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Old 01-12-2020, 06:55 PM   #101
VarmintCong
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kayen View Post
Toyota's global press release states 25,000 in 12 months. Go to the bottom to asterik item #1
https://global.toyota/en/newsroom/toyota/30976389.html
Well it just points out the rule we already know, it doesn't confirm if the regular Yaris counts as a base model for this GR.
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Old 01-12-2020, 07:22 PM   #102
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From the different new stories I have read it sounds like this Yaris GR is different enough from the standard Yaris that they have to make 25,000 in 12 months for WRC Homologation. The Yaris GR has a lower roofline of 91mm (3.58")from the standard Yaris model. That is a huge structural change and I would think that is reason enough by itself that would force Toyota for Homologation for this specific model.

But I am reaching out to my brother who works for Toyota and has contacts with Gazoo Racing in the North America division for clarification.
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Old 01-12-2020, 07:27 PM   #103
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Whether this GR-4 will sale or not, i give Toyota much respect for building this type of car with the world full of SUV and "sports" cars with automatic and CVT.
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Old 01-12-2020, 10:06 PM   #104
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They deserve that credit considering it's a performance car built in house / their in house tuner and didn't rely on another manufacturer for its existence.
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Old 01-13-2020, 06:16 AM   #105
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This car has no center diff ( at least with all the pics in internet) that is just a ****y rear axle coupling from Jtekt, is as lame as any haldex system/ alebeitbwith less torque transfer capability) same part as in a nissan xtrail dacia duster... fake 4wd
https://car.watch.impress.co.jp/docs...0/1228802.html

press conference :
''The ingenious system uses slightly different gear ratios for the front and rear axles and allows for a theoretical range of front/rear torque balance from 100:0 (full front-wheel drive) to 0:100 (full rear-wheel drive). This flexibility gives a performance advantage over AWD on-demand systems that use twin-coupling or permanent AWD systems with a centre differential. The GR FOUR system is also considerably lighter in weight'',

translation:
we are a incompetent company and we just made another haldex type electric coupling which has less torque transfer capability than a hydraulic haldex and we need different axle speds to achieve some overspin at rear axle= you won't be able to lock both axles on tarmac( is just fwd with some added rear), and will overheat worse than the focus rs mk3 gkn diff. save your money and buy a wrx

Last edited by claudiumxg; 01-13-2020 at 08:27 AM. Reason: Link added
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Old 01-13-2020, 11:22 AM   #106
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I'm guessing that there's enough people in Japan that would scoop up 25,000 versions of this thing. They love their smaller tuner cars, and this thing is bound to be a hoot.

If this came to the US, I might be tempted to scoop one up. Park it in the garage and sell it on BaT in 15 years for a profit.
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Old 01-13-2020, 12:44 PM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claudiumxg View Post
This car has no center diff ( at least with all the pics in internet) that is just a ****y rear axle coupling from Jtekt, is as lame as any haldex system/ alebeitbwith less torque transfer capability) same part as in a nissan xtrail dacia duster... fake 4wd
https://car.watch.impress.co.jp/docs...0/1228802.html

press conference :
''The ingenious system uses slightly different gear ratios for the front and rear axles and allows for a theoretical range of front/rear torque balance from 100:0 (full front-wheel drive) to 0:100 (full rear-wheel drive). This flexibility gives a performance advantage over AWD on-demand systems that use twin-coupling or permanent AWD systems with a centre differential. The GR FOUR system is also considerably lighter in weight'',

translation:
we are a incompetent company and we just made another haldex type electric coupling which has less torque transfer capability than a hydraulic haldex and we need different axle speds to achieve some overspin at rear axle= you won't be able to lock both axles on tarmac( is just fwd with some added rear), and will overheat worse than the focus rs mk3 gkn diff. save your money and buy a wrx

The GR 4 weighs 500 lbs less than the WRX. Less load less stress less heat etc. A completely different driving experience, something like a v6 JDM WRX but in an even smaller body. Sign me up.

Quote:
As well as being powerful, it’s lightweight – again, Gazoo claims the world’s lightest 1.6. The drivetrain it’s attached to is light too. The GR Yaris uses permanent four-wheel drive, but instead of using a heavy centre diff arrangement, it features a clutch pack diff at each end, capable of delivering up to 100 per cent of the engine’s torque to either axle.

