Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Thursday December 13, 2018
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC General > Car Care & Detailing

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads. 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-23-2018, 12:40 PM   #1
That_Boosted_Life
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 422693
Join Date: Jun 2015
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Buffalo,NY
Vehicle:
2016 WRX Premium
Lapis Blue Pearl

Default Ceramic Coating issues

I applied optimum gloss coat near the end of August. Coating added amazing gloss and water beaded right off. However, near the end of October, the lower half of the doors and sides of the rear bumper stopped beading water. I tried using carpro trix to decontaminate. That helped the lower doors some, but the areas right behind the rear wheel arches (mud flaps) still wouldn't bead. Water just seemed to lie flat on the surface. Unsure if I applied the product properly, I clayed those areas, and wiped the entire car down again with IPA. I then applied another layer of gloss coat to the entire vehicle. It is the middle of winter here in Buffalo, plenty of salty driven days, and when washing the car at a self serve car wash yesterday, I noticed that the entire rear bumper, rear hatch area (minus the top portion), and lower half of doors no longer bead water. After the wash the lower half of the doors seemed to bead a little better again. Roof, hood and front fendors still bead excellently, and front bumper still beads good too. Anyone else have the same issue where the lower doors and bumper stop beading with a ceramic coating?
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
That_Boosted_Life is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Old 01-23-2018, 08:03 PM   #2
Twisty mountain road
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 402977
Join Date: Oct 2014
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Default

couple different factors can come into play. Of course application and making sure the vehicle is clearly prepped prior to application is important but it seems like you tried that already. Not sure what strength IPA you are using but it should be 90%+.

You also mentioned Buffalo so not sure what the weather was when you applied it but Optimum recommends 50ish-90ish degrees. Both humidity and temperature will change the flashing characteristics of the ceramic coat. "Leveling" too early will remove too much, and "leveling" to late with leave you with high spots.

I personally find that my level surfaces (hood, roof, c quarters and upper doors, bead water, where as the lower doors, fenders, and bumper sheet water. This could be what you are experiencing as well. If you want water to bead everywhere, apply a spray wax like Optimum Car Wax or similar product of your choice.

Always a good idea to show some photos of what you are experiencing so it is better to evaluate. Hope this helps
Twisty mountain road is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2018, 10:17 AM   #3
That_Boosted_Life
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 422693
Join Date: Jun 2015
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Buffalo,NY
Vehicle:
2016 WRX Premium
Lapis Blue Pearl

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Twisty mountain road View Post
couple different factors can come into play. Of course application and making sure the vehicle is clearly prepped prior to application is important but it seems like you tried that already. Not sure what strength IPA you are using but it should be 90%+.

You also mentioned Buffalo so not sure what the weather was when you applied it but Optimum recommends 50ish-90ish degrees. Both humidity and temperature will change the flashing characteristics of the ceramic coat. "Leveling" too early will remove too much, and "leveling" to late with leave you with high spots.

Always a good idea to show some photos of what you are experiencing so it is better to evaluate. Hope this helps
I bought the optimum kit from autogeek. Came with 20cc of coating (still have ~10 cc left so will do another coat this spring) and the optimum paint prep which I believe is 15% IPA. Made sure I wiped the car down with a clean MF towel after to remove any residual residue.

Applied when the temps were in the 60's both times so I don't think temperature was an issue. I waited until almost all of the product flashed (disappeared) before wiping away both times as well. I made sure I applied a little heavy on the lower doors and rear bumper the second time in case I didn't get good coverage the first time.

I will try and get pictures and maybe a video this weekend when it will be in the 40's and I can tolerate the cold when in a self serve car wash.
That_Boosted_Life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2018, 01:20 PM   #4
Twisty mountain road
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 402977
Join Date: Oct 2014
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Default

It sounds like your application went correctly. My wifeís car sits outside 24/7. I found gloss coat to stay good for about 8-9 months instead of the listed 1 year. It doesnít bother me because the car is outside the whole time and I wash the cars weekly with megs d156 spray wax as a topper to finish it off.

I southern Cali itís cold right now at like 45-50 in the morning but warms up to 70-80s during the day so our weather is a bit different so itís hard to compare your results with mine.

