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Old 07-18-2019, 11:37 AM   #1151
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Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
Launch mode preloads the powertrain so you already have torque before you start moving. The model S and X have launch mode.
Is that not achievable by using two feet and brake boosting, just like you can do in a torque converter auto?
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Old 07-18-2019, 11:56 AM   #1152
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2.1 million with specs inferior than the 200k Tesla Roadster
1900hp and 1250ftlb is inferior to 1000hp and 750ftlb?


https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...ter-torque-hp/
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Old 07-18-2019, 12:05 PM   #1153
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1900hp and 1250ftlb is inferior to 1000hp and 750ftlb?


https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...ter-torque-hp/
Space X package
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Old 07-18-2019, 12:10 PM   #1154
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Maybe? We don't have all the numbers (yet).

If the earning report shows lower gross margins along with the lower prices, then I would agree that it would appear they had to take a cut to profit to get more customers (not really a good thing...).

But if it shows a good GM with the lower prices, it would seem to show that they are producing them cheaper, so they're passing the savings on, and making them available to more buyers on virtue of being cheaper.

:shrug:
exactly. Everything is speculation until the end of quarter. Remember Q2?


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Originally Posted by dwf137 View Post
Is that not achievable by using two feet and brake boosting, just like you can do in a torque converter auto?
is a setting on the Tesla S and X but yeah is the same thing but you cannot just press both the pedals on the model 3 it would do nothing.
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Old 07-24-2019, 05:16 PM   #1155
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There it is:

Tesla Second Quarter 2019 Update
Cash and cash equivalents of $5.0B; Operating cash flow less capex of $614M
GAAP operating loss of $167M, GAAP net loss of $408M, including $117M of restructuring and other charges
Auto gross margin at ~19% in spite of reductions in vehicle ASP and lower regulatory credit revenue
On track to launch Gigafactory Shanghai by end of 2019 and Model Y by fall of 2020.

https://ir.tesla.com/static-files/1e...6-696a7c517959
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Old 07-24-2019, 06:52 PM   #1156
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Old 07-24-2019, 09:03 PM   #1157
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Sounds like the Semi and Roadster will be a no go for 2020. Expected breakeven is Q3 of this year with a return to profitability in Q4 per Elon. Sales volume better than previous quarter at the cost of lower price point units. Reduction in loss quarter over quarter shows demand at lower price point as well.

Q3 will be interesting to see where they fall financially. If they break even, credibility might be slightly restored for investors. After hours trading wasn’t pretty for them though. If demand keeps up for the lower cost trim they very well could turn profitable by increasing output and deliveries.
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Old 07-25-2019, 11:05 AM   #1158
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Was thinking... Something that might be an interesting product for Tesla to offer:

Model 3 Dual Motor with performance package, however half the battery capacity. Would allow them to drop the price (and weight) significantly. If they did that, they'd start entering a much lower price point category, while offering significant performance. Sure, it'll give some people range anxiety, but it's something I'd personally seriously consider, even with the ugly tablet and sedan...

Can it not be done? Is the ego too high to do something like that?
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Old 07-25-2019, 11:34 AM   #1159
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C rate concerns might crop up with a smaller battery and high power draw.
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Old 07-25-2019, 11:40 AM   #1160
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C rate concerns might crop up with a smaller battery and high power draw.
Enter Maxwell Technologies super capacitor tech.
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Old 07-25-2019, 11:41 AM   #1161
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Originally Posted by dwf137 View Post
Was thinking... Something that might be an interesting product for Tesla to offer:

Model 3 Dual Motor with performance package, however half the battery capacity. Would allow them to drop the price (and weight) significantly. If they did that, they'd start entering a much lower price point category, while offering significant performance. Sure, it'll give some people range anxiety, but it's something I'd personally seriously consider, even with the ugly tablet and sedan...

Can it not be done? Is the ego too high to do something like that?
Wonít happen, ego is too high. For Elon, only the best of the best can be offered. Iíve been saying it, he should offer the high end range, mid range (what is currently the bottom range) and a bottom range. The bottom would have maybe 200-250 miles per charge and a 0-60 of 6-6.5 seconds. Basically offer the acceleration performance of a base model Camry. Price it in the low to mid 20ís and the millennials would be over extending themselves in credit to buy one.