In practice, it won’t actually do this, as Toyota splits the drive among three settings – Normal, aimed at road driving with a 60:40 front-rear split, Sport, which shifts drive to 30:70 for a rear-biased feel, and Track, which is a pure 50:50 split aimed at, Toyota says, ‘circuit and dirt’. A circuit pack, with limited-slip diffs at both ends, will be optionally available. Oh, and there’s no ‘drift mode’, because as chief engineer Naohiko Saito explains, if you really wanted to do that, ‘front-engined, rear drive is better’.
-----
Quote:
There will be the option of limited-slip Torsen differentials to move drive between left and right. That will be offered as part of a track pack, also featuring different tyres, tweaked suspension and different wheels. A privateer’s rally version is also being investigated, with factory-installed rollcage.
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Old 01-13-2020, 01:17 PM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claudiumxg View Post
save your money and buy a wrx


No
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Old 01-13-2020, 01:39 PM   #109
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Like...the WRX with it's "torque vectoring" open diff, brake based system?


Or the STI that's had a fully electric center diff since 2018?
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Old 01-13-2020, 01:48 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claudiumxg View Post
This car has no center diff ( at least with all the pics in internet) that is just a ****y rear axle coupling from Jtekt, is as lame as any haldex system/ alebeitbwith less torque transfer capability) same part as in a nissan xtrail dacia duster... fake 4wd
https://car.watch.impress.co.jp/docs...0/1228802.html

press conference :
''The ingenious system uses slightly different gear ratios for the front and rear axles and allows for a theoretical range of front/rear torque balance from 100:0 (full front-wheel drive) to 0:100 (full rear-wheel drive). This flexibility gives a performance advantage over AWD on-demand systems that use twin-coupling or permanent AWD systems with a centre differential. The GR FOUR system is also considerably lighter in weight'',

translation:
we are a incompetent company and we just made another haldex type electric coupling which has less torque transfer capability than a hydraulic haldex and we need different axle speds to achieve some overspin at rear axle= you won't be able to lock both axles on tarmac( is just fwd with some added rear), and will overheat worse than the focus rs mk3 gkn diff. save your money and buy a wrx
You have to be careful assuming the way they've always done things is the best way. Maybe they've designed a good system without traditional center diff, engineers upset the common wisdom all the time.

I doubt they'd go balls out making a $45k homologation model and then cheap out on a center diff to save money.
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Old 01-13-2020, 02:05 PM   #111
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Originally Posted by kayen View Post
From the different new stories I have read it sounds like this Yaris GR is different enough from the standard Yaris that they have to make 25,000 in 12 months for WRC Homologation. The Yaris GR has a lower roofline of 91mm (3.58")from the standard Yaris model. That is a huge structural change and I would think that is reason enough by itself that would force Toyota for Homologation for this specific model.

But I am reaching out to my brother who works for Toyota and has contacts with Gazoo Racing in the North America division for clarification.
If it comes to NA, tell him to suggest a straight from Toyota purchase to bypass the greedy dealers.....

I can already see all the YT's paying $20k over
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Old 01-13-2020, 05:05 PM   #112
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Seeing mixed reports on this coming to the NA market. I'd guess somewhere in the CTR range for price as that's likely what they'd be targeting.

It is pretty much what a lot of people want though. 2 door, reasonably light compared to current competitors, AWD with what appears to be a reasonable setup on paper, good power but not a ton, small, not ugly, simple, etc.

Color me impressed either way even if it doesn't come here.
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Old 01-13-2020, 06:44 PM   #113
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Well at least they have left hand drive models, so that's something


The GR content starts at 4:15 if you want to save a bit of time
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Old 01-15-2020, 05:31 PM   #114
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Came across a petition to bring it to NA. Dunno if this is already somewhere in these 3 pages, doesn’t matter. Worth a second post. Haha.

https://www.change.org/p/toyota-canada-hey-toyota-import-the-257hp-awd-gr-yaris-to-canada-and-usa

Edit: I can’t internet. Have to copy paste.
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Old 01-15-2020, 08:09 PM   #115
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I signed it. It seemed to be getting a signature a second.

