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Old 09-06-2016, 09:41 PM   #1
2slofouru
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Default How many years does the 06 2.5 sohc VVL long block remain unchanged?

I recently purchased a 2007 2.5i with spun bearing(s) and it's likely the cams are toast going by the rod bearings. The block is a 253 but the heads have the single oil valve that actuates VVL. I think the VVL didn't start in the imprezas until 2006 in the US, so it would seem they may have left at least the long block the same for a few years after. The intake went to plastic in 2008 (I believe) on all of the NA 2.5 sohc engines and on the legacies they used coil on plug. Mine has a waste spark setup (lame), but I'm hoping the sohc block at least stayed the same for a few years later so I can find a low mileage engine and just swap externals.

Does anyone know for sure how long the 2.5 sohc (block and heads) stayed the same starting in 2006? I'd rather find a very low mileage one than buy a new shortblock and rebuilt heads and pay for $$$ in gaskets as well.
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Old 09-07-2016, 11:49 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2slofouru View Post
I recently purchased a 2007 2.5i with spun bearing(s) and it's likely the cams are toast going by the rod bearings. The block is a 253 but the heads have the single oil valve that actuates VVL. I think the VVL didn't start in the imprezas until 2006 in the US, so it would seem they may have left at least the long block the same for a few years after. The intake went to plastic in 2008 (I believe) on all of the NA 2.5 sohc engines and on the legacies they used coil on plug. Mine has a waste spark setup (lame), but I'm hoping the sohc block at least stayed the same for a few years later so I can find a low mileage engine and just swap externals.

Does anyone know for sure how long the 2.5 sohc (block and heads) stayed the same starting in 2006? I'd rather find a very low mileage one than buy a new shortblock and rebuilt heads and pay for $$$ in gaskets as well.
Pull a EJ253 from any Subaru 06-10 to be safe. There were slight changes after 10 btwn the models for 2010 the EJ253 got a slight revision to the intake manifold design and changed from cast Al to plastic.

Find a 06-10 EJ253 with aluminum intake manifold and you should be fine. The only coil on plug setups are found in the EJ255/7 and EZ30/36D engines. The FB and FA early years (Legacy/OB got the FB25 Forester/Impreza got the FA/B 20)
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Old 09-07-2016, 01:45 PM   #3
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I have no problem swapping the intake and valve covers if the heads and block are the same. It's just nearly impossible to find an impreza specific cast manifold one and low mileage just adds to that. There are legacy low mileage engines all over
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Old 09-07-2016, 01:49 PM   #4
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I also live down south so subarus are rare in salvage yards, otherwise I'd try to do some hands on checking.
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Old 09-11-2016, 03:43 PM   #5
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Legacy and Outback 2.5i 06-10 are wrecked all over the place just as whole cars. Folks hoard them to part out (which never happens lol) the long blocks are the same for those 2 years models that are different. YOu could swap the IMs and be fine the harnesses plugs right up
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Old 09-11-2016, 09:36 PM   #6
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Pull a EJ253 from any Subaru 06-10 to be safe. There were slight changes after 10 btwn the models for 2010 the EJ253 got a slight revision to the intake manifold design and changed from cast Al to plastic.

Find a 06-10 EJ253 with aluminum intake manifold and you should be fine. The only coil on plug setups are found in the EJ255/7 and EZ30/36D engines. The FB and FA early years (Legacy/OB got the FB25 Forester/Impreza got the FA/B 20)
The legacy seems to have coil on plug on the 10+ ej253, but that's no big deal if the compression ratio and other mechanical specs are the same. I can swap my valve covers over to a legacy block, their bolt patterns look the same. What kind of sucks is that they want your VIN to be sure you are matching the engine to the correct vehicle for warranty purposes. Some sellers state specifically their warranty will be void if parts are swapped, different intakes for example. I've messaged a seller to try and see if that rule can be bypassed since I do automotive work for a living and am ASE certified at least. There is no way to prove my experience otherwise, but hopefully they will understand how simple it is to swap manifolds over. I even plan on keeping the legacy manifold for a while in case it's needed, but if the engine truly is low mileage there should be no issues.
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Old 09-12-2016, 10:10 AM   #7
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Ah so I did some comparison you could pull a 10-12 EJ253 BUT youll need to swap crank, cam and front harnesses OR swap your existing cam, and crank sensors and use your coil and wire setup.