Optimum has a good service line. I would call them and discuss what you are seeing and your need to reapply their product after 3 months. They should be able to give you good insight as well as maybe offering you optimum spray wax as a sample to see if you are happy with it to get the beading characteristics you are looking for. If I was optimum that is what I would do to retain customers. Meguiars does this very well and if anytime you are not satisfied with their product they make it up to you somehow
Twisty mountain road is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2018, 05:22 PM   #5
CGumina
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 459394
Join Date: Dec 2016
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Rochester, NY
Vehicle:
2015 WRX
Crystal White

Default

How are you maintaining the coating? What are you washing the car with, and what are you drying it with?
CGumina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2018, 06:39 PM   #6
cerbomark
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 475983
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Upstate NY
Vehicle:
2018 WRX Limited
Silver

Default

Same experience with CQuartz. Also upstate NY snowbelt. You describe it just like I saw. Side sheeted water, top surfaces still beaded. After a year on that car I just applied wax over the whole thing. To be clear I noticed it only a few months at most into ceramic application.

Just used a different brand (tech580) ceramic on the WRX. Time will tell.
I dry 95% of car with electric blower, then waffle towel the rest. Works well.
cerbomark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2018, 11:04 PM   #7
Twisty mountain road
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 402977
Join Date: Oct 2014
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CGumina View Post
How are you maintaining the coating? What are you washing the car with, and what are you drying it with?
Weekly wash:
Onr in a rinseless wash method using a modified Gary dean method to wash. Eagle edgeless towels folded into 4s presoaking in onr diluted to 256:1 with di water. Panels are presoaked spraying onr in a 20:1 dilution. Meguiars d156 synthetic spray wax applied as a drying aide at final wipe down with another mf towel. Do 1 panel at a time. Takes 4-7 towels to wash a car depending on if it is an exterior wash or exterior and interior. Glass has its own towels and takes 3 additional towels

Wheels are sprayed (white wheels and brembos are a bad combo) meguiars d143 tire and wheel cleaner (high pH of 11ish) and 5 gal bucket filled with 4 gal water and with 2 oz optimum car wash (tried something different from meguiars hyperwash) using multiple brushes to get to barrels, rim face and in between spokes. Compressed air to dry followed by meguiars d156 spray wax to final wipe dry.

If it has rained:
foam cannon the car with 3 oz optimum car wash and ro water with an electric pressure washer at 1.2 gpm. Soak for how ever long I can based on temp and how long it takes to do the wheels. Dry car with leaf blower and do the same Gary dean method and rinseless wash described above.

(2 bucket method took me about 1 hour to wash the car after I got the hose and buckets and mitts etc. rinseless washing takes me 30 min so I find it to be easier. So Cal had a water restriction about a year ago and the city was giving heavy fines to people washing their cars in the driveway. So I looked into an alternative method which helped my save time too so win win)
Twisty mountain road is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2018, 09:54 AM   #8
blue-sun
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 15934
Join Date: Mar 2002
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Yorkville, IL
Vehicle:
2017 Jetta GLI
Tornado Red

Default

This detailer did a long term test of waxes, sealants and coatings in 2017, here are the results, looks like CQuartz UK (meant to be applied in colder temps) lasted pretty long.


he also just started a new one for 2018 as well

blue-sun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2018, 03:30 PM   #9
cerbomark
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 475983
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Upstate NY
Vehicle:
2018 WRX Limited
Silver

Default

Well I used the Cquartzuk.... Did what the Oper posted on the sides.
I take care of three cars and the waxed one beads just as long on the sides and maybe takes 30 mins to wax (after all washed).
Pretty good vid...
I have used ceramics 2-3 times and still trying to decide if it s worth the effort or may be better to just wax evry other month or so. If it s a clean well cared for car waxing really doesn t take long at all IMO.

Last edited by cerbomark; 01-25-2018 at 03:38 PM.
cerbomark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2018, 05:47 PM   #10
That_Boosted_Life
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 422693
Join Date: Jun 2015
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Buffalo,NY
Vehicle:
2016 WRX Premium
Lapis Blue Pearl

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CGumina View Post
How are you maintaining the coating? What are you washing the car with, and what are you drying it with?
Washing with optimum car wash using a microfiber wash mit. Drying the mostly with a electric leaf blower since the water usually blows right off. Then dry the rest with the rag company waffle weave drying towels
That_Boosted_Life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2018, 05:59 PM   #11
That_Boosted_Life
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 422693
Join Date: Jun 2015
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Buffalo,NY
Vehicle:
2016 WRX Premium
Lapis Blue Pearl