We know that higher end car companies absolutely started crushing sales numbers when they offered cheap ass models and younger people flocked to them, along with mommy and daddy buying them for them. Example: 320i, Mercedes c250, etc. Those cars can be had for the price of an Accord and they moved a **** ton of units over the years. Tesla should do the same and broaden its customer base.
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Old 07-25-2019, 02:20 PM   #1162
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Tesla offers a crippled model 3 in Canada with really low range (software limited I'm sure) in order to get tax incentives. https://insideevs.com/news/347484/te...ada-low-range/

The $35k USD standard range car is basically the price of a low end luxury car or high end non luxury sedan; you can still order one, it's just not on the website. It comes with leather etc.

What they really need to do is shift the standard range and standard range plus down by about 5 or 10 grand, so you can get the standard range at $25k ,similar to a base model Accord (even though it's smaller than an Accord). The battery costs too much though.
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Old 07-25-2019, 02:54 PM   #1163
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Tesla offers a crippled model 3 in Canada with really low range (software limited I'm sure) in order to get tax incentives. https://insideevs.com/news/347484/te...ada-low-range/

The $35k USD standard range car is basically the price of a low end luxury car or high end non luxury sedan; you can still order one, it's just not on the website. It comes with leather etc.

What they really need to do is shift the standard range and standard range plus down by about 5 or 10 grand, so you can get the standard range at $25k ,similar to a base model Accord (even though it's smaller than an Accord). The battery costs too much though.
Pretty sure Tesla doesnít offer leather, itís ďvegan leather.Ē Lowering costs may or may not help. If you look at the vehicles sold, it was record numbers for q2. However, total revenue was less than q2 of last year (I think it was q2). The only way lowering the cost even more will help them out is if it made demand skyrocket dramatically, otherwise it will be cash loss.
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Old 07-25-2019, 03:02 PM   #1164
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Tesla won't offer the 25k model for a few more years because they simply have not built enough battery production yet. They know it'll sell like hotcakes but it takes billions more in infrastructure, factories, machinery and good hires to get there.
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Old 07-25-2019, 05:40 PM   #1165
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Tesla won't offer the 25k model for a few more years because they simply have not built enough battery production yet. They know it'll sell like hotcakes but it takes billions more in infrastructure, factories, machinery and good hires to get there.
I guess that makes sense... if they lower battery capacity and thus price, it'll start to sell at a rate that they can't keep up with.

real automotive manufacturers need to get moving on this. like 4 years ago.
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Old 07-25-2019, 06:35 PM   #1166
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Before anything re: new products or even fixing the old ones, they need to re-structure. Kicking the can burns more cash, brand equity, overall enterprise value, and time (literal as well as future investor windows for profitability). They are at least 1 year beyond the point an ethical and rational board/CEO would've done something.

The public is too stupid and the regulators too lazy/corrupt to realize and/or act, but the only reason for the continued bet on more and more low probability scenarios panning out in unison - is Etron's ego. Better in every way to rip off the band aids and disinfect rather than to die of gangrene. There are too many hard working people at risk for his whims and pipe dreams.
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Old 07-25-2019, 07:52 PM   #1167
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Tesla won’t restructure until it’s absolutely forced too. Restructure would almost certainly remove Elon. His ego won’t allow for that.
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Old 07-25-2019, 08:51 PM   #1168
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Tesla wonít restructure until itís absolutely forced too. Restructure would almost certainly remove Elon. His ego wonít allow for that.
Exactly.
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Old 07-25-2019, 09:17 PM   #1169
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Exactly.
If / when they restructure and if Elon is allowed to stayed on, Iíll be passed as ****. I will say that a restructure right now with the cash on hand would be extremely beneficial to Tesla. Wipe out the existing debt minus building lease payments and suddenly youíve freed up an insane amount of cash flow which could really propel the company forward.

The stock would tank, investors would sue (and lose), and Elonís worth would diminish to **** (still be a millionaire if not a single digit billionaire).

Tesla still has $5b in cash, assuming it were to trend at a $400M loss each quarter, it would last another 5 quarters ($2B cash left before needing a cash raise). It still has the ability to tap the equity markets for more cash, which it realistically should have raised more cash than they did the last time. Another cash raise, assuming they would need to, would likely give them another 2 years from date of cash raise if they continue at same cash burn rate.

