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01-19-2020, 12:03 PM | #1 |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 507520
Join Date: Oct 2019
Vehicle:2019 WRX |
Not hitting fuel targets with Access Tuner Map
Issues with AFR jumping up at beginning of pull and decreasing too slowly to hit targets. I increased the Primary Open Loop Fueling Ramping Adder from .2 to .5 for all RPMs and it made no difference. AFR is still staying too high below 6k rpm. Appears to be plenty of injector time left, just not sure how to tell the software to hurry the heck up with dumping fuel.
https://datazap.me/u/joerice/log-157...&data=3-5-7-27 Looking for help from others with more Access Tuner experience than my weekend tuner self Joe
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01-19-2020, 12:27 PM | #2 | |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 480524
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Pa
Vehicle:2015 WRX Black |
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01-19-2020, 01:43 PM | #3 |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 446029
Join Date: May 2016
Location: 510
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What's going on here? lol
What are your mods? You're really out of injector...40% is when things get weird. Is this E30, non-flexfuel? |
01-19-2020, 02:13 PM | #4 | |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 485903
Join Date: May 2018
Location: South Dakota
Vehicle:2018 WRX (Retired) White |
Quote:
- What mods to you have? - What intake do you have? - If intake isn't stock, did you calibrate the MAF voltage table? - Have you ever had a self-tune that didn't have huge AFR corrections? - What base tune did you start with? - Do you have a spare engine laying around while you teach yourself how to tune a direct-injected, turbocharged engine? |
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01-19-2020, 06:23 PM | #5 |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 507520
Join Date: Oct 2019
Vehicle:2019 WRX |
No Cats
E30 fuel without kit is why it shows a large correction, I just let the CL handle it, yes I know I will get some negative opinions on that, but that is what the fuel corrections are for Stock Intake Map based on a Cobb Stage 2 HWG, no timing adjustments just boost Agree on the too high AFR, started when I increased boost above stage 2 No spare engines but looking at hard at a short block Surprised 40% is considered high for injectors. Was not expecting that comment. Do most people upgrade the DIT injectors to get of 300whp? Thank you for the replies, I do appreciate the advice, even the snarky replies |
01-19-2020, 06:52 PM | #6 | |
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Member#: 480524
Join Date: Jan 2018
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(if you didn't globally change fuel trims for ethanol read this) https://cobbtuning.atlassian.net/wik...ide+Supplement Fuel multipliers by ethanol content https://cobbtuning.atlassian.net/wik...l+Tuning+Guide Last edited by adam99; 01-19-2020 at 07:09 PM. |
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01-19-2020, 10:48 PM | #7 |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 485903
Join Date: May 2018
Location: South Dakota
Vehicle:2018 WRX (Retired) White |
Well, OP, your tolerance of the snarky replies is appreciated. They (the replies) really could be a lot worse. Please read the links that adam99 supplied. You are misunderstanding the 35-40% comments. The corrections you are seeing are not injector size related, they are pressure related. The correction will go back to "normal" when you set the Global Fueling adjustment correctly. DFI injectors are no where close to being undersized when they operate at the proper pressure for the fuel/flexfuel being used since they operate at such high pressures compared to port injectors. That is what the Global Fueling adjustment is for. Also, I think most E30 tunes are full-time closed loop. Your tune switches to open loop at 3300 rpm. Cobb OTS tunes are NOT full-time closed loop. I think the overly rich Cobb OTS open-loop fueling saved your engine. That is in all seriousness, no snarkiness intended.
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01-20-2020, 03:11 AM | #8 |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 507520
Join Date: Oct 2019
Vehicle:2019 WRX |
Adam99, thanks for the links, very helpful for injector adjustments...which I had not made.
yellowblur, thanks again. I followed the steps for full time closed loop and knocked the boost down a couple of pounds at peak to ask a bit less of the injectors. Will stare at the the afr gauge closely on the way to work tomorrow |
01-20-2020, 09:09 AM | #9 |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 480524
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Pa
Vehicle:2015 WRX Black |
Also please please please remove some fuel. With the fueling adjustments and FTCL you will be hitting target afr. e30 tune targeting in the 9s and you will 100% get injection misfires.\
And if you have any questions at all just pm me, would be happy to help |
01-20-2020, 09:34 AM | #10 |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 507520
Join Date: Oct 2019
Vehicle:2019 WRX |
Thanks adam99, appreciate that offer, I'll keep it in mind if I come across any issues with the CL tune. Would be nice to have someone to converse with as I learn this rather than annoying the whole forum.
