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Old 02-25-2021, 11:24 AM   #1
mhoward1
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Default GM will stop production of ICE vehicles by 2035

https://www.motorbiscuit.com/gm-anno...oB3MPowauY_p8I

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In a stunning announcement, GM says it will stop making all diesel and gas-powered cars and trucks. Its goal is to be carbon neutral by 2040 so to that end it will stop all diesel and gas-powered production by 2035. Thatís it. No more Duramax Silverados. No more V8 Corvettes. In fact; no more internal combustion anything.
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Old 02-25-2021, 11:30 AM   #2
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This one is going to be a hard one to believe. They make too much money on trucks and a lot of truck owners love their gas and diesels. They better get that EV truck to market fast so they can really see the market response. 15 years is a long time but not that long if you are expecting to replace a whole company's lineup like GM's with EV's.
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Old 02-25-2021, 11:33 AM   #3
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I had to check out a few sources to make sure this was accurate

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/28/b...-vehicles.html

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General Motors said Thursday that it would phase out petroleum-powered cars and trucks and sell only vehicles that have zero tailpipe emissions by 2035, a seismic shift by one of the world's largest automakers that makes billions of dollars today from gas-guzzling pickup trucks and sport utility vehicles.
Also

https://www.nbcnews.com/business/aut...gines-n1256055
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Old 02-25-2021, 11:54 AM   #4
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It's a target. A Goal. If they have to change their plan in 10 years, so be it.

Manufacturers reverse course on things like this all the time.
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Old 02-25-2021, 01:58 PM   #5
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I thought they already said this...?

15 years isn't a long time. it's 2-3 design cycles. It means you need a big capital expenditure plan now. You gotta figure out what to do with all your ICE people and facilities. They have a whole lab with dozens of test benches/dynos just for ICE.
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Old 02-25-2021, 02:14 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by arghx7 View Post
I thought they already said this...?

15 years isn't a long time. it's 2-3 design cycles. It means you need a big capital expenditure plan now. You gotta figure out what to do with all your ICE people and facilities. They have a whole lab with dozens of test benches/dynos just for ICE.
2-3 design cycles is not a big deal but this is a fundamental change from bread and butter offerings and assuming they generate the same revenue/profits from every single EV replacement in this time period. GM has one (arguably a good one) EV now, and sales have stagnated. They have one more coming out this year (Bolt EUV). Does the Lyriq and Hummer have enough revenue potential to fund all the changes they need to make for a full GM lineup?

But yes, this is just a plain and will probably change.
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Old 02-25-2021, 03:05 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dwf137 View Post
It's a target. A Goal. If they have to change their plan in 10 years, so be it.

Manufacturers reverse course on things like this all the time.
Yep. If the winds change so will their targets.
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Old 02-25-2021, 07:50 PM   #8
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Anyone can say things. I'll believe it when I see it.
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Old 02-26-2021, 09:16 AM   #9
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the more they talk about BEV's, the more their stock goes up. So can you blame them for making these kinds of announcements?
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Old 02-26-2021, 09:45 AM   #10
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I doubt this will actually happen by that date.
Cars? Sure. Heavy duty vehicles? Nope.
Its like airplanes. Ive read articles about battery powered ones. I think there should be a balance. Some vehicles will require good ol dino fuel.
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Old 02-26-2021, 09:57 AM   #11
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I believe it.... Market/Economic/Societal influences including shareholder (mutual funds/hedge funds/etfs) pressure will prevail, i.e. ESG.

15 years is far enough on the horizon for battery technology to progress and infrastructure to be built. Everything we be xAAS (blank as a service).

Of course this does not mean that ICE cars/trucks/vehicles will be gone from the roads.
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Old 02-26-2021, 10:41 AM   #12
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it's all hype till it actually happens , They have obviously been read the green riot act and want to comply with current admin dreams. But why haven't we heard any viable power grid suppliers to supply the electricity needed. Some times pay attention to whats in front of your face like TX and CA grid problems.
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Old 02-26-2021, 11:25 AM   #13
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I believe it.... Market/Economic/Societal influences including shareholder (mutual funds/hedge funds/etfs) pressure will prevail, i.e. ESG.
Unless the massive spending on a total EV conversation eats too much into profits and revenue and shareholders don't get dividends.
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Old 02-26-2021, 12:16 PM   #14
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Unless the massive spending on a total EV conversation eats too much into profits and revenue and shareholders don't get dividends.
Don't worry the Government will ensure this strategy is followed through, if not GM will be bailed out again.
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Old 02-26-2021, 12:25 PM   #15
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it's all hype till it actually happens , They have obviously been read the green riot act and want to comply with current admin dreams. But why haven't we heard any viable power grid suppliers to supply the electricity needed. Some times pay attention to whats in front of your face like TX and CA grid problems.
You're underestimating the fact that most people just don't care for ICE that much. They don't hate it per se; they just don't want to deal with maintenance and everything else that comes along with it.
So, for those people, the electric car is an extremely attractive proposition.
I see it happen all around me; people want to get into a vehicle, push some button, go to wherever they need to go, and, when they're done, plug the thing in for a recharge. Like a cellphone.
Convenience; that's what is going to kill ICE, not so much the green agenda you're so afraid of.
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Old 02-26-2021, 12:37 PM   #16
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I see it happen all around me; people want to get into a vehicle, push some button, go to wherever they need to go, and, when they're done, plug the thing in for a recharge. Like a cellphone.
You also see how some people freak out when their cell phone battery is low or dead. Some people are too lazy to plug in their phone and act like they will sacrifice their first born for a charger.

