Coffee FAQ v. 2.0 - The Master Coffee Thread

poison · 11-03-2005, 01:18 AM

Amended and revised 1.30.15

OK, since there seems to be a weekly "Help A N00b With Coffee" thread, and I field a lot of questions about which coffee, what grinder, how to brew, etc, I thought I'd put together a master thread that will consolidate all this info and put it at your fingertips (and give my two-finger typing a break

).

To get the most enjoyment and flavor from your coffee, you need four things: good water; fresh, good quality beans; good equipment; and the knowledge to put it all together right and produce a cup of excellence.

WATER ----

The basis of good coffee is of course good, fresh water. Drip coffee is 98% water, so of course good water is essential. Tap water has chlorine and lots of other impurities which affect the flavor of your brew. Distilled water, the most pure form, is not good either: it tastes 'flat', and is lacking minerals instrumental in extracting maximum flavor from your cuppa.

I recommend spring water, the best being Fiji and Ice Age. Arrowhead, Dasani, and similar waters are fine. (Incidentally, the Bay Area has very good water for coffee brewing, straight from the tap- everyone else, don't do it!

).

COFFEE ----

Ah, the coffee! This section could take up pages, but I'll try to keep it simple: Www.westcoastroasting.com

YOU NEED FRESH BEANS!!!

That's more or less it. You can have the best beans in the world, roasted by a master roaster, but if they've sat on the shelf for 2 months, it isn't worth squat. Beans are best from day 2 out of the roaster, through day 10. The longest I'd go is 3 weeks, and that is REALLY pushing it.

They should always be stored as whole beans (never ground- ground beans go stale in hours), in tin-tie coffee bags, or better yet in an air-tight container, away from light and heat. Freezing beans is not ideal, unless you'll have them around for more than 2-3 weeks, in which case freeze away. If you freeze, take 1/4-1/2lb out at at time, so you're not pulling the beans out every day; this allows condensation to form on the beans, which leaches flavor.

I won't make bean recommendations here. Oh wait, I already did.

GEAR ----
I won't post links, because those change over time. A quick Google should bring up my recommendations, if you need help, ask.

Grinder -

There are a TON of different methods of brewing coffee, all of which require their own gear. I'll cover the most popular methods. Everyone loves shiny new gear, so I'll definately be recommending stuff, some of which I've personally used and vouch for, others that I have researched and know to be good.

The most important piece of gear a coffee lover can own, and should not skimp on, is the grinder. THe quality of the grinder is almost more important than the quality of the brewer. A poor grind is inconsistent. The particles of ground coffee are different sized; some particles will over-extract when brewed, some will under extract. Neither is good, and you will get sour, bitter, nasty coffee. (Just because your coffee isn't outright nasty doesn't mean you shouldn't buy a good grinder; like I said, your coffee can ALWAYS be better). If all you can afford is a nut-type grinder, do it; the important thing is to grind just before brewing.

If you can spend a bit more, a $90 burr grinder will be a great improvement in your coffee flavor. Cheap burr grinders grind into consistent sized particles; expensive ones actually shave slices off of the beans. Once you dial in the right grind for your machine, all the evenly ground particles will extract evenly, and you'll have better tasting coffee.

Here are my recommendations:

Cