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Old 07-25-2013, 01:30 PM   #26
speedracerx9
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This sounds electrical. Find a manual and follow the steps for "unable to start". I would say its a bad ground somewhere critical like the ECU or a relay. Heat notoriuosly makes relays act up when going bad. that would explain some of the trouble after its warmed up.
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Old 07-25-2013, 02:28 PM   #27
fr0st_wrx
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Could try raising the idle rpm and see if that helps, get it to where you can at least get it out if the garage.. other than that boost/vac leak test it.. not sure what your mods are since you didnt list it hinthint
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Old 07-25-2013, 02:38 PM   #28
RP31
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This is basically my mod list:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2157076

Only current difference is I am using ID2000 injectors instead of those POS Five-O 1200s, which also means I'm using top-feed rails instead of side-feed.

Oh and since it is not immediately clear from that link, I am using a UTEC on top of an OS reflash. Reflash basically handled getting the car to run right on 93, then the UTEC is used to switch to various blends of ethanol. Currently running the summer ethanol map, which is E85.

And my idle is already 900 RPM, which isn't a whole lot higher than stock, but it has been raised. I can't remember why I did that, it was so long ago. Maybe the lightened flywheel. I'm really more concerned with solving the problem of why the car won't restart/stay running once it is warm. At this point even if it dies at every stop light but I can restart it like normal, I'll be ecstatic.
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Old 07-25-2013, 03:14 PM   #29
fr0st_wrx
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Tried hitting the starter yet while trying to crank it when warm?
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Old 07-25-2013, 03:18 PM   #30
fr0st_wrx
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Could be the starter going bad and once it warms up it causes the intermitent issue slowing the flywheel or something.
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Old 07-25-2013, 03:20 PM   #31
RP31
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I have not tried that, but I could.

Also note that I almost always have to floor it when cranking if it is warm, or else it will not turn over. Flooring it should shut off/reduce flow to the injectors during cranking... Does this suggest it is flooding?
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Old 07-25-2013, 03:54 PM   #32
fr0st_wrx
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Could be, have you pulled your plugs to check if theyre fouled after the injector switch?
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Old 07-25-2013, 03:59 PM   #33
RP31
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I replaced the plugs after the injector switch, but that was 2 years/20K miles ago. They should still be OK, but I can pull them. I found the "Engine does not start" diagnostic procedure and that is one of the steps anyway.
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Old 07-25-2013, 05:42 PM   #34
fr0st_wrx
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Well if you had your 02 reading 11 afr at idle, it could have fouled the plugs up real quick running that rich. Id check em out, its only 20 mins for some peace of mind. My car ran rich for 20 mins and destroyed my plugs.
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Old 07-25-2013, 05:43 PM   #35
RP31
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The O2 was reading 11 AFR at idle because the O2 sensor needed to be replaced. The O2 sensor that I have 6" post-turbo was reading fine at the time. I was really hoping the front O2 was the problem. Regardless, checking the plugs is easy enough so I will pull them out and inspect.
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Old 07-25-2013, 06:18 PM   #36
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You’re chasing too many things. If it ran fine last month on the tune then none of that should matter. It’s almost impossible for all four injectors to go bad at once. You need to rule out systems one by one. The part of your description that interests me is your comment about the dash lights acting funny when you tried to start it.
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Old 07-25-2013, 06:23 PM   #37
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By the way on those cam and crank sensors. You ruled out the wiring and ECM before replacing the sensors right??
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Old 08-01-2013, 11:12 PM   #38
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Any update???
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Old 08-02-2013, 08:03 AM   #39
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I don't have any updates, been really busy with work and house projects still. Car is near the bottom of the priorities list. I certainly have a lot to check though. I will reply back when I start working on it again.
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Old 09-21-2013, 08:47 PM   #40
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Well, that took a lot of searching..

I am having the same issue. Almost to the 'T'.

Built motor..700 miles .blah blah etc etc

Car will die out when it's hot (I actually overheat a bit) and won't turn back on unless I let it sit(for a long time) or really give it some throttle while cranking.
I had the same experience as you, and it was NOT fun. I stalled at a few red lights and had to launch to keep it from stalling out on me again.

Checked coolant levels and turned my car on after letting it sit over night. It took the normal amount of time to warm up and climbed up to 205-207 fans kick on and drops down to 187ish. Cycles like this for 45 minutes maybe and then the fans stop turning on. Temps go up..then my access port goes nuts and coolant temp fluctuates between 107-150 degrees. I may have a slight air leak on the lower radiator hose - still trouble shooting that.

But I believe that my engine wiring harness is getting a short somewhere when it is exposed to heat for a while.

I will be reading everything out tomorrow.

Please post updates if you have any!
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Old 06-19-2014, 03:44 PM   #41
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Any update?
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Old 03-21-2018, 12:55 PM   #42
RP31
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Bumping this thread since its fifth birthday is coming up and there has been some recent interest.

Long story short, I replaced the short block and the problem is gone! Now I know that won't help a lot of people so here's the longer story...

The car sat for quite a while. When I finally got back to it, I did a compression test and found that two of the cylinders were reading ~90 psi. Pulled the engine and determined that the head gaskets had blown because the sleeves dropped. Not sure how this happened since it had never overheated.

Thing was, the car wasn't noticeably losing coolant and the oil looked fine so this was not expected.

