Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Friday January 27, 2023
Home Forums Images WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC General > News & Rumors > Non-Subaru News & Rumors

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.







* As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases. 
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads. 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-15-2022, 03:28 PM   #976
Sid03SVT
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 183032
Join Date: Jun 2008
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: CT
Vehicle:
RWD Camry
Pull me over red

Default

I wonder how much more power it would take to get the GR to power oversteer on dry pavement... I'm guessing quite a bit; that or a torque vectoring rear diff.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Sid03SVT is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Old 09-15-2022, 04:03 PM   #977
samagon
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 26859
Join Date: Oct 2002
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: undisputed COMBAT! champion
Vehicle:
of TXIC
I also like (oYo)!!!!

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sid03SVT View Post
I wonder how much more power it would take to get the GR to power oversteer on dry pavement... I'm guessing quite a bit; that or a torque vectoring rear diff.
probably cheaper to toss some crappier tires on there.
samagon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 04:30 PM   #978
Pre
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 139693
Join Date: Feb 2007
Vehicle:
Dura ngo 95
horrorshow

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sid03SVT View Post
I wonder how much more power it would take to get the GR to power oversteer on dry pavement... I'm guessing quite a bit; that or a torque vectoring rear diff.
Sways and suspension setup will do it with more power. I think once the PR cars release for days of independent testing, ham fisting with a jerk of the wheel in the corners will do it too. They obviously made this GRY, to stick, grip, and get the lap times. And obviously like Booby, safety.

Itís what it is. We got two choices in this space. R and GRC. We need to be thankful we have a solid Japanese model. It could be zero in the segment altogether.
Pre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 05:09 PM   #979
Sid03SVT
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 183032
Join Date: Jun 2008
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: CT
Vehicle:
RWD Camry
Pull me over red

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pre View Post
Sways and suspension setup will do it with more power. I think once the PR cars release for days of independent testing, ham fisting with a jerk of the wheel in the corners will do it too. They obviously made this GRY, to stick, grip, and get the lap times. And obviously like Booby, safety.

It's what it is. We got two choices in this space. R and GRC. We need to be thankful we have a solid Japanese model. It could be zero in the segment altogether.
The good/bad news is that I was never going to get a first year car; I'm too picky, most dealers charging ADM, etc. etc.

That means at least a year of people tuning it and modifying it before I could get my hands on one, we know the GRY can make really good power on pump gas without kerploding, so I'd assume the GRC can as well.

Golf R is out, unless VW revises/removes the haptic controls; I'm certain the EA888 has a higher power ceiling than the G16E-GTS does, it has 25% more engine after all, an extra cylinder goes a long way, just ask an Audi enthusiast.

might just supercharge the IS for the time being....
Sid03SVT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 07:26 PM   #980
Pre
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 139693
Join Date: Feb 2007
Vehicle:
Dura ngo 95
horrorshow

Default

I'm getting it out the way. It's a timing thing for me and I'm hitting a milestone birthday in my life where it's time to get it done as I have much bigger plans, relocation, a jet boat. Sold the RS in 2019 so it's been 3 years already. They pull a Supra 2nd model year change or 2009 WRX, then F it, I'm gonna be modding anyway.

The limits of the EA888 and the G16 are real similar. On the GRC the drivetrain and clutch will take the power right up to 500 whp where the head starts to lift which requires aftermarket HG and studs only. The R clutch will give out at 400 whp.

I wouldn't concern yourself with this particular car being a first model year. The drivetrain and engine are not new and in fact are well developed. Both were developed and built for WRC duty. + it's a Toyota.

