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Old 06-02-2018, 01:51 PM   #1
UrdnotWrexSTi
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2008 STi
Aspen White

Default Help me decide my new turbo

So I am building my car again and this time it's going to be stronger and more powerful (Hopefully) than before... But, I want a new turbo...


Quick mod list:


IAG closed deck block
Mildly built heads (Fresh cut, GSC Valves and GSC Springs)
ID1300
IAG Fuel Rails and lines
Aeromotive FPR
IAG TGV deletes
Flex-Fuel (maybe)


All turbos I am looking at are 3in inlet, internal wastegate and rated to around 500-600hp



I had a 20G-XTR that made 446hp and 456tq on E85, 1000cc injectors and other supporting mods. I don't want that again, I want a bigger higher flowing "heavy-hitter" turbo. I don't want to go rotated (yet) for cost reasons so I'm set on stock location turbos. I also daily drive my car and love to go on cruises so there's that...


I am currently looking into a ATP GTX3576R Gen2 turbo, but I've been watching on youtube and forums that these don't perform to their full potential in stock location form, with people only netting around 380-400hp when I've seen these same turbos make 500-550 in rotated form with same injectors and pump and so on... I've always wanted a gtx30 or 35r but now I am not sure. It's weird I think because these turbos flow about 58lb/min and yet it performs poorly. What do you guys think of this turbo? Too laggy? Not enough punch?



Another turbo is the Blouch Dom 3.5 or 4.0XTR... I've had good luck with my 20G as it never blew a seal or anything, so I trust Blouch. I like that they use Garret CHRA's too. Are these turbos too laggy?



And finally Forced Performance Red or Black turbos. I just found out FP just updated them with ball bearings and a "Xona" CHRA. They flow about 61lb/min with the Red and 71lbs/min with the Black. I want to know if these turbos are as laggy as people say? I am fine with spool coming in at 4000rpm, so if anyone has personal insight on one or both of these, I'd appreciate it!



Long post but I am about to drop a sizeable amount of money on a new turbo, so I would like to make the right choice!
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Old 06-02-2018, 10:18 PM   #2
point78
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Rotate, otherwise how about a spoolinator with a 3576?
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Old 06-18-2018, 08:33 PM   #3
AlinaWRXSTI
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I would go for Forced Performance Green turbo if I were you. It can give enough power, and itís great cause it fits in stock location ďbolt-onĒ.
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Old 06-18-2018, 08:49 PM   #4
TriAxis 6
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Plasma Blue Pearl

Default Help me decide my new turbo

You are going to run out of injector regardless if you are looking at turbos of that size. You want to avoid IDCís of 80 or more so you can comfortably get on it.
Double the likelyhood of what I just said if you are considering e85. Fueling, if not addresses and sorted correctly will hold back the true potential of all those turbos, especially on E85

Also, what pump are you using, you need to consider that too. You will likely need a single Wally 450 high flow, likely hardwired.

EWG would help out too

If you had all that sorted out correctly and wanted to stay with a stock location, and break 500, Iíd look at an FP Black, even though I absolutely adore Blouch/Garrett products above all

Do it once, do it right, if not, wait until you can, youíll thank me later.

Best of luck
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Old 06-19-2018, 06:19 PM   #5
envader
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FWIW, I have an FP Red and I'm not seeing full spool-up until about 5k RPM. Although mine is journal bearing, and I don't have AVCS, so I would imagine BB + AVCS would help quite a bit.

Do they really offer a BB Red now?? I'm not seeing it on their website. Might have to have mine upgraded!
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Old 06-19-2018, 06:20 PM   #6
envader
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TriAxis 6 View Post
You are going to run out of injector regardless if you are looking at turbos of that size. You want to avoid IDCís of 80 or more so you can comfortably get on it.
Double the likelyhood of what I just said if you are considering e85. Fueling, if not addresses and sorted correctly will hold back the true potential of all those turbos, especially on E85

Also, what pump are you using, you need to consider that too. You will likely need a single Wally 450 high flow, likely hardwired.
Nothing a good aftermarket fuel pressure regulator can't help out with! But bigger injectors and a hardwired pump will definitely do the job as well.
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Old 06-20-2018, 10:37 PM   #7
Rickyh
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I have the ball bearing black and i get full boost (35psi) by 4600. It starts making boost a little over 3k. To me that isn't too laggy considering the size of the turbo. Car put down 540 dyno dynamics and 604 dynojet. You will no doubt need to beef up your fuel system.
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Old 06-21-2018, 07:30 AM   #8
point78
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Looks like the OP lives in Colorado.