If they can continue to cut costs and ramp up demand without dropping margin below current levels, they very well could turn profitable this year. Iíd expect them to go negative closer to model Y launch but Elon also expects that. The model Y could dramatically create more profit and cash flow.

One thing I do wonder about is since the semi doesnít seem to be happening this year or next, is if companies cancel their orders and ask for that cash back. That could be a fairly large hit.
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Old 07-25-2019, 09:30 PM   #1170
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If / when they restructure and if Elon is allowed to stayed on, Iíll be passed as ****. I will say that a restructure right now with the cash on hand would be extremely beneficial to Tesla. Wipe out the existing debt minus building lease payments and suddenly youíve freed up an insane amount of cash flow which could really propel the company forward.

The stock would tank, investors would sue (and lose), and Elonís worth would diminish to **** (still be a millionaire if not a single digit billionaire).

Tesla still has $5b in cash, assuming it were to trend at a $400M loss each quarter, it would last another 5 quarters ($2B cash left before needing a cash raise). It still has the ability to tap the equity markets for more cash, which it realistically should have raised more cash than they did the last time. Another cash raise, assuming they would need to, would likely give them another 2 years from date of cash raise if they continue at same cash burn rate.

If they can continue to cut costs and ramp up demand without dropping margin below current levels, they very well could turn profitable this year. Iíd expect them to go negative closer to model Y launch but Elon also expects that. The model Y could dramatically create more profit and cash flow.

One thing I do wonder about is since the semi doesnít seem to be happening this year or next, is if companies cancel their orders and ask for that cash back. That could be a fairly large hit.
Lots of things in there you're taking at face value that are unfortunately lies. Ex. - I'd love to see the 5B cash broken out/explained, along with many other lines of the statements, A/R, Capex, A/P just to name a few that stink to high heaven - we'll get some more color with the 10Q, but like the restructure, all the really nasty stuff will stay hidden until there is no other choice.
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Old 07-25-2019, 11:31 PM   #1171
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Lots of things in there you're taking at face value that are unfortunately lies. Ex. - I'd love to see the 5B cash broken out/explained, along with many other lines of the statements, A/R, Capex, A/P just to name a few that stink to high heaven - we'll get some more color with the 10Q, but like the restructure, all the really nasty stuff will stay hidden until there is no other choice.
I specifically left out the break down of $5b cash reserve so that others could join in on the conversation and moderately understand, lol. But you and I are on the same page. There are a lot of things unaccounted for. Like listing building leases as assets instead of liabilities.
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Old 07-26-2019, 10:02 AM   #1172
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For better or worse, Tesla is Elon Musk and Elon Musk is Tesla. If he stops running it, it dies, or gets absorbed by another company. The only reason why they can raise capital is because of his reality distortion field. Investors would pull the plug.

I say this as someone who bought a $50k Model 3 dual motor.
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Old 07-26-2019, 10:08 AM   #1173
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On a happier note, I got my 2019.24.4 software update. Autosteer is noticeably improved. Before when approaching sharper curves it would be a little late to start turning, and end up on the outside of the turn. The nose would start to cross the line and the wheels would touch the edge of it.

Now it seems to center a lot better in turns. I haven't put it on twisty back roads yet though.
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Old 07-26-2019, 10:21 AM   #1174
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Old 07-26-2019, 10:40 AM   #1175
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For better or worse, Tesla is Elon Musk and Elon Musk is Tesla. If he stops running it, it dies, or gets absorbed by another company. The only reason why they can raise capital is because of his reality distortion field. Investors would pull the plug.

I say this as someone who bought a $50k Model 3 dual motor.
Thatís where youíre wrong. If Elon left, the stock would take a dip and thatís it. It would recover. Elon is not the designer, engineer, etc. Heís the figure head of the company.

Just so youíre aware and others, the stock value has nothing to do with the sustainability of the company. When you buy 1 share at say $220, youíre not giving Tesla $220. Tesla is a car company, and they need to sell cars. If there cars canít pay the bills and generate positive cash, they will eventually die.

People said Apple was dead with Steve Jobs died. Tim Cook instead turned it into the most valuable company in the world, or was the most valuable. People thinking Elon is the god almighty for Tesla need to get a grip on reality.
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