The Coil on plug harness is different and the ECU ignition mapping but the timing settings are the same across (per the owners manuals)

SO price wise I would still avoid them and go after a 06-09 EJ253 but you could in theory run the longblock with your induction and ignition setup from the older model. The revisions appear to have added coil on plug and the plastic IM along with some other PCV improvements in anticipation for the FB25. I tried to track down a 13 Legacy ECU image to run a compare in ECUFlash against my 08 2.5i image but couldnt find any.

Also if your current engine turns over and its just a rod or crank bearing pop the valve covers off and see if they too spin freely and dont have any scoring. If so have the block machined My local machine shop charges $300 (bare block) to blast and hot tank it, bore the mains. You simply tell them what main size you are going with ahead of time and if high miles you can opt to go up to 99.75mm pistons for $25 more a cylinder.

Ask around to get some pricing on a basic machining of your current block while searching for used running engines
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Old 09-12-2016, 09:37 PM   #8
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I would much rather an untampered newer legacy if all that is needed is to swap the crank and cam sensors and install my intake with harness. Are the cam and crank teeth different between the 10 impreza and legacy, or just the sensor type? The legacy seems to have gone back to dohc in 2013 with the sealed timing chain setup, 2012 and down are belt and sohc. Even if I just needed to swap my cam and crank gears that wouldn't seem a big deal. I tried searching parts and couldn't confirm when the cam gear changed from two pin to three, though it would seem weird to change before 2013.

The valve covers will be coming off and I will check for scoring but I'm just trying to have a plan ready if they are damaged. I don't want to be dealing with some rogue metal shard that makes it through my cleaning process and decides to break loose and cause an issue with VVL when I'm at upper revs and kills something.

Even if I find a used engine of course the valve covers and belt covers will be coming off for inspection. If the heads on my engine were ok, I'd still have to get an oem crank and find a competent machine shop. NONE of the local places will work on subaru blocks, they avoid them like a plague. I also don't want the hassle of building the entire block bottom up, I've already done that with my current and previous engine. The oem gasket kit is not cheap and if the heads can stay in place that would save a lot of headache, down time, and money.

The damaged engine also has unknown mileage, apparently it's not the first engine in the car..and the car has just over 100k miles! There were several loose bolts all over the place and the intake manifold gaskets were aftermarket crap. At minimum, I'd need to pull all valves and clean them and the heads and seat them with some compound, and replace the seals with oem. Then I'd need oem headgaskets, etc.

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Old 09-15-2016, 03:36 PM   #9
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That is the FB engine totally different engine that the EJ. You could pull the part description for a 2010-12 Legacy timing belt that would tell you if it is different (gear wise). For that matter the crank and cam sensor too!


Wow that is a turd of a engine and engine history and previous owner
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Old 09-15-2016, 03:45 PM   #10
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I know the details of the fb, and obviously wouldn't try that. Either way I have a 12 legacy 2.5 sohc coming with 7k miles on it. Since that is the last year for it being used in the legacy, we will know soon for sure. Even if I have to swap cam gears its no biggie. In the pics, the crank and cam sensors had the normal two wires so it may not even be necessary.

I'm guessing the sensors on the Na legacy didn't change to the three wire until the fb engine.
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Old 10-01-2016, 01:42 AM   #11
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Today the clutch parts came in and I decided to get the engine swapped out. There are two issues so far:

-The 12 legacy block has a normal rubber pcv tube/base to the block with a short rubber tube that branches off. It also has a plastic pcv valve that can be removed from the rubber assembly. The 07 2.5i has a metal pcv base that ts off then has a long pcv hose to the intake. Its pcv valve is screwed into the top of the base. I removed the valve from the metal base but can't get the base out of the block. I could rig the 12 rubber base with a piece of tubing and some clamps but was hoping to keep the original pcv parts. I haven't found a way online to remove it yet.