My only theory for this behavior was that at operating temp the pressure from the cooling system was enough to push coolant into the cylinders when cylinder pressure was low (does this happen at lower RPMs/loads?), and when coming to a stop this would mess up the A/F mixture and kill the engine. Could also explain why I had to keep the pedal to the floor while cranking to get it to fire again, and why it was difficult to turn over after dying. Couple cylinders had coolant in them. Honestly I have no idea how realistic my theory is, but the new short block with the same heads, sensors, wiring, and tune, is working fine.
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Old 02-04-2019, 04:00 AM   #43
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Very useful thread for me - having very similar issue with my Forester 04 X

Thanks for updating with the solution

Panos
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Old 02-08-2019, 03:27 PM   #44
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Bringing this thread back to life might be of use to anyone with similar problems. I too worry that I might have a head gasket that has an incomplete seal when the temperature of the block is high. Simple and cheap ways of checking this:

1) Inspect the engine, above and below, for leaks from seals. (free)

2) Oil analysis from blackstone labs (or other) will say if there is mixing of coolant or fuel/fumes into your oil system. ($26)

3) When the engine is warm but off, hold the gas pedal to the floor to initiate Open Flood (cuts off fuel), and crank the engine. It shouldn't start, and it should create a uniform cranking sound. But if theres loss of compression on a cylinder, the cranking sound wont be uniform, as the compression stroke on the blown cylinder will be easier and create a different sound. (free)

3a) Bribe someone with a good scope to see the amperage usage of the starter with the same procedure. It'll require less amps to crank that 1 out of 4 cylinders. (small bribe)

4) Compression test and leak-down test at a mechanics shop. Compare the PSI between the different cylinders. A definitive test. ($100-200)

Am I missing any other good and cheap tests?
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Old 06-11-2019, 04:56 PM   #45
Alex.Ter
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Default I had same issue, how I fixed it

I had the same issue come up couple weeks ago, got the car towed to my house. Had no clue what to try and repair, so I just fully dived into the car and started replacing alot of parts, most of them was for pre maintenance and some that I thought would be the problem, I replaced the cam shaft sensors, crank shaft sensor, fuel pump, fuel filter, fuel Injectors, spark plugs, turbo cartridge, cleaned out my intake manifold, and tumbler valves, fixed an oil leak I was having down there, alot of fresh new gaskets, replaced my turbo inlet tube and my throttle body to intercooler hose and I think that's about it, I put the car back together, it started, I let it warm up killed it, let it sit for a bit, then tried starting it up and it wouldnt even crank, tried charging the battery, charger said the battery was at 100% but car wouldnt crank, went got a new battery and it started up on first crank! So now I'm wondering if that was the whole problem this whole time, so to however is having the same problem, I would try a new battery first before diving head first into repairing stuff that probably didnt have to be replaced in the first place.
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Old 10-20-2019, 02:51 PM   #46
SpaceJam503
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RP31 View Post
This all started yesterday without warning. Started the car around 11:00, began driving, no indications of any problems. Even came to some stops without issue. Then when the engine was warmed up and I was rolling to a stop, I pushed in the clutch, and the RPMs dropped all the way down and the engine died. When I tried to restart, it was extremely difficult. When cranking, it sounds like the engine is spinning very slowly, and the dash lights get dim. Often times I am not able to get it started in a reasonable amount of time, and I have to keep the gas pedal pressed to get it to start. Once I do get it started, I have to immediately start revving the engine or it will die again. I basically have to crank and crank and when it finally fires, launch from a stop. Otherwise it will die. But if I let the car sit for a couple hours and totally cool off, it will start up and drive fine until it's warm.

To me this initially seemed like a battery issue, but I took the battery to Autozone and they say it is fine. However I have read at least one story about batteries testing fine even though they are bad. I have been doing lots of searching and it seems like this could be anything from a dirty MAF or TB, to a vacuum leak, a dying front O2 sensor, fuel pump, or alternator.

There have been no CELs. When the car is running, the battery voltage display on the SM3 reads around 13.6 volts. I would think if this were an alternator issue, it would be reading lower.

It is obviously heat-/coolant temperature-related in some way, but I cannot figure out what sort of mechanical or electrical problem could have just developed that would cause this to happen. The car has been running fine for the past week.

More background: About 2 weeks ago I had another dying engine problem that ended up being bad camshaft position sensors. I replaced both of those sensors as well as the crank position sensor, and also checked for corroded cables, cleaned all corrosion from all contact points and terminals, and added the Davenow grounding mod. After that the car was starting, running, and idling great with no issues. When I was doing that I also cleaned the MAF, so I would not think the MAF is the issue now. I do have a WBO2 mounted post-turbo, and it is reading fine. I have noticed that the front O2 reading on my SM3 will sometimes vary by as much as 2 from the WBO2 reading, but only when the WBO2 is more on the rich or lean side. I honestly cannot recall if this is normal or if it might be initial signs of a failing front O2, but I do know that the front O2 is not really reliable outside of a normal range, so maybe this is normal.

I've had the battery checked, I will get the alternator checked tonight, I have cleaned the throttle body, and I have checked for vacuum leaks. Just looking for any additional input on things to check. I'd really like to resolve this quickly. Having a car that runs, then leaves you stranded, then runs, then leaves you stranded a week later, is going to drive my wife to set fire to my car!

I could list out mods but they are extensive and since nothing has changed in a week (I've even been using the same gas station and the weather has been about the same), I won't bother with them unless someone really thinks they'd be helpful.
I was having the same issues for the past week. Replaced my O2 sensors, contacted my tuner (maybe a tuning issue at idle). Was about to check my PCV (under the TMIC) when I noticed the coupler running from my intercooler had come loose. I hope this saves someone time and money.
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