My gut is production just won't be that long. Governments, so many things pushing ICE away. I'd rather side on caution on getting something. Imagine if they start pushing EV's even harder/sooner. It's musical chairs. I'd rather snag something, anything, compared to waiting and fighting everyone for the lasts.
Pre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 07:41 PM   #981
Pre
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 139693
Join Date: Feb 2007
Vehicle:
Dura ngo 95
horrorshow

Default

DP. Fix your ****ing software already
Pre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2022, 09:31 PM   #982
VarmintCong
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 379605
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Peabody, MA
Vehicle:
2017 Civic Sport
2012 Outback 2.5

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sid03SVT View Post
I wonder how much more power it would take to get the GR to power oversteer on dry pavement... I'm guessing quite a bit; that or a torque vectoring rear diff.
Put all season tires on it. It's a Toyota thing.
VarmintCong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 09:01 AM   #983
Sid03SVT
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 183032
Join Date: Jun 2008
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: CT
Vehicle:
RWD Camry
Pull me over red

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pre View Post
I'm getting it out the way. It's a timing thing for me and I'm hitting a milestone birthday in my life where it's time to get it done as I have much bigger plans, relocation, a jet boat. Sold the RS in 2019 so it's been 3 years already. They pull a Supra 2nd model year change or 2009 WRX, then F it, I'm gonna be modding anyway.

The limits of the EA888 and the G16 are real similar. On the GRC the drivetrain and clutch will take the power right up to 500 whp where the head starts to lift which requires aftermarket HG and studs only. The R clutch will give out at 400 whp.

I wouldn't concern yourself with this particular car being a first model year. The drivetrain and engine are not new and in fact are well developed. Both were developed and built for WRC duty. + it's a Toyota.

My gut is production just won't be that long. Governments, so many things pushing ICE away. I'd rather side on caution on getting something. Imagine if they start pushing EV's even harder/sooner. It's musical chairs. I'd rather snag something, anything, compared to waiting and fighting everyone for the lasts.
I have zero fears about buying a first year GRC, it's more an availability issue; I want a CE in red; there will only be ~1,500 CEs built in 2023, so maybe ~500 (or 375, can't recall if it's 3 or four color options for the CE) will be in the color I want, and I won't pay ADM; some of those are going to Canada too, so it shrinks the available pool of cars even further; it's the 6mt CTS-V wagon all over again.

As far as power goes between the two, ~400hp and the Golf R needs a clutch, but is still on the stock turbo, where the G16 runs out of turbo around ~320hp. In the end though it doesn't really matter, as ~500hp in either car will require similar upgrades. Toyota has built a stout 3 cylinder, I am just impressed by it.

One thing the Golf R can't do is lose ~220lbs, which is a huge advantage for the GRC in my book.

Quote:
Originally Posted by VarmintCong View Post
Put all season tires on it. It's a Toyota thing.
You're the second person to suggest that in this thread, I don't understand why anyone would intentionally make their car handle worse; crappy tires won't fix the FWD handling characteristics, that's going to require suspension work, at the very least a big bar in the rear & more camber up front (depending on what factory specs are, -2.0 is usually my limit on a macpherson strut setup on a street car).

Unless of course it was a reference to the FRS/86 coming with Prius tires.
Sid03SVT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 10:57 AM   #984
VarmintCong
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 379605
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Peabody, MA
Vehicle:
2017 Civic Sport
2012 Outback 2.5

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sid03SVT View Post
I have zero fears about buying a first year GRC, it's more an availability issue; I want a CE in red; there will only be ~1,500 CEs built in 2023, so maybe ~500 (or 375, can't recall if it's 3 or four color options for the CE) will be in the color I want, and I won't pay ADM; some of those are going to Canada too, so it shrinks the available pool of cars even further; it's the 6mt CTS-V wagon all over again.

As far as power goes between the two, ~400hp and the Golf R needs a clutch, but is still on the stock turbo, where the G16 runs out of turbo around ~320hp. In the end though it doesn't really matter, as ~500hp in either car will require similar upgrades. Toyota has built a stout 3 cylinder, I am just impressed by it.

One thing the Golf R can't do is lose ~220lbs, which is a huge advantage for the GRC in my book.



You're the second person to suggest that in this thread, I don't understand why anyone would intentionally make their car handle worse; crappy tires won't fix the FWD handling characteristics, that's going to require suspension work, at the very least a big bar in the rear & more camber up front (depending on what factory specs are, -2.0 is usually my limit on a macpherson strut setup on a street car).

