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Old 04-11-2008, 12:34 PM   #1
Element Tuning
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Default Element GT65 OEM Location Turbocharger, 512 WHP Internally Gated, Time Attack Win

This was the maiden voyage for our GT65 stock location turbocharger and for being internally gated 512 whp is pretty impressive. Not only did it impress on the dyno but also took the NASA Time Attack Unlimited class (TTU) win on both days at Virginia International Raceway.


The GT52 has done so well we figured it was going to be really hard to beat. With that said we are not out to replace it but instead offer something larger for those who are on the edge of purchasing a rotated kit. The biggest difference between the 52 and the 65 would be a more heavily modified Garrett turbine wheel and a 65 lbs compressor wheel stuffed into a 3” compressor cover, a heavily ported 8cm turbine housing, and 19 psi internal gate fitted standard. Unlike the GT52 the GT65 requires TGV deletes and a 3” silicon inlet for installation.


The fuel used was Sunoco 110 and also the Hydramist was injecting windshield washer fluid rated at -20C. Peak power toped out at about 6400 rpm where boost was 23.4 psi, the AFR at 11.7, and ignition timing at 25 degrees in the Hydra data log. This is pretty conservative but it's my road racing map. For drag racing with a fuel such as VP C16 we could pick up about 15 hp. While the peak boost hit 26.4 psi it was not holding all the way to redline but for an internally gated turbocharger it was doing really well and in the “real world” it holds quite well. Spoolup is decent but ever since I installed the Cosworth cams I’ve lost about 300 rpm of my spoolup that I just can’t seem to regain with tuning of the AVCS. Running 1000cc RC fuel injectors and the Hydramist water injection kit fuel injector duty cycles were nice and safe at 78%.

I am also running a modified 2007 RS intake manifold but since I changed a number of parts I’m not sure what gains or shifts in the power curve may have occurred. It’s a nice manifold with long runners and a large plenum. It does take extensive modifications including custom machined manifold spacers (so fuel injectors can clear AVCS solenoids), custom fuel rail brackets, and some welding to close off the EGR ports. It’s also much taller with the spacer but as long as there’s a hood scoop it clears.

I had two bad misfires that popped up on the last two runs. I tweaked out the dwell on the Hydra map and fixed the misfire at around 7100 but then on the next pull I got one at about 7400 rpm. Looking at the logs all was well with no sign of detonation so it might just be time for some new plugs as I didn’t experience any of this while racing.

This was also the maiden voyage for the production Element Tuning turbo-back exhaust system. What separates our downpipe from the rest is that we chose to do something new with the divorced wastegate design. I penned this design almost 5 years ago but finding a manufacturer to produce the system with the quality we wanted proved difficult until now. Since the majority of Element Tuning customers have extensive modifications such as larger bolt-on turbochargers like the GT52 or GT49 we designed this exhaust system to exploit that by running the 3” dowpipe’s centerline on the exhaust wheel and the 2” wastegate dump tube’s centerline with the wastegate flapper valve. To do this is difficult however and required us to intersect the 3” DP with the 2” dump tube. You basically end up with almost the volume of a 5” DP and then the wastegate dump tube follows all the way down to the bottom of the exhaust system where we then angled the dump tube to create a low pressure area, therefore creating a Venturi Effect which further aids in proper wastegate flow.


The other item we altered from the norm was a divider at the turbocharger flange. The reason we did this was that we found in testing that it hurt wastegate performance since the majority of the aftermarket turbochargers swing open in a fashion that dumps wastegate exhaust directly into the divider hurting flow. This is often why “bellmouth” designs have better boost pressure control. Also by forgoing this divider, the system will work with turbochargers that have a divided exhaust housing from the factory.
I don’t think we can make the internal gated setup any better than it is without risking boost creep and most likely the customer interested in the internal setup is likely only going to run a maximum of 23 psi for pump gas. Since my car is also fitted with an Element FEW Competition Uppipe, we’ll weld up the internal gate and fit a TurboSmart Ultra Gate and see if we can hold about 26-27 psi to redline. This should net us in theory another +45 whp which would put peak power at 557 whp which would make me extremely happy for the first shot at the Element GT65 bolt-on turbocharger.

Modifications:

Engine: Element Tuning Pro Time Attack Motor: Element Forged H-Beam Rods, Element Custom 2618 Forged Pistons
Heads: Element Tuning Valve Springs, Cosworth Camshafts
Intake: 3” Silicon inlet, Subaru RS Intake Manifold
Element Hydra EMS 2.6
Element Hydramist Water Injection
Element GT65 Bolt-on Turbocharger Internal WG
Element Full 3” Turbo-back Exhaust System
Element 4-1 Header
Element Fuel Surge Tank
Aeromotive A1000 fuel pump
TurboSmart E-Boost 2
TurboSmart Megasonic BOV
Clutch Master’s Element Spec Clutch
RC 1000cc Low Impedance Fuel injectors
Custom Fuel Rails
Ported TGV Housings
Front Mount Intercooler core, Element GT65 piping kit
JIC Suspension custom valved and sprung for Element Tuning
Prodrive GC010 18x9.5 Wheels
Hankook Ventus Race Tires 275/35-18
Seibon Carbon Doors, Hood, and Trunk
Sparco Seats, Steering Wheel, and Harnesses
StopTech 355mm BBK