I would definitely buy it. Just not the first year when demand would be high. But I'm game.
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Old 01-15-2020, 09:51 PM   #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pre View Post
I signed it. It seemed to be getting a signature a second.

I would definitely buy it. Just not the first year when demand would be high. But I’m game.
I like the Type R too, but here's why I think I'd rather buy the GR-4:

- AWD would make it more fun fooling around in snow, rain etc. Looked like a blast in one of the videos of people drifting.
- I'm assuming it's more of a raw car, like the old Type R rather than the new one. As a second or third car, i want something raw and hardcore to drive - I don't care about Nurburgring times or how it handles at 120 mph.
- it's more stealthy, more of a sleeper than the Type R.
- if it is truly a raw driver's car, it'll keep it's value better than Type R. Fast, refined cars are easier to find.
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Old 01-16-2020, 11:14 AM   #117
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I'm 35 and grew up lusting over the JDM Type Rs of the 90s but this new Civic Type R does absolutely nothing to me. Sure, I'm way older, but I also own an Evo 5, so I'm only older in years.

Neither is a particularly good looking car but looks are subjective anyways. I would also prefer an AWD model. For a 2nd/weekend car, I don't care if it doesn't have 4 doors. It's a homologation car, and by definition, way cooler already.

None of this matters if it never makes it NA anyways, but still, I would be all over the GR4.

Maybe you just want what you can't have. I don't care about the new Type R or the new Supra. I'd rather have a 90s version of both. Heck, I'd rather have an R33 GTR over an R35 as well. I guess I'm (90s) analog. Not carburetor analog, but pre-digital everything.
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Old 01-16-2020, 12:32 PM   #118
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This is why people still lust after the STI 22B. 90's just ruled. Everything now is watered down.
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Old 01-16-2020, 01:07 PM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by delongedoug View Post
I'm 35 and grew up lusting over the JDM Type Rs of the 90s but this new Civic Type R does absolutely nothing to me. Sure, I'm way older, but I also own an Evo 5, so I'm only older in years.

Neither is a particularly good looking car but looks are subjective anyways. I would also prefer an AWD model. For a 2nd/weekend car, I don't care if it doesn't have 4 doors. It's a homologation car, and by definition, way cooler already.

None of this matters if it never makes it NA anyways, but still, I would be all over the GR4.

Maybe you just want what you can't have. I don't care about the new Type R or the new Supra. I'd rather have a 90s version of both. Heck, I'd rather have an R33 GTR over an R35 as well. I guess I'm (90s) analog. Not carburetor analog, but pre-digital everything.
I'm ten years older than you but pretty much the same. If I could get a R34 for a decent price my house walls would look like Jackson Pollock paintings. I want AWD, and power. I'd prefer a 3 door hatch too. But I'll take whatever I can get. The STi is getting awfully bloated, and I f'in hate the rim/tire size they have gone to, so that's additional $ I have to spend right off the bat. Then you know Booby and their crap tunes, even if you don't change a single bolt on, it's gonna have to get flashed. I do miss the simpler times also. The over-complication of everything now....ugh, and I hate g damn f'in ADAS with gusto. I don't have it on my vehicles and don't want it.
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Old 01-16-2020, 02:10 PM   #120
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I signed the petition. I would love to see this vehicle sold here.
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Old 01-16-2020, 02:30 PM   #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chanomatik View Post
This is why people still lust after the STI 22B. 90's just ruled. Everything now is watered down.
That's also a very limited edition. I'd take a regular old GC8 STI over a 2020 STI without hestitation. But I work from home and don't have a commute, so practicality isn't really in my equation. Any car is a weekend car when you work from home.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pre View Post
I'm ten years older than you but pretty much the same. If I could get a R34 for a decent price my house walls would look like Jackson Pollock paintings. I want AWD, and power. I'd prefer a 3 door hatch too. But I'll take whatever I can get. The STi is getting awfully bloated, and I f'in hate the rim/tire size they have gone to, so that's additional $ I have to spend right off the bat. Then you know Booby and their crap tunes, even if you don't change a single bolt on, it's gonna have to get flashed. I do miss the simpler times also. The over-complication of everything now....ugh, and I hate g damn f'in ADAS with gusto. I don't have it on my vehicles and don't want it.
That's why I mentioned carburetors before. Older folks (yes, older than you ) said the same thing about cars getting over-cimplicated with fuel injection, needing a computer to diagnose codes and so on in the 80s and 90s. Now we're saying the same about the features and design of today's cars. And today's kids will be saying it in another 20 years, how raw and analog the 2020 STI was. It's all relative.