If he's in Denver or higher, the altitude changes everything & he can't go by what every one says their turbo goes-if they are lower than he is.

OP needs to call, or better yet, stop by "TheBoostCreep" up by Longmont, or "Revolutions peformance" down in the springs, or Mofab. & talk to them about your goals. (There are couple others in Denver area that have good rep, but I haven't dealt with them, like 5250 etc.)
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Old 06-22-2018, 12:57 AM   #9
PDXREALTOR
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I'm running over right at 500 hp at 28 psi in 4th gear on a jb green htz. It spools early on a 4th pull, but in a 3rd pull it spools about 43-4500.black should be similar. In 3rd I run 1 degree more timing and I've ran 520-530s/460 consistently.

Fp black seems to top out about 600 hp, but torque is in the mid to upper 500s from what I see over and over.

I think fp offers a great value for stock location. They also have the zero, which I haven't really read up on. If I was to want something more than a black I'd look into a big rotated turbo that had 750+ potential. Haha that's an enite different level though.


With a closed deck iag block, you'll have headroom from even the most a black can give you. This directly from iag.
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Old 06-22-2018, 11:35 AM   #10
anjuna
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1.5xtr
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Old 06-23-2018, 10:21 PM   #11
2012stie85wagon
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Ball bearing fp Black is the way to go. You will need to go ewg to control that much boost. Top mount Intercooler car hits full boost right before 4K and it pulls hard. Car made 587 on 30 psi with plenty of life left in the turbo.
Car ran 10.6 on tmic in full weight hatch.
Fp Black for the win
I just so happen to be selling my fp black ball bearing. Iíll ship it to ya for 1100. No shaft play. Low miles. Stock location
Hit me up 60728728threefour
I listed it about a week ago on here.
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Old 06-26-2018, 02:08 AM   #12
Adam2009WRX
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Forced Performance turbos are great, however from what Iíve heard the FP black can be a bit laggy
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Old 02-12-2019, 01:56 PM   #13
skatensnow16
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I have a dom 3 and 44 mm ewg with uppipe for sale only 4100 miles on it if ur interested to much to daily
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Old 02-12-2019, 06:46 PM   #14
greygonzalez
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ISM

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There is a big debate with what forced performance turbo Togo with. Black or zero are highly recommended over red, I though have a red (journal) and put down some pretty good power on 21lbs. Will crank it up once I have the built block assembled. Here is my dyno sheet on dynojet



Also for reference I attached an excel sheet I put together for turbo sizes to help

https://teamviewer.box.com/s/fb215d9...9lxx0gcsjem8md
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Old 02-13-2019, 10:01 AM   #15
quiksilver_dragon
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Silver

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I'll just post my setup for, science.

I put this together 4 years ago and it's been a pretty solid car to drive. The only thing that sucks is that it takes a while to spool up. But it keeps you from being stupid on the road. For autox, not so great. Lol.

dom4xtr
Stock long block + arp studs.
Five-0 1400cc
Aeromotive FPR
ID fuel line kit and top feed conversion
Walbro 450
e85
uppipe with 38mm external waste gate
catless turbo back 3"
ported intake manifold
tgv deletes
3" intake/turbo inlet
spearco top mount

at 23 psi it made 442/409 on the dyno

We've since maxed out the MAF and upped it to 25.5 psi and added Perrin standard sized equal length headers. On the dyno previously I was told every 1 psi was equivalent to around 20whp

So in essence I'm guessing that I'm (realistically) knocking on ~470whp mark

Last edited by quiksilver_dragon; 02-13-2019 at 10:13 AM.
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Old 02-13-2019, 08:29 PM   #16
igoiks
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wrb

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Dom 1.5 is about as big as you want on stick location, i had a jb fp red with cams made lots of power but spool sucked balls. Please go rotated
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