Unless of course it was a reference to the FRS/86 coming with Prius tires.
Yeah, it was the latter lol.
VarmintCong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 12:29 PM   #985
samagon
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 26859
Join Date: Oct 2002
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: undisputed COMBAT! champion
Vehicle:
of TXIC
I also like (oYo)!!!!

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sid03SVT View Post
You're the second person to suggest that in this thread, I don't understand why anyone would intentionally make their car handle worse; crappy tires won't fix the FWD handling characteristics, that's going to require suspension work, at the very least a big bar in the rear & more camber up front (depending on what factory specs are, -2.0 is usually my limit on a macpherson strut setup on a street car).

Unless of course it was a reference to the FRS/86 coming with Prius tires.
tongue in cheek is how I meant it. which I presume anyone who looks at a car that is designed to go fast and says "I want to go full Jeremy Clarkson around this race track" they are either joking, or well, I have no idea what else. I don't have any possible way to understand their perspectives.

the best way, I would think though, to go full Clarkson, would be to set the clutchpack to fully engaged (which once you crack the software, I'm sure there's a way to do it) and remove the front driveshafts. boom, you now have a RWD car, and should be able to do a power oversteer, no problemo.
samagon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 12:58 PM   #986
heavyD
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 194216
Join Date: Nov 2008
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Vehicle:
2022 Fast POS

Default

As a person that had money down on one of these for a long time I'm now thinking the Civic Type R is going to be a better buy. It looks better inside and out and will perform better as well.
heavyD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 01:04 PM   #987
Calamity Jesus
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 44501
Join Date: Oct 2003
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Yeah, well, you know
Vehicle:
that 's, like, your
alternate facts, man.

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pre View Post
DP. Fix your ****ing software already
The bottom of each page of NASIOC says: Powered by vBulletinģ Version 3.7.0

3.7.0 went out April 29, 2008.

vBulletin is on 5.6.7 (stable release March 15, 2022)


Double posts are just padding his AdSense numbers at this point. Nick doesn't care about NASIOC. He logs in about once a month, but his last post was April 30, 2020.
Calamity Jesus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 01:10 PM   #988
carsebuco
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 482289
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: DE
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by heavyD View Post
As a person that had money down on one of these for a long time I'm now thinking the Civic Type R is going to be a better buy. It looks better inside and out and will perform better as well.
> MFW FWD

carsebuco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 01:25 PM   #989
Calamity Jesus
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 44501
Join Date: Oct 2003
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Yeah, well, you know
Vehicle:
that 's, like, your
alternate facts, man.

Default

^ This is what your brain looks like on Subaru.

The WRX gets its ass handed to it by a whole fleet of FWD cars now.. yet you still think FWD-based AWD makes cars handle better.
Calamity Jesus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 02:21 PM   #990
godfather2112
Papi Chulo
Moderator
 
Member#: 53794
Join Date: Jan 2004
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Boner kill city
Vehicle:
... 2017 BMW M2
2017 F-150

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sid03SVT View Post
I have zero fears about buying a first year GRC, it's more an availability issue; I want a CE in red; there will only be ~1,500 CEs built in 2023, so maybe ~500 (or 375, can't recall if it's 3 or four color options for the CE) will be in the color I want, and I won't pay ADM; some of those are going to Canada too, so it shrinks the available pool of cars even further; it's the 6mt CTS-V wagon all over again.

As far as power goes between the two, ~400hp and the Golf R needs a clutch, but is still on the stock turbo, where the G16 runs out of turbo around ~320hp. In the end though it doesn't really matter, as ~500hp in either car will require similar upgrades. Toyota has built a stout 3 cylinder, I am just impressed by it.

One thing the Golf R can't do is lose ~220lbs, which is a huge advantage for the GRC in my book.



You're the second person to suggest that in this thread, I don't understand why anyone would intentionally make their car handle worse; crappy tires won't fix the FWD handling characteristics, that's going to require suspension work, at the very least a big bar in the rear & more camber up front (depending on what factory specs are, -2.0 is usually my limit on a macpherson strut setup on a street car).

