Next Gen STI Canceled

[fredzy]

Originally Posted by 4S-TURBO

NAILED IT

NAILING ALL THE THINGS

IGNORE THOSE NOT IGNORING ALL THE THINGS BEING NAILED

Guys stop quoting him, it's bypassing peoples' ignore feature! (I think)

I see he did indeed have a meltdown haha

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[ProZach626]

Originally Posted by NighthawkSTI

LOL....gas pumps use more kilowatts per hour than the average EV home charger....which uses the kilowatts per hour equivelant on average to a Home hot water heater lol. If all the gas pumps in the country were swapped out wit EV chargers tomorrow, they would be using less electricity than the gas pumps.

NIO is a solid buy now..you should be averaging down your cost basis right NOW. The NEO park factory is 90% complete..its a MASSIVE ev complex that will have the capacity to produce a million ev's per year. And its already paid for, they have no debt and are sitting on 7 billion in liquid cash. NIO is going to be in 25 countries over the next 3-4years INCLUDING the U.S. They are already using thousands of battery swap stations in China and just expanded that to Norway. Battery swap allows for charge free driving, battery is swapped for a fully charged in 3 minutes. Also allows their cars to be sold without the battery, which makes entry price less than a tesla, and subscription for 150 a month Gets you the battery swap. They will be bigger than tesla...and apple???? Pffffft...NIO IS, the next apple.

Interesting. I'll admit I didn't know about the gas pumps. I still hold strong on my other probabilities of the future of automobile travel.

NIO probably is an even better buy now, but God Damn that was a nasty hit. I took the risk of placing about 15% of our (non 401) portfolio in NIO. I'm still holding it. It will come back eventually, like everything right now. The projections were for it to be over $100/share by the end of 2023............... eek. NIO does have some stiff competition, though.

[heavyD]

Who was that poster that proclaimed he knew a Subaru engineer that said Subaru was having issues getting big power out of the FA24? That guy should be our new insider as his buddy was telling the truth. Would likely have been difficult to make the EJ257 compliant for the 2023 EPA changes.

[NighthawkSTI]

Originally Posted by ProZach626

Interesting. I'll admit I didn't know about the gas pumps. I still hold strong on my other probabilities of the future of automobile travel.

NIO probably is an even better buy now, but God Damn that was a nasty hit. I took the risk of placing about 15% of our (non 401) portfolio in NIO. I'm still holding it. It will come back eventually, like everything right now. The projections were for it to be over $100/share by the end of 2023............... eek. NIO does have some stiff competition, though.

you didnt buy in at the all time high, so you are actually sitting pretty, take the opportunity to average down now, and you'll be glad you did when the next bullrun starts. When NEO Park is fully operational the competition will have a very hard time catching up. All the ice companies jumping in are never going to catch NIO, they are all still making ice cars and will be taking non a ***** liad of debt for several years to integrate to EV's. NIO has no debt and the NEO park factory is going to be rolling out EV's in just a few months to the largest EV market on earth and 2 countries in Europe.

[Kostamojen]

Originally Posted by dcsti

My next daily driver car will be electric...

...but they are heavy.

Everything is heavy now though. M240i is as heavy as a Chevy SS now. STI's (VA's) and WRX's are 3500lbs. The C8 Vette is like 3600lbs+.

Keep an all Electric sedan or coupe around 4000lbs and its fine.

[NighthawkSTI]

Originally Posted by fredzy

Guys stop quoting him, it's bypassing peoples' ignore feature! (I think)

I see he did indeed have a meltdown haha

.


I was R I G H T!!!!!!! This is glorious.

All hail the EJ257!!! It will now live immortal!!!!...

[NighthawkSTI]

Originally Posted by murrdogg24

wow just wow freaking derphawk was right

.

[JustyWRC]

Originally Posted by rallly 4

https://chng.it/z4tSnML5pv

Yeah. That's the way to do it.

Originally Posted by dcsti

....Unfortunately, Subaru had already spent money on certifying STI as a manufacturer, which looks like another horribly bad decision in retrospect....

That actually opened them up for much more opportunity. Question will be if they do something with it or not.

Originally Posted by dcsti

Don't get me wrong, I'm not crapping on EVs. I drove a friend's Model 3 Performance and another has a Mach-E. My next daily driver car will be electric...

...but they are heavy. You can strap on some gumball tires and hide the mass for a few laps, but it's still there. Even the Tesla roadster was 700+ pounds heavier than an Elise. I recall comparison tests of the Roadster and the Elise and the "heaviness" of the Roadster was always mentioned. Unless people are willing to live with 150 mile ranges, normal sized EVs will always tip the scales at 1000+ pounds heavier than the equivalent combustion vehicle. Not saying they aren't fun, but they are a different experience.

