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Old 02-20-2017, 03:07 PM   #1
gsrcrxsi
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Stg 2+ 310/370, 6sp R180

Default 100,000 miles on a forged piston built motor (EJ255)

This thread is intended for informational purposes only, and to spur any interesting discussion topics that may follow. People say you can't go 100k on a forged piston motor. This is my story.

Background:
This engine block began it's life in my 2010 WRX. it was run with stock internals and in stock configuration until about 80,000 miles. oil changes at the dealer with 5w30 every 3500ish miles, IAG 30/60k services. at 80k, I went Cobb stage 2 (Cobb DP, Cobb AP stg2 OTS). ran this way until about 103,000miles when it developed a head gasket seal failure, combustion gasses entering coolant jacket and so on.

Sept/Oct 2013: Took it to IAG for teardown and rebuild. I decided to add some fueling upgrades, a full-race header, Cobb SF intake, and a full stage 1+ built block (building off of my existing block) with Manley forged pistons, and bored to 99.75mm sized to the pistons for a tight PTW clearance. reused my existing rods and crank, and replaced the bearings with ACL Race, upgraded head studs to ARP2000.

I performed the IAG recommended break-in procedure on their provided basemap (Jorge was their tuner at the time). IAG performed an initial oil change at 50 miles and gave the car back to me. I was to change the oil at 500, 1500, and 3000 miles with Royal Purple Break-In Oil (which is what they recommended at the time). I did this and drove it easily as per the instructions and returned for tuning after 3000miles. Tuning went fine and it made good numbers for a glorified stage 2 setup. about 310/370 whp/trq.

Spring 2015: ~40-45k miles, I contacted IAG to make some tuning adjustments to my map . IAG could not contact Jorge to unlock my map, so they did a full re-tune with their new tuner, Cleo. tuning went fine, and it again made similar numbers, but a bit more "area under the curve". on my way i went.

Nov 2016: ~94k, IAG installed a 6speed for me, and Cleo made some minor adjustments to the tune to account for that.

Dec 2016: ~100k miles, Signs of headgasket failure again may have gone unnoticed for a short wile so i can't say exactly when it started. pushing coolant, bubbles in reservoir, coolant smells like gas/exhaust, etc. Back to IAG for tear down. Decided to replace the shortblock with a new IAG Stage 2 shortblock. New case halves, new crank, Manley pistons again, BC rods, refreshed the heads, etc.

Maintenance/Oil Changes:
I monitored and took datalogs fairly regularly and never saw any signs of knock or detonation in the logs. oil pressure was always good, i also monitored oil temp, EGT and boost pressure all via Defi guages. i also meticulously tracked my oil changes and frequently sampled the oil and sent to blackstone for analysis. the last sample was taken at about 73,000mi and that and all samples before it never showed anything too alarming. i initially saw higher than normal aluminum traces, which went back to normal after switching to Rotella T6. From what BS indicated, ~5000mi changes with T6 was safe (and economical!). 30/60/90k services performed at and by IAG.

oil change history:


blackstone UOA summaries (i created the plots):
data found here: https://drive.google.com/drive/folde...G8?usp=sharing





tear down pics in the following few posts...


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Old 02-20-2017, 03:08 PM   #2
gsrcrxsi
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Pics of bores and internals:

Crank:


Piston tops (top right, CCW -> 1-2-4-3):


Piston #1:



Piston #2:



Piston #3:



Piston #4:


Last edited by gsrcrxsi; 02-20-2017 at 03:21 PM.
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Old 02-20-2017, 03:08 PM   #3
gsrcrxsi
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Rod #1 Bearings: (ignore vertical lines, reflection of radiator in background)



Rod #2 Bearings:



Rod #3 Bearings:



Rod #4 Bearings:


Last edited by gsrcrxsi; 02-20-2017 at 03:28 PM.
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Old 02-20-2017, 03:09 PM   #4
gsrcrxsi
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Bore #1:


Bore #2:


Bore #3:


Bore #4:

Last edited by gsrcrxsi; 02-20-2017 at 03:31 PM.
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Old 02-20-2017, 03:40 PM   #5
gsrcrxsi
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While determining my options, IAG said the block was acceptable for rebuild with a hone to clean up the bores and keep it 99.75mm, or bore to 100mm, and a light polish to the crank. but i opted for the new block because i didnt want to bore it out to 100mm and i didnt want the loose PTW of keeping the bores at 99.75mm (IAG estimated that it would come out to .040-.045", which is ok, but loose).

Discuss. Please read the full background as it may give a better picture of the running conditions.