Unless of course it was a reference to the FRS/86 coming with Prius tires.


Use that link with the spreadsheet I listed that shows dealers charging MSRP and email them. While Iím sure there is a list of customers waiting, you never know who or how many back out with rates continuing to rise and economic uncertainty.
godfather2112 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 02:25 PM   #991
godfather2112
Papi Chulo
Moderator
 
Member#: 53794
Join Date: Jan 2004
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Boner kill city
Vehicle:
... 2017 BMW M2
2017 F-150

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by carsebuco View Post
> MFW FWD

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calamity Jesus View Post
^ This is what your brain looks like on Subaru.

The WRX gets its ass handed to it by a whole fleet of FWD cars now.. yet you still think FWD-based AWD makes cars handle better.
^^^ This. The civic type R is one hell of a car. Iíd rather a GRC over type R but I wouldnít be surprised if the Type R outperforms the GRC on a track. But I personally donít buy vehicles based on track performance but street enjoyment.

Different strokes for different folks
godfather2112 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 02:28 PM   #992
SubaDuba420
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 102793
Join Date: Dec 2005
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Vehicle:
2016 WRX
Ugly Sedan

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calamity Jesus View Post
.. yet you still think FWD-based AWD makes cars handle better.
Hey, look man, just cause it don't monsoon where you live.....




SubaDuba420 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 02:30 PM   #993
ProZach626
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 186084
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: St. Louis Metro East
Vehicle:
2018 STI
SWP

Default

I can't get over the side profile and rear end. I keep trying to make myself like it, as the search for next year's new car continues. It's like the top of the hatch should have been extended another 8-12" instead of angling off and trying to turn the car into a triangle. It makes the side profile look weird, and the car looks like it has 'bitch hips.' The core needs to have a wing option to help complete the side profile a little, but that doesn't look like it's going to happen.

The WRX is ugly as hell, and GR Corolla looks like a hopped up chick car. I'm trying to figure out which one the Ford F-150 owners will laugh at more.
ProZach626 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 02:46 PM   #994
carsebuco
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 482289
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: DE
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ProZach626 View Post
I can't get over the side profile and rear end. I keep trying to make myself like it, as the search for next year's new car continues. It's like the top of the hatch should have been extended another 8-12" instead of angling off and trying to turn the car into a triangle. It makes the side profile look weird, and the car looks like it has 'bitch hips.' The core needs to have a wing option to help complete the side profile a little, but that doesn't look like it's going to happen.

The WRX is ugly as hell, and GR Corolla looks like a hopped up chick car. I'm trying to figure out which one the Ford F-150 owners will laugh at more.
You could have just said that. The moment you let a wife beater's opinion of your car bother you, it's the moment you've lost.
carsebuco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 04:07 PM   #995
godfather2112
Papi Chulo
Moderator
 
Member#: 53794
Join Date: Jan 2004
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Boner kill city
Vehicle:
... 2017 BMW M2
2017 F-150

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ProZach626 View Post
I can't get over the side profile and rear end. I keep trying to make myself like it, as the search for next year's new car continues. It's like the top of the hatch should have been extended another 8-12" instead of angling off and trying to turn the car into a triangle. It makes the side profile look weird, and the car looks like it has 'bitch hips.' The core needs to have a wing option to help complete the side profile a little, but that doesn't look like it's going to happen.

The WRX is ugly as hell, and GR Corolla looks like a hopped up chick car. I'm trying to figure out which one the Ford F-150 owners will laugh at more.
As an f150 owner, we laugh at the WRX. The new GRC we like a good amount.
godfather2112 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 05:09 PM   #996
FaastLegacy
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 11671
Join Date: Oct 2001
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SubaDuba420 View Post
Hey, look man, just cause it don't monsoon where you live.....