Thanks,
Phil Grabow
www.elementtuning.com
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Last edited by Element Tuning; 04-11-2008 at 05:36 PM.
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Old 04-11-2008, 12:44 PM   #2
SplatZ400
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Glad to see the cat is out of the bag finally. We have been hanging around waiting on info since the worldone post months ago!
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Old 04-11-2008, 12:46 PM   #3
boost junkie
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Nice work Phil, that thing is a monster! I'm still loving my GT52, going back for a retune with the 38mm Ultragate this afternoon
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Old 04-11-2008, 12:54 PM   #4
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very nice Phil...what are you guys weighing in at now,if you are willing to disclose. I'm just curious what kind of power to weight ratio you have now.
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Old 04-11-2008, 01:05 PM   #5
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impressive how far the bolt-on turbochargers are coming
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Old 04-11-2008, 01:15 PM   #6
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nice write up, you are one the only tuners that will tell about problems they had and how they fixed them; i really appreciate that about you Mr. Phil G

congrats on the wins
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Old 04-11-2008, 01:17 PM   #7
Element Tuning
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Yes the bolt-on have come a long way but it's a difficult road when you start trying to get them to 500+whp due to the limitations of the currently available exhaust housings.

Our time attack car with 5 gallons of gas, 1 gallon of water, and driver is about 3135 lbs.

Thanks,
Phil
www.elementtuning.com
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Old 04-11-2008, 01:37 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Element Tuning View Post
Yes the bolt-on have come a long way but it's a difficult road when you start trying to get them to 500+whp due to the limitations of the currently available exhaust housings.

Our time attack car with 5 gallons of gas, 1 gallon of water, and driver is about 3135 lbs.

Thanks,
Phil
www.elementtuning.com

Great Job Phil!

More Element Turbos! Keep up the good work!


-Rob
www.automasteramr.com
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Old 04-11-2008, 01:56 PM   #9
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Nice turbo Phil and congrats on the TTU win.

Mike
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Old 04-11-2008, 01:59 PM   #10
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Mmm.....I wonder how this turbo would do on a 2.0 or stroked 2.2...
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Old 04-11-2008, 02:03 PM   #11
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thats a huge turbo to have an IWG
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Old 04-11-2008, 02:20 PM   #12
Element Tuning
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pearljam11 View Post
thats a huge turbo to have an IWG
Yes I know I was surprised at how well we could control boost with it and I was able to run as low as 19 psi to redline with our exhaust system. Because the exhaust wheel has such great flow we don't really have to resort to all the tricks we have to run on the GT52 to control boost pressure.

As mentioned though for us to hit the numbers we want on the dyno we'll have to go externally gated. I just didn't want to make it mandatory for everyone to have to go externally gated.

Thanks,
Phil
www.elementtuning.com
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Old 04-11-2008, 02:33 PM   #13
blowbyu24
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glad to see the final numbers!!!!

its my all time favorite SUBIE
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Old 04-11-2008, 03:40 PM   #14
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Great write up and congrats on the win.
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Old 04-11-2008, 05:53 PM   #15
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I love you actually go out and walk the walk. Not many other vendors or manufacturers can say the same. I almost see Element as the only JDM style tuning shop like Z/S, Top Secret, Tein, etc.
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Old 04-11-2008, 06:32 PM   #16
Element Tuning
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Thanks. We like to feel confident in the products and engines we offer and the only way I felt comfortable was putting them to the test on the track. I have to assume our customer will be as hard on the equipment as we are.

Thanks,
Phil
www.elementtuning.com
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Old 04-11-2008, 06:32 PM   #17
Sko
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Sweet stuff! Phil what is your "official" record at time attack events?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sperry7 View Post
I love you actually go out and walk the walk. Not many other vendors or manufacturers can say the same. I almost see Element as the only JDM style tuning shop like Z/S, Top Secret, Tein, etc.
What do you mean by "JDM Style"?
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Old 04-11-2008, 07:24 PM   #18
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You should throw the GSC cams in there and see if you can duplicate Topspeeds results

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&highlight=gsc
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Old 04-11-2008, 07:44 PM   #19
Element Tuning
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Well......I wish installing cams was as simple as "throwing" them in there
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Old 04-11-2008, 08:19 PM   #20
WebMasterP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Element Tuning View Post
Well......I wish installing cams was as simple as "throwing" them in there
What all is involved in a cam swap? I realize you have to pull the motor, but do you have to take off the heads? or you can you just pull off the valve cover? C'mon Phil, we need more data and you could always stand to go faster
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Old 04-11-2008, 08:47 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Element Tuning View Post
Well......I wish installing cams was as simple as "throwing" them in there
what you mean its not like the Evo. Its not like you`ll have to yank the motor out

Great job on the win and the new products, Any pics of the Element 4-1 Header, I`d love to see those, and own them!!

do you believe the loss in spool up is due to the Cosworth Cams being Retarded however many degrees they are I forget the number, Or it being the lift and duration, I second the motion i am also curious about the GSC cams However on there website for the large cams it says additional machining may be needed to the heads to get them to fit, which is kinda scary

Sean
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Old 04-11-2008, 09:08 PM   #22
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Very nice work Phil....

Testing at the track is the only way to go...

Again, that is very impressive for being internally gated....
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Old 04-11-2008, 09:35 PM   #23
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Very impressive Phil!

Watching the car lap around VIR was amazing!

I hope to see it again soon
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Old 04-11-2008, 09:38 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Element Tuning View Post
Thanks. We like to feel confident in the products and engines we offer and the only way I felt comfortable was putting them to the test on the track. I have to assume our customer will be as hard on the equipment as we are.

Thanks,
Phil
www.elementtuning.com
That is a great way to run a company in this business. I thank you for it!
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Old 04-11-2008, 09:40 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Element Tuning View Post
Well......I wish installing cams was as simple as "throwing" them in there
they aren't?
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