.5L sti. So what is between td04 and vf39? According to post #14, it's might be a vf35. Ymmv.

Last edited by joek92; 07-15-2016 at 12:59 PM.
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Old 07-15-2016, 01:12 PM   #32
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Just stick with a normal VF series. The 257 already makes a mountain of torque at 3500 on a VF. The TD-04 doesn't belong on a ej257.
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Old 07-16-2016, 11:05 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joek92 View Post
Goals:

You're right, I am bouncing around. The more I learn the less I know.
This is true for all of us who are willing to admit it

Here is a suggestion:
You stated your goals are:
Peak tq in 3rd gear at or below 3k rpm
Safe tuned at or below 18psi
93 oct
No power or tq goals - you should have some kind of TQ/HP goals, otherwise you could get your answer with a resulting 100HP


Make it a little easier on yourself in deciding on a turbo.
Problem is, as far as the VF series, there is not a lot of information available.
Blouch has a very good rep and more than one tuner I have worked with has recommended them, so ...

Call Blouch, and tell them what your goals are.
Ask them what turbo they have that they would suggest would get you to your goals.
I've spoken with them before and they were very helpful.

Once you get a recommendation, you have a starting point for comparison to other brands; IHI, Tomei, etc.
An an example, if Blouch says that their TD05-16G XRT is what you want, you can either get that or look at comparable models from other brands.

Never be afraid to call the manufacture. Usually they are willing to help. That is good customer service and good customer services sells products, gets referrals, and gets repeat business

Last edited by Samurai Jack; 07-16-2016 at 12:26 PM.
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Old 07-16-2016, 11:50 AM   #34
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I will actually be installing a modified JDM VF36 (obviously twin scroll) onto my Outback XT this upcoming week. I have a feeling that the OP and I have somewhat similar goals (and/or grievances) with available options.

My goal can be summarized as "Seeking the absolute lowest RPM to break 320WTQ on pump gas"

For anyone that has come from various other makes/models and other forced induction vehicles, the turbo'd EJ's are a bit frustrating. I do love my subarus, which is why I have now owned 4 and continue to experiment with my Outback XT. However, if you're making relatively slow speed turns on high altitude (or even low altitude) mountain roads, the on/off power with the lag and slow spool of our design becomes glaring and annoying. It almost feels like one of the original turbo porsches.

The DI and flow redesign of the new WRX design does seem to solve a lot of the deficiencies. The 2015+ WRX feels significantly more usable for most driving. I only hope that there is an updated/redesigned increased displacement FA25 in the future ...... perhaps with the addition of port fuelling on top of DI.
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Old 07-18-2016, 10:06 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrsaturn7085 View Post
That isn't exactly how an engine works w/regard to turbo response... the OEM turbo will likely spool faster when you punch it, but the GTX turbo is moving a larger mass of air at a lower pressure level. You're also comparing a built motor to a stock motor.
Sorry I should have been more clear no comparison of built motor in my post (I was talking stock turbo v large turbo)

And yes larger mass of air @ same boost pressure -

but the only point I was trying to make (unsuccessfully) boost lag (actual lag not boost threshold / target boost) would be much more noticeable @ that RPM point on the big turbo than the small one
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Old 07-19-2016, 11:50 AM   #36
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When I chose a turbo for my personal vehicle (2011 sti-fp black)

I used this chart it should have flow rates of stock turbos as well.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2559017

-Leo
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Old 07-19-2016, 11:52 AM   #37
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Feel free to contact us for advice 6513488811 ext 108

Last edited by maperformance; 07-19-2016 at 12:13 PM.
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Old 07-21-2016, 12:11 PM   #38
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Thanks for the help guys. That turbo list should be stickied. It doesn't list anything with flow rate between vf39 and td04 but it's still invaluable reference tool in a sea of opinions.
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Old 07-21-2016, 01:07 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joek92 View Post
vf22 - seemed ideal but now I don't know. Tuner said all vf's are about the same until you push them hard. Also discovered that p20 is actually bigger than p18.
If you like the power/spool of this one, and would prefer to stick to a vf series, see if you can locate a vf23. Total power will be a little lower than the 22, but it will spool a little faster.
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Old 07-24-2016, 02:54 PM   #40
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So I bought a vf35 from the UK. Hopefully it's legit. Since I don't need to put it on right away, I plan to get detailed pics and measurements... what I really want find out is how the exhaust turbine housing compares to garrett/mhi using their respective a/r measurements.