This is News and Rumors, bro. We only race during cat 5 hurricanes and blizzards.
FaastLegacy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 05:33 PM   #997
ProZach626
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 186084
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: St. Louis Metro East
Vehicle:
2018 STI
SWP

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by carsebuco View Post
You could have just said that. The moment you let a wife beater's opinion of your car bother you, it's the moment you've lost.
OK, I was using that as a reference, but you took it literally. Cool. It was representative of an average American, but I guess anyone who drives a truck beats their wife.

How about wondering how many people in your subdivision will laugh more? My guess is they're both about even.

Do I personally care about what other people think? Sure. To a reasonable extent. As a 37 year old family man, I do. That doesn't mean I care 'enough' to discourage me from driving my wingless STI. Friends and co-workers still crack jokes, but F them. But, anyone who says they truly don't care about what other people think in some aspect of their lives is kidding their selves. Everyone is either consciously, or deeply subconsciously desirable of giving some kind of impression of who they are relevant to their norms, and has a desire to be accepted to a certain extent.

I'm certainly not showing up to a business meeting, or at the courthouse with something that either looks like a modified chick's car, or with a wing a teenager bolted on. I don't like to feel like a kid. Even if I DID like the looks of the GR, I'd still think twice about how I would feel driving in a funeral procession with one. Or, dropping it off at the front with a valet during a nice event. Regardless, I don't like the way it looks. No matter how fast it is, I still want to be able to enjoy looking at it.

Last edited by ProZach626; 09-16-2022 at 05:39 PM.
ProZach626 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 06:00 PM   #998
Straight6
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 419593
Join Date: Apr 2015
Default

Imagine being a grown ass adult and caring about what other people drive or better yet laughing at someone because of what they drive .
Straight6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 06:28 PM   #999
Snow Drift
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 75071
Join Date: Nov 2004
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Long Island
Vehicle:
AR Giulia,Tesla MY
Old: 05 08 11 WRX, 18 STI

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ProZach626 View Post
OK, I was using that as a reference, but you took it literally. Cool. It was representative of an average American, but I guess anyone who drives a truck beats their wife.

How about wondering how many people in your subdivision will laugh more? My guess is they're both about even.

Do I personally care about what other people think? Sure. To a reasonable extent. As a 37 year old family man, I do. That doesn't mean I care 'enough' to discourage me from driving my wingless STI. Friends and co-workers still crack jokes, but F them. But, anyone who says they truly don't care about what other people think in some aspect of their lives is kidding their selves. Everyone is either consciously, or deeply subconsciously desirable of giving some kind of impression of who they are relevant to their norms, and has a desire to be accepted to a certain extent.

I'm certainly not showing up to a business meeting, or at the courthouse with something that either looks like a modified chick's car, or with a wing a teenager bolted on. I don't like to feel like a kid. Even if I DID like the looks of the GR, I'd still think twice about how I would feel driving in a funeral procession with one. Or, dropping it off at the front with a valet during a nice event. Regardless, I don't like the way it looks. No matter how fast it is, I still want to be able to enjoy looking at it.
I'm 38 and have had this exact same internal conflict, funeral procession, etc. I don't mind if people make fun of the WRX because that means they aren't real car people. Anyone who is into cars respects the WRX. ...I'll add another joykill; when I would see other WRXs driving around, but the kid behind the wheel was definitely not someone who I would want to be associated.

I liked my 2018 STI, but if I got another one () I would get the low profile wing for the long term. The wing was cool at the time, and I think it looks better with it, but at this stage of life, I'd go slightly less flash (but still red!)

If you won't mind an automatic (I miss manual everyday) check out the Giulia. It is the grown-up WRX (low volume, 2.0T, AWD, handles way better).
Snow Drift is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2022, 07:52 PM   #1000
Pre
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 139693
Join Date: Feb 2007
Vehicle:
Dura ngo 95
horrorshow

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SubaDuba420 View Post
Hey, look man, just cause it don't monsoon where you live.....
His is some derp for you bud. Malaysian Rally Driver. Wet mountain road. FWD would be left for dead.

Pre is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:25 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2023 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2019, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.

As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.