Default

Some more info.... I did have cquk on the car last March. Was the first time I applied the coating and messedbit up. Almost the whole car looked hazy. Waited until early July to start polishing it off. Will say that coating seemed to last longer. Not sure if it's because I applied so thick and let it dry do much before wiping, or if it was a better coating. This was also only 1 coating vs the 2 layers with gloss coat.
That_Boosted_Life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2018, 04:45 PM   #12
whiplash willy
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 424843
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Portland, Or
Vehicle:
2016 WRX Limited 6MT
ISM

Default

I have the same issues with my coated vehicles, where the lower doors and rear bumper lose their beading/sheeting properties after winter time. It is along the areas where road spray hits. My thoughts are that either the constant hit of road spray either eventually abrades the coating, or it just gets contaminated (although a decon doesn't seem to help)

It is a fairly common issue with coatings, however I don't know the cause. I have heard of it happening with most brands of coatings, consumer and pro alike. A good friend of mine applied Gloss Coat to is car 1.5 years ago (first time coater) and he hasn't had the issue. I also know a local Opti-Coat Pro installer who has had Opti-Coat Pro on his daily driver for several users, doing nothing more then washes for maintenance, and has not had this issue.

My last car, 2013 4runner, had Opti-Coat Pro (Old Formula) applied to it when new. After the first year, and after a winter, the sides and rear stopped beading. I tried Optimum APC, Iron-X, and Clay, and nothing revived the beading/sheeting on the sides. I had it for 3 years, and 50k miles, and the coating remained, and reacted normally, and the sides/rear never came back. I never did anything further, because it wasn't worth it at the time.

I applied Optimum Gloss Coat to my 2016 WRX about a year and a half ago. About 9 months after I applied the coating (Also after a winter), I noticed the same thing. The lower sides and rear no longer bead/sheet, but the other surfaces retained their properties. I tried APC, Iron-X, Clay, and several Carpro reset washes, and it didn't have any impact either.

I was never able to get an answer to whether the coating had worn off, or just lost its properties. It is not really possible to tell. Some people thought it was because the car wash soap I was using, had gloss enhancers, and those can leave behind stuff that can interfere with a coatings beading properties. One thing I didn't do on my WRX was polish the entire vehicle before hand. I only polished any bad spots, which there were few because I had ordered it, and had it delivered with the plastic wrap still on, and no dealer washes or details.

I recently applied Gloss Coat to my wife's new RDX, about 4 months ago. So far it has held up great, with the only maintenance being a hand wash every 2 weeks. I also believe it is a newer formula, then what I applied to the WRX. It beads/sheets water much better then my WRX ever did. The only difference in application was that I polished the entire car with Optimum's Finish Polish. It will be interesting to see how it holds up long term.

I will be doing a full detail/coating application on the WRX again at the end of Feb (I took a week off). I am going to try Gloss Coat again, because I belive it is the best Consumer level coating you can get. Most consumer coatings are SiO2 (Silicon Dioxide) based, which will eventually break down in normal environmental conditions. Opti-Coat Pro (New Formula) is 100% SiC (Silicon Carbide) which they claim will not break down unless abrasively removed, and even warranty it. Optimum Gloss Coat is a hybrid SiO2 and SiC formulation, so it should have better durability then the normal SiO2 ceramic coatings. To my knowledge, Gloss Coat is the only Consumer coating on the market, with any SiC in it.

It may be that I didn't polish the sides, and they had some stuff on them, that would have been removed by polish before the coating, and that is why the sides aren't beading, or it could be because I didn't do a good job applying it there, because those would be the most difficult places to apply it.

I am going to do things a little different this time around, and see how it goes.

1. 2 decon washes with Carpro Reset, which is a very good decon wash that leaves nothing behind.
2. Decon with Optimum's FerrX (Optimum's version of Iron-X). I have learned that product synergy is a good thing, especially when prepping for coatings
3. 1 Carpro Reset Wash, to make sure all the FerrX stuff is 100% gone
4. Clay with Medium Grade Clay, and Optimum ONR as Lube
5. Full polish with Optimum Hyper Polish (I have learned that some polishes can leave fillers and other stuff behind that will effect the application of the coating. Hyper Polish is designed to be used before a coating application and leaves nothing behind)
6. Wipe down entire car with ONR, to remove any polishing residues
7. Optimum Paint Prep wipe down to prep surface for the coating
8. 2 coats of Gloss Coat

I will report back with how it goes. I am hoping this time it will stick around better.
whiplash willy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2018, 02:50 PM   #13
That_Boosted_Life
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 422693
Join Date: Jun 2015
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Buffalo,NY
Vehicle:
2016 WRX Premium
Lapis Blue Pearl

Default

Just an update. I was able to restore some beading on the lower doors. I washed the door, rinsed, then washed again. Only the second time I applied some pressure instead of just gliding my hand across the door.