This is why there was a massive push for quick charging cell phones.
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Old 02-26-2021, 12:42 PM   #17
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You also see how some people freak out when their cell phone battery is low or dead. Some people are too lazy to plug in their phone and act like they will sacrifice their first born for a charger.

This is why there was a massive push for quick charging cell phones.
I see both sides of the "convenience" argument, but I totally agree with you. People can't keep their phone charged yet we're expecting them to pull out a plug and charge their car, potentially away from home in the snow and rain?

Maybe someday, but definitely not today.
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Old 02-26-2021, 01:09 PM   #18
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I see both sides of the "convenience" argument, but I totally agree with you. People can't keep their phone charged yet we're expecting them to pull out a plug and charge their car, potentially away from home in the snow and rain?

Maybe someday, but definitely not today.
I'm more thinking that they will just forget to plug in their car at night and because they won't use all of their EV range every day, they will just leave it unplugged until that morning when mileage is low. Then the freak out begins. It's going to take a change in people's habits.
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Old 02-26-2021, 01:14 PM   #19
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I think there will be a lot of quick top off's in the ev space. The 5 minute charge to get 50-100 miles vs filling it up like we do with ICE. Then the big charges at night when they actually remember to plug them in.
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Old 02-26-2021, 01:22 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by subyski View Post
I'm more thinking that they will just forget to plug in their car at night and because they won't use all of their EV range every day, they will just leave it unplugged until that morning when mileage is low. Then the freak out begins. It's going to take a change in people's habits.
That makes sense. Of course, that presupposes that everyone's houses have been retrofitted for EV use which is a looooooong way away. I wonder how long it is before we have "automatic charging" in all parking spots similar to how you can sit a modern phone on something and then it does a cordless charge.
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Old 02-26-2021, 01:22 PM   #21
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I think there will be a lot of quick top off's in the ev space. The 5 minute charge to get 50-100 miles vs filling it up like we do with ICE. Then the big charges at night when they actually remember to plug them in.
We are going to need a lot of DC fast chargers available on the corner. The level 2 is good for destination charging ( hotels, stores, office building).
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Old 02-26-2021, 01:29 PM   #22
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We are going to need a lot of DC fast chargers available on the corner. The level 2 is good for destination charging ( hotels, stores, office building).
Well Shell and Circle K have both announced they will have them at every station.
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Old 02-26-2021, 01:35 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by subyski View Post
I'm more thinking that they will just forget to plug in their car at night and because they won't use all of their EV range every day, they will just leave it unplugged until that morning when mileage is low. Then the freak out begins. It's going to take a change in people's habits.
It's like your cell phone. Charge it at night when you sleep. Yes, you could forget once in awhile, but for most people their phone is more valuable than life itself.

After 2.5 years of owning a Tesla Model 3 and Tesla Model Y, respectively, we almost never Supercharge. Only for far trips or if I just want to check out a new charger location.

For daily use: you park, plug in, and then either immediately charge or it is scheduled for before you leave in the AM. With 300+ miles of range you don't have to think about it.

EV is the future. Automatics suck. I will miss manuals
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Old 02-28-2021, 10:38 AM   #24
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Awesome! I canít wait for all the stories of people who canít charge their cars because of a major power outage like the one we had in Texas recently. Until the electric power grid can reliably support the stations needed to charge millions of cars, all-electric is a pipe dream. I donít see grid changes happening in the next 14 years.
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Old 02-28-2021, 11:54 AM   #25
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Well Shell and Circle K have both announced they will have them at every station.
This will be key. But also know Shell and Circle K are not everywhere. More/all brands will need to come aboard. Once we hit millions of EV's, those ports will become full and we are not at 5 minute charging yet. People get pissed off when they have to wait for an open pump. Starbucks and In-n-Out need to install wireless charging in their drive-thrus because people seem to be more willing to wait for those.
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Originally Posted by Snow Drift View Post
It's like your cell phone. Charge it at night when you sleep. Yes, you could forget once in awhile, but for most people their phone is more valuable than life itself.

After 2.5 years of owning a Tesla Model 3 and Tesla Model Y, respectively, we almost never Supercharge. Only for far trips or if I just want to check out a new charger location.

For daily use: you park, plug in, and then either immediately charge or it is scheduled for before you leave in the AM. With 300+ miles of range you don't have to think about it.

EV is the future. Automatics suck. I will miss manuals
Oh I know EV is the future. But there are so many people who still can't keep their phones charged on a regular basis. You would be surprised how many forget to plug in their phones at night. You would think people would have learned by now but it still exists.
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