I set the AFRs to 10.5 while I was setting up the full time CL last night which I believe is right ratio for turbo engines. The very low target AFRs I had in open loop were due to my misunderstanding of how to force the system to add more fuel to meet my desired 10.5, I didn't actually want 9s. Learning process... I wish Access Tuner / Cobb had a better workflow description. |
01-20-2020, 10:34 AM | #11 |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 446029
Join Date: May 2016
Location: 510
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Direct injection engines do not need to be so rich. Direct injection has a very strong cooling effect. Some factory tuned cars run low 14AFR at WOT then taper down to a richer target dictated by engine load and/or EGT modeling. Of course, I'm not telling to tune a Subaru this way...lol
This a personal preference... What I like to do on 91 octane is target 11.4AFR and have it taper down to 10.8AFR by 5200RPM. With E30 you can run leaner target because of the cooling effect ethanol has. I aim for 11.4AFR. You should still have enough fueling headroom at higher revs. Of course you should tune your ignition timing and boost curve accordingly. Every car is different so do what you have to do to make it safe. I'm no stranger to doing E30 mixes but I highly suggest going flexfuel if you can. The less ghetto way to tune for E30 mix is to re-scale your MAF curve. Last edited by tegxsi; 01-20-2020 at 10:46 AM. |
01-20-2020, 03:57 PM | #12 |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 480524
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Pa
Vehicle:2015 WRX Black |
What he said^ I believe it is a few DI Volkswagens that run stoich under wot and use egts to add in fuel. Ahhhh it must be nice to have such an advanced ecu. But yeah id command a 11.2 as a starting point until boost and timing are where you want.
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01-20-2020, 04:58 PM | #13 | |
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Member#: 446029
Join Date: May 2016
Location: 510
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I know BMWs do the same. I've also seen this in the 2.0L turbo engines in Lexus. |
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01-20-2020, 06:40 PM | #14 |
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Member#: 507520
Join Date: Oct 2019
Vehicle:2019 WRX |
Thanks guys, I'll back the fueling down a bit more. I'll also back the turbo down a bit to lower the temps and try adjusting the ignition timing to make up for it once I get the fuel and boost stable with no knock. Will take a couple of weeks, I only do data runs on weekends in a safe local.
Tegxsi, I haven't bought a flex fuel kit yet because I'm not sure if that is the final solution I want as these engines don't like anything greater than E30. I think I would prefer an AEM Meth system which isn't much more expensive. I can get straight meth locally, but I'm not sure how I would even go about tuning that in closed loop, afr to 8 or 9?....future adventure, perhaps I'll ask the wife for that for my bday. Side note, no pulls, but car drives great on new CL tune, I don't have the annoying OL transition anymore that I used to think was a cam turnover point and afrs respond as expected under throttle. I'll post a pull to this thread when I have it. |
01-20-2020, 07:45 PM | #15 | |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 480524
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Pa
Vehicle:2015 WRX Black |
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01-21-2020, 11:22 AM | #16 |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 507520
Join Date: Oct 2019
Vehicle:2019 WRX |
Adam99, the car is a 2019. I was not aware of the hpfp change, if a new lpfp and ethanol kit is truly all that I need for e50+ then I might be willing to give up the meth dreams.
I know ethanol has better cooling properties than gas, but it seems like spraying meth into the TB to AFRs lower than what is normally run with e85 would provide more cooling and therefore be safer. Seems most of the DIT failures are heat related ring land deaths. |
01-21-2020, 12:36 PM | #17 |
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MWSOC
Location: Cleveland Ohio
Vehicle:2017 Base WRX WRB |
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01-21-2020, 01:52 PM | #18 |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 480524
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Pa
Vehicle:2015 WRX Black |
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01-21-2020, 01:55 PM | #19 | |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 480524
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Pa
Vehicle:2015 WRX Black |
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01-21-2020, 02:16 PM | #20 |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 473534
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Location: Kansas City, MO
Vehicle:15 WRX Prem. w/ HK CWP |
you should also be able to use an innovate 3904 ethanol gauge to tune for E30. It has a 0-5V output for ethanol from 0%-100%. Haven't tried tuning with it, but I do run the gauge on an E30 tune to check my mix. Would just have to tie it in to the AP.
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