What do you find interesting?
What might be done differently in the future? (if anything)

To me the wear on pistons 2 and 4, and the upper rod bearing on rod 3 are interesting. as is the wear marks on the side of bore #4 (you cant feel any scoring or marks on the bores though, they feel very smooth)
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Old 02-20-2017, 04:11 PM   #6
user1029
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You need new pistons, Man___/Man_e_/Man_ey
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Old 02-20-2017, 04:32 PM   #7
gsrcrxsi
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Default 100,000 miles on a forged piston built motor (EJ255)

Already done. New block got new pistons. Manley again.

But I guess I should have clarified. IAG said the pistons needed to be replaced, they would have rebuilt with new ones had I went that route.
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Old 02-20-2017, 06:40 PM   #8
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So it lasted 100,000 miles at 310/370.

What sort of driving did it see for those miles?
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Old 02-20-2017, 06:49 PM   #9
gsrcrxsi
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"Normal"?

It's my daily driver.
Drive ~90mi each work day round trip.
Lots of highway pulls for fun.
Spirited back roads drives.
Nothing you'd consider "abuse"
No track time
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Old 02-20-2017, 06:51 PM   #10
theleveler2600
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Huh... My previous built block lasted well over 100k miles. Didn't know that was nearly impossible
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Old 02-20-2017, 06:53 PM   #11
gsrcrxsi
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I would have kept going as well if it wasn't for the head gasket popping.

Then I fell into the "while we're in there" hole...
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Old 02-20-2017, 07:02 PM   #12
station2station
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Their Stage 1 set that I saw online does not specify ARP2000. Was this an optional addition?

Do you know if these were torqued to OEM or to ARP spec?

Do you know if mainline honing was done for the ARP headstuds?
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Old 02-20-2017, 07:17 PM   #13
gsrcrxsi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by station2station View Post
Their Stage 1 set that I saw online does not specify ARP2000. Was this an optional addition?

Do you know if these were torqued to OEM or to ARP spec?

Do you know if mainline honing was done for the ARP headstuds?

ARPs were an add-on
I've never heard of main line honing for ARP head studs. (Not the case bolts)

IAG did the full assembly. I trust they know what they are doing
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Old 02-20-2017, 07:40 PM   #14
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Great post and pictures. Thats a lot of miles. In for the comments!
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Old 02-20-2017, 07:57 PM   #15
Need BB
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Great informative post. What PTW clearance was used in the original rebuild?
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Old 02-20-2017, 08:06 PM   #16
gsrcrxsi
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Default 100,000 miles on a forged piston built motor (EJ255)

It was .0025" IIRC
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Old 02-21-2017, 03:49 PM   #17
Strider327
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Just out curiosity OP, which head gaskets did you end up using before it failed? Also which head gaskets did you choose for the stage 2 block?

Thanks
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Old 02-21-2017, 05:21 PM   #18
gsrcrxsi
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All on OEM gaskets.
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Old 02-23-2017, 02:01 AM   #19
Squirtledasuby
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Default Great thread

I'm thinking of getting Manley pistons now instead cps.

So ARP studs have different torque specs than oem?
Thaks
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Old 02-23-2017, 08:32 AM   #20
gsrcrxsi
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Yes ARPs have their own trq spec.
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Old 02-23-2017, 09:25 AM   #21
Squirtledasuby
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Default Shortblock

Was your rebuilt engine from IAG loud? As a lot of piston slap?

How is your existing one also?
Thank you
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Old 02-23-2017, 10:41 AM   #22
Delphi
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Aside from the wear on the skirts was there anything else wrong with this pistons? I'd throw em in on a sloppy mechanics style build.
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Old 02-23-2017, 11:10 AM   #23
gsrcrxsi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirtledasuby View Post
Was your rebuilt engine from IAG loud? As a lot of piston slap?



How is your existing one also?

Thank you


The engine here was built by IAG, yes. Back in fall 2013. Was rebuilt using my existing block as the core.

It didn't have any noticeable piston slap for a long time. Only towards the end of the engine life did I notice any slap, and only then really when it was cold.

The new motor is just fine. Still in the early miles (about 1000miles on it so far). I hear some slap when it's cold but nothing alarming. But it wasn't built as tight as the first block because I just used drop-in pistons on the stock bore on new case halves.
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Old 02-23-2017, 11:32 AM   #24
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Wow, I can't believe you spent all that money on a 300whp car. I wonder what my pistons look like after being stage 2 power for 60,000 miles. I check my oil every fill and measure it when I change it, and my motor doesn't consume any oil, unlike my 06 STI which drank a quart every change.

As long as your built motor has the same factory clearances and coatings it should be just as reliable. I think it has more to do with people beating the piss out of their motor.
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Old 02-23-2017, 11:45 AM   #25
Squirtledasuby
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Default Shortblock outfront Motorsports

They have a similar block to this same cleareances. But request to run thicker oil.
10w40 it's whole life

Still debating what block to get.
Do you know anyone else running IAG blocks stage 1, and 2 and there experiences?
Thanks
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