-The 12 legacy spark plug tubes are shorter than the 07 tubes, and the 12 covers are designed for coil packs. I have to use the 07 covers on the 12 block, but the tube seals are about 1/4" from the covers and that obviously won't keep the oil in. I tried keeping the 12 covers on and installing the plug wire, but that makes the plug wire seal lift about 1/4" off the cover and obviously won't keep water out of the spark plug tube.

I'm considering getting some washers made of aluminum or phenolic plastic and gluing them to the inside of the 2.5i valve covers so the tube seals will press firmly against them and seal properly. My manager was telling me to get some brass rings machined to slip over the tubes with a lip for the tube seals, but that is a little over the top and obviously would be more pricey.

Basically the car is now on my rack in limbo, with two engines waiting for me to figure things out. I can't use the old heads, with all of the metal that was in the engine I'm not taking the chance. I really hope there isn't some other ridiculous issue that keeps this setup from working. As much as I'd rather not modify anything though, I already have this engine and need to give it a good attempt at least.
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Old 10-13-2016, 10:02 AM   #12
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Default more awesome news

So apparently there is even more to deal with than anticipated. I was told recently the oil pan won't work on the impreza crossmember. That wouldn't be a big deal normally, but even the bolts are larger on the legacy block, wtf. They are 12mm and now I wouldn't be surprised if the pan bolt pattern was different and the oil pickup may not be interchangeable. And yet again, parts guinea pig time for me :/
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Old 10-13-2016, 10:03 AM   #13
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At this rate I may need to sell the block
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Old 10-13-2016, 03:11 PM   #14
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Yup time to offload/cut your losses. Also its good that you did this to shed accurate information about the changes to the 253 for that 11-12 MY period. (Legacy owners)
With the engine cradle discovery its nearly as much work to make that engine work as it would be to swap in a EJ255!
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Old 10-13-2016, 03:22 PM   #15
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Lol, I don't want the extra complication of boost. Have you seen prices on "rebuilt" ej253 longblocks? They are outrageous. I wanted this engine to basically have zero miles or close to it, with no chances of being abused. The only way to do that other than figuring out the oil pan would be a brand new shortblock and to find some heads that "supposedly" have no issues or have low mileage. How many people part out vvl heads from an engine with super low miles and no spun bearings? :crickets: I've searched and found some blocks around 40k miles used but there is zero way to know they didn't have walmart or some shade tree moron doing oil changes and could have left the oil out for a short start...just one time, and caused a pattern that can't be undone.


At this point it's only the shims (already have those done) and the pan. I'm not absolutely sure it won't fit, but it sure would have been helpful to have this info before getting into it. The engine mount points are still there, just not sure if the pan would clear. Tonight will put my own car on the rack to get an idea, I have a 257 block and pan. There is a slant on the oil pan rear, probably not enough though. Sure would be nice to have a 7k mile block though...

Edit 2: I forgot to put the car on the rack, today at work nothing went well, it was basically pure hassle. :/ I'm going to post a sale thread for the longblock, maybe someone (yeah right) has a legacy that needs an uber low mileage block.

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Old 10-14-2016, 07:58 PM   #16
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This is the type of oil pan it has, it has a similar bolt pattern but the front row of bolts are 12mm. It also uses fewer bolts overall.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-11-12-SUB...VXVafR&vxp=mtr








Does this mean the shortblock is totally different than the previous ej253 version? Why would they make a crazy change like that for only a few years then go fb?

I can't just pull the pan to check, don't want to tamper with it in case someone is interested in buying. It's for sale here http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2811347 and on RS25 as well.

Does anyone know if the normal style forward slant subaru oil pans can fit or is that a wrap? I would have no problem getting an oil pickup, baffle, and pan if it could work. This just doesn't seem very subaru-like...it's an ej253 for crying out loud.

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Old 11-23-2016, 08:30 AM   #17
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The engine isn't for sale anymore, I decided to drill some of the missing holes for the steel pan and tap the ones for the pickup tube. The pickup tube holes were already drilled, just no threads. Two holes will remain M8 and I will just drill the pan hole a little larger. Two more holes had to be drilled in the block flange for the front row, because they were never drilled. Otherwise it looks like a go, can't wait to get this fresh engine purring in the car!

I'd share some photos but haven't figured out the updated photobucket app on my new phone
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