Why is it hard for people to understand that things improve over time? Using past examples to say future products will suck because of it.

Originally Posted by 4S-TURBO

I think you are missing what the announcement said. There will be no WRX STI this generation. 7 years! You think the WRX will stick around after that 7 years and an STI will be made from that? 2030 people. Not 2025. It's over.




Look for STI essence in all Subaru vehicles. Namaste.

It did not say that.



Just remember Subaru and their word play.



Not saying there will/won't be; but, to me, that looked VERY carefully worded.

[Snow Drift]

I can't recall every Nighthawk post but wasn't the main theory that they would make the next STI a performance-hybrid? That's not what is happening at all.

They have now shelved the STI for yearssss until a new EV platform exists (It doesn't currently, the STI-ERA is an E-GT spec race car).

I mean, every car in the future will be an EV lol.

[Snow Drift]

Originally Posted by JustyWRC

Yeah. That's the way to do it.





That actually opened them up for much more opportunity. Question will be if they do something with it or not.





Why is it hard for people to understand that things improve over time? Using past examples to say future products will suck because of it.







It did not say that.



Just remember Subaru and their word play.



Not saying there will/won't be; but, to me, that looked VERY carefully worded.

It says there won’t be an ICE version based on the SGP WRX. So that means the STI will not return until a Subaru-Skateboard EV platform exists (which it currently does not).

So, either:
1) We get a STI Corolla
2) We are sitting here for a decade waiting
3) Subaru hopes that gov’ts will abandon their current trajectory and they can make a dirty STI again.

[mcarb002]

The new WRX gets like F150 figures, how more embarrassing can it get with an STI version? They could’ve easily gone 315 hp slapped the brembos and the same ole dccd and been like yo this is the last ice Sti gen and it would be selling like hot cakes for the next 7 years. Even some of the haters here might’ve been like, well **** I better get my piece before it’s too late. But instead it just came on a corporate letter on a Friday afternoon out of nowhere leaving us like wtf. Where’s the love? Lol

[Snow Drift]

Originally Posted by mcarb002

The new WRX gets like F150 figures, how more embarrassing can it get with an STI version? They could've easily gone 315 hp slapped the brembos and the same ole dccd and been like yo this is the last ice Sti gen and it would be selling like hot cakes for the next 7 years. Even some of the haters here might've been like, well **** I better get my piece before it's too late. But instead it just came on a corporate letter on a Friday afternoon out of nowhere leaving us like wtf. Where's the love? Lol

I literally ordered another car with a 24 month lease on purpose so I could then get a new STI to keep forever. Now I'm eff'd.

[dcsti]

Originally Posted by JustyWRC

That actually opened them up for much more opportunity. Question will be if they do something with it or not.

Well, unless we are getting some hand built Ascent STIs or perhaps a BRZ STI, certifying a boutique manufacturer and then not shipping anything for many years does seem like a misallocation of resources.

Originally Posted by JustyWRC

Why is it hard for people to understand that things improve over time? Using past examples to say future products will suck because of it.

Why is it so hard for people to understand physics and chemistry? It is nowhere near as efficient to store energy by raising the energy levels of electrons as it is in chemical bonds. The only way to get similar amounts of energy out of a battery as a gallon of gasoline, not surprisingly, is to set the battery on fire (study YouTube for countless examples).

EVs are going to be much heavier than an equivalent ICE vehicle for the foreseeable future and no amount of PowerPoint marketing is going to fix this. Even a Leaf with a 75 mile range was 800 pounds heavier than a Versa. Adding range only makes this worse.

Don't hold your breath waiting for batteries to get much lighter anytime soon, either. Right now, cost is king, and the focus will be on getting the cost down. There's no economic incentive to develop a superlightweight car battery right now, as EVs already get stellar MPGe.

[n2oiroc]

Originally Posted by Snow Drift

I can't recall every Nighthawk post but wasn't the main theory that they would make the next STI a performance-hybrid? That's not what is happening at all.

They have now shelved the STI for yearssss until a new EV platform exists (It doesn't currently, the STI-ERA is an E-GT spec race car).

I mean, every car in the future will be an EV lol.

exactly. he was not correct any way you want to try and bend the truth. he made all kinds of idiotic claims like dct, mild hybrid, 400+ hp ej, etc.

[4S-TURBO]

Originally Posted by JustyWRC

It did not say that.



Just remember Subaru and their word play.



Not saying there will/won't be; but, to me, that looked VERY carefully worded.

In the meantime, a next generation internal combustion engine WRX STI will not be produced based upon the new WRX platform.

What word play? What careful wording?