Edit - this did not work out. Still looking.

Last edited by joek92; 08-15-2016 at 05:55 PM.
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Old 07-25-2016, 11:17 PM   #41
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You may have issues with compressor surge with the VF35 on a 2.5L I think it has the P15 hot side (smallest VF hot side) it'd probably spool up like a TD04
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Old 08-01-2016, 03:53 PM   #42
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^ Thank you that's helpful info. A UK shop has a rebuilt one for sale, said they ran it on their 2.5 L sti 'drift' car and it spooled very fast.

Turns out these turbos are hard to find. Best searches I've found are Facebook and Ebay worldwide. To get ebay worldwide Refine > shipping > worldwide.

Most are in UK or Australia. Seems to have come on 01-05 edm & au sti. Prices are $400-500 USD including shipping.
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Old 08-16-2016, 11:42 AM   #43
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Haven't got a vf35 yet.
But just wondering, if the td04 is 6cm and vf39 is about 7cm, does the P15 fall in between?

It was produced for a 2.0 sti motor which flows more than a 2.0 wrx.

GD chassis: While JDM sti went twinscroll and USDM sti had 2.5L, Europe & Australia got the vf35.

Logically its P15 should be bigger than td04 6cm but I would like to be sure.
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Old 08-14-2017, 03:25 PM   #44
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I've always wanted to try a VF37 twinscroll on a ej257 for a autocross build. I've seen quite a few sets of headers/up-pipe/turbo kits going for around $1000 not bad considering how much a 18g could cost
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Old 08-14-2017, 04:29 PM   #45
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Are you building for a specific event and plan on frequent rebuilds, or to see how fast you can kick out rod bearings?

Here is the boost plot when we had a GTX3067-R on our Spoolinator setup with OEM TMIC on 22psi. Response was pretty much like a light switch above ~2,700RPMs. It was fun, but took some getting used to modulating boost at auto-x.

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Old 08-14-2017, 06:16 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerBMotorsport View Post
Are you building for a specific event and plan on frequent rebuilds, or to see how fast you can kick out rod bearings?

Here is the boost plot when we had a GTX3067-R on our Spoolinator setup with OEM TMIC on 22psi. Response was pretty much like a light switch above ~2,700RPMs. It was fun, but took some getting used to modulating boost at auto-x.

Wow, that is quick spool!
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Old 02-10-2019, 04:00 PM   #47
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Currently looking at a vf20G from Turbo parts Canada
https://www.turbopartscanada.ca/coll...d-turbocharger

because I like that it spool as fast as the vf48. Any other turbo that I should be looking at in that price range that spool as fast or faster ?

power goal is just a modest 330whp
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Old 02-10-2019, 04:43 PM   #48
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Fast spooling is nice, but it's definitely a 'be careful what you wish for' condition. Fast response at low RPMs mean the rod bearings take a big beating. If you're OK with the likelihood of sooner than later rebuilds then go for it. Otherwise, I would strongly recommend looking at a setup that has at least, or more, lag than the OEM turbo. More lag means less stress on the bearings. Just something to keep in mind.
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Old 02-10-2019, 07:13 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lowbee View Post
Currently looking at a vf20G from Turbo parts Canada
https://www.turbopartscanada.ca/coll...d-turbocharger

because I like that it spool as fast as the vf48. Any other turbo that I should be looking at in that price range that spool as fast or faster ?

power goal is just a modest 330whp
You want it to spool faster than mine or was mine sufficient?
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Old 02-10-2019, 08:03 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blurred View Post
You want it to spool faster than mine or was mine sufficient?
Yeah, if I remember correctly you hit 225wtq and 130whp by 3,000 rpm, I'd like between 250-300wtq and 160whp by 3,000rpm just like what I had before I switched from UEL header to EL header. I also don't want a big drop off in my power and torque after 4,500 rpm and that's the reason I am shopping for a turbo that will spool as fast as the vf48 (but not faster than vf48 after KillerB's comment above) with some extra top end.



All stock hardware that it with exception noted and a pro-tune

Last edited by lowbee; 02-10-2019 at 08:13 PM.
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