Today's cars are faster than ever, more reliable than ever and more fuel efficient than ever at the cost of more weight, more nannies/modes/settings/features and more safety.

A small 2dr hatch with AWD and a manual transmission and a performance-focused turbo engine in the year 2020 is one of the last of its kind.
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Old 01-16-2020, 02:36 PM   #122
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Seeing mixed reports on this coming to the NA market. I'd guess somewhere in the CTR range for price as that's likely what they'd be targeting.

It is pretty much what a lot of people want though. 2 door, reasonably light compared to current competitors, AWD with what appears to be a reasonable setup on paper, good power but not a ton, small, not ugly, simple, etc.

Color me impressed either way even if it doesn't come here.
I haven't even driven a CTR because I can't get past the looks...if they made a toned down wingless version, which would be doable since a lot of the big fugly fake vents are fake, I'd probably go for it.

But if the GR-4 is priced in range of the CTR they're in trouble. It's a much smaller vehicle and consumers will see it as such.
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Old 01-16-2020, 03:09 PM   #123
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Originally Posted by delongedoug View Post
I'm 35 and grew up lusting over the JDM Type Rs of the 90s but this new Civic Type R does absolutely nothing to me. Sure, I'm way older, but I also own an Evo 5, so I'm only older in years.

Neither is a particularly good looking car but looks are subjective anyways. I would also prefer an AWD model. For a 2nd/weekend car, I don't care if it doesn't have 4 doors. It's a homologation car, and by definition, way cooler already.

None of this matters if it never makes it NA anyways, but still, I would be all over the GR4.

Maybe you just want what you can't have. I don't care about the new Type R or the new Supra. I'd rather have a 90s version of both. Heck, I'd rather have an R33 GTR over an R35 as well. I guess I'm (90s) analog. Not carburetor analog, but pre-digital everything.
I think you and I are in the same boat. I do think the civic type r looks kinda cool but only because it’s so boy racer extreme and different. I still lust over a FD Rx7 R1 in red or Montego blue. I feel the same way about my BMW’s. While I do really enjoy my M2, there is just something that can’t be duplicated by the E46 M3 driving experience. When I look at new fun cars to buy, there really isn’t anything under $60k that tickles my fancy. After that it goes Cayman GTS / Gt4, Aston Martin Vantage and turbo 911. All of which I’m not dropping cash on so there’s that.

This GR4, if it came to the states and depending on price point could be a legit consideration for a fun car purchase.
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Old 01-16-2020, 03:28 PM   #124
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Quote:
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I signed it. It seemed to be getting a signature a second.
Nice. I signed it a few days ago and it was only at 600—something, good to see it gaining momentum.
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Old 01-16-2020, 03:58 PM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by delongedoug View Post
I'm 35 and grew up lusting over the JDM Type Rs of the 90s but this new Civic Type R does absolutely nothing to me. Sure, I'm way older, but I also own an Evo 5, so I'm only older in years.

Neither is a particularly good looking car but looks are subjective anyways. I would also prefer an AWD model. For a 2nd/weekend car, I don't care if it doesn't have 4 doors. It's a homologation car, and by definition, way cooler already.

None of this matters if it never makes it NA anyways, but still, I would be all over the GR4.

Maybe you just want what you can't have. I don't care about the new Type R or the new Supra. I'd rather have a 90s version of both. Heck, I'd rather have an R33 GTR over an R35 as well. I guess I'm (90s) analog. Not carburetor analog, but pre-digital everything.
The older cars you're talking about felt very raw and mechanical - today the carmakers seem obsessed with refinement and going fast while feeling slow - those aren't priorities for me. It killed BMWs as driver's cars.
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