-A next generation internal combustion engine? NO

-A next generation WRX STI will not be produced with an internal combustion engine on the new WRX platform. YES

They just suck at writing.

[MikeG4936]

Originally Posted by mcarb002

There has been rumor of Ascent Hybrid coming up. Maybe they have been developing that and into a new STI. Maybe it’s all going according to plan as an Outback, Legacy, and Ascent are to be revealed Spring/Summer with the STI in the fall……or, indeed this is further proof that they completely scrapped a car they were developing but completely botched or just couldn’t get it to work properly. I dunno. Guess we’ll find out.

My vote is that the STI was planned for release in 2023, but it just got scrapped. Subaru saw the writing on the wall. They simply couldn't swing it in this horrible reality of a world we now live in. Gas prices, bull**** EPA regs, and the ongoing war in Eastern Europe were the final nail in the coffin for STI.

If you read the press release, they spelled out the reasons for canceling the STI very clearly: GHG, ZEV, and CAFE.

Sadly, the STI and Subaru internal combustion performance engines are simply not fit for the world we now live in.

[Brad Pittiful]

so is this nighthawk guy a douche or is he just having fun

[Straight6]

Originally Posted by mcarb002

So you're telling me you ain't feeling the "Love", and on top of that nighthawk has been vindicated. Man it's not looking good for Subaru lol

Yeah not feeling the love here. I still think premium trim WRX with 6M is a great deal, just wish they added DCC to 6 speed cars since STI is no more.

[Straight6]

Originally Posted by Brad Pittiful

so is this nighthawk guy a douche or is he just having fun

It's complicated.

[heavyD]

Originally Posted by Snow Drift

I can't recall every Nighthawk post but wasn't the main theory that they would make the next STI a performance-hybrid? That's not what is happening at all.

They have now shelved the STI for yearssss until a new EV platform exists (It doesn't currently, the STI-ERA is an E-GT spec race car).

I mean, every car in the future will be an EV lol.

Correct. Subaru is sitting out an entire generation likely because the EJ257 would not meet 2023 emissions and it was cost prohibitive to build a variant of the FA24 to be used for only one generation. He's right but only accidentally because of an entire generation being skipped.

[shake-rattle-n-roll]

Still holding out for a turbo H6 sti, give audi s6 numbers, start selling it for 50-60k = profit?

[MikeG4936]

Originally Posted by heavyD

Correct. Subaru is sitting out an entire generation likely because the EJ257 would not meet 2023 emissions and it was cost prohibitive to build a variant of the FA24 to be used for only one generation. He's right but only accidentally because of an entire generation being skipped.

****. At this point, I'd buy a 2023 SGP STI with an EJ. What can I say, I'm a depressed fanboy.

[Raxy]

The very careful wording of the press release leaves open the possibility of an STI version of the Corolla GR. Subaru Justy STI here we go ...

[JustyWRC]

Originally Posted by Snow Drift

It says there won't be an ICE version based on the SGP WRX. So that means the STI will not return until a Subaru-Skateboard EV platform exists (which it currently does not).

So, either:
1) We get a STI Corolla
2) We are sitting here for a decade waiting
3) Subaru hopes that gov'ts will abandon their current trajectory and they can make a dirty STI again.

Subaru has helped develop an EV platform.

Originally Posted by dcsti

Well, unless we are getting some hand built Ascent STIs or perhaps a BRZ STI, certifying a boutique manufacturer and then not shipping anything for many years does seem like a misallocation of resources.




Why is it so hard for people to understand physics and chemistry? It is nowhere near as efficient to store energy by raising the energy levels of electrons as it is in chemical bonds. The only way to get similar amounts of energy out of a battery as a gallon of gasoline, not surprisingly, is to set the battery on fire (study YouTube for countless examples).

EVs are going to be much heavier than an equivalent ICE vehicle for the foreseeable future and no amount of PowerPoint marketing is going to fix this. Even a Leaf with a 75 mile range was 800 pounds heavier than a Versa. Adding range only makes this worse.

Don't hold your breath waiting for batteries to get much lighter anytime soon, either. Right now, cost is king, and the focus will be on getting the cost down. There's no economic incentive to develop a superlightweight car battery right now, as EVs already get stellar MPGe.

There have been Forester STis and cars "Tuned by STi"s. Maybe they work to give us something similar?

And would you say a modern Tesla is much improved over an EV-1?

Originally Posted by 4S-TURBO

What word play? What careful wording?

-A next generation internal combustion engine? NO

-A next generation WRX STI will not be produced with an internal combustion engine on the new WRX platform. YES

They just suck at writing.

[chanomatik]

I think it's more likely that we just suck at knowing.

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