Surface mostly sheets now when washing instead of beading and running off once done spraying with water. Debating about claying with pinnacle fine clay to see if I can restore any more beading
That_Boosted_Life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2018, 03:14 PM   #14
Wrex85S
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 478447
Join Date: Nov 2017
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: CT
Vehicle:
2018 WRX
WR Blue

Default

anyone have good feedback on opticoat pro? I have had mine on for a few months and seems to be doing good - but how does it hold up long-term? I am talking new England weather...
Wrex85S is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2018, 06:16 PM   #15
TriAxis 6
NASIOC Supporter
 
Member#: 377862
Join Date: Jan 2014
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: on stage or recording studio
Vehicle:
2014 STi Hatch
Plasma Blue Pearl

Default

Iíve had Opticoat pro on for 4 blazing Miami summers. It still beads up and looks like it was waxed after only a proper wash and dry.
TriAxis 6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2018, 07:13 PM   #16
cerbomark
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 475983
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Upstate NY
Vehicle:
2018 WRX Limited
Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wrex85S View Post
anyone have good feedback on opticoat pro? I have had mine on for a few months and seems to be doing good - but how does it hold up long-term? I am talking new England weather...
seems like the coating are not holding up to salt areas...
cerbomark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2018, 07:36 PM   #17
TriAxis 6
NASIOC Supporter
 
Member#: 377862
Join Date: Jan 2014
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: on stage or recording studio
Vehicle:
2014 STi Hatch
Plasma Blue Pearl

Default

^ miami is right on the ocean, thereís salt in the humid air. Obviously no salt is thrown on the streets to melt show however
TriAxis 6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2018, 07:42 PM   #18
cerbomark
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 475983
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Upstate NY
Vehicle:
2018 WRX Limited
Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TriAxis 6 View Post
^ miami is right on the ocean, thereís salt in the humid air. Obviously no salt is thrown on the streets to melt show however
Understood, the salt where I am not only coats the panel but has a gritty sand in it too. I don t think air sea salt is as harmful. I mean do your cars turn thick white? They don t, at least that I have seen.
Then again you have stronger sun, but something with the guys whos post in snow climates seem to be the ones seeing the side panels lose the beading factor and that s where the salt would be most concentrated.
cerbomark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2018, 08:01 PM   #19
TriAxis 6
NASIOC Supporter
 
Member#: 377862
Join Date: Jan 2014
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: on stage or recording studio
Vehicle:
2014 STi Hatch
Plasma Blue Pearl

Default Ceramic Coating issues

We have some undercarriage damage from time to time.
TriAxis 6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2018, 04:48 PM   #20
MarcWinkman
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 479018
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Delaware
Vehicle:
2018 STi Limited
Crystal White Pearl

Default

Something that may be worth in investing in is some CarPro Reload spray or Hydrosilex Recharge. Use it after a decontamination wash every couple of months.

https://www.carpro-us.com/protection...ad-500ml-17oz/

https://hydrosilex.com/collections/r...rge-500ml-16oz
MarcWinkman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2018, 08:06 PM   #21
That_Boosted_Life
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 422693
Join Date: Jun 2015
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Buffalo,NY
Vehicle:
2016 WRX Premium
Lapis Blue Pearl

Default

So just did a good washing of my car with some optimum car wash and car pro trix. Almost all the panels sheet water instead of beading. If I mist the panels they will bead some but once the beads get larger in size the beads get almost flat against the paint. Vertical surface on the trunk and entire rear bumper don't even sheet or bead. Rear bumper took almost a minute for almost all the water to run off the panel. Will try hitting that panel with clay tomorrow to see if I can revive at least the sheeting properties. If not, I still have about 10cc of coating left over and might just apply a thick coating over the entire car again as the coating will most likely be no good after this summer.

Surprisingly the front fendors and lower vertical surface of the front bumper beaded even before washing when spraying with the hose. After washing the water behavior was basically the same as a fresh coated vehicle. Washing those parts of the car the surface felt less grabby than the rest of the car as well.

Last edited by That_Boosted_Life; 03-27-2018 at 11:04 AM.
That_Boosted_Life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2018, 01:17 AM   #22
escroder
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 113192
Join Date: Apr 2006
Chapter/Region: PRSIC
Location: Caribbean
Vehicle:
2011 STI
Rally Blue

Default

What about Gyon, did any of you guys try this products, how's the feedback ?
escroder is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:54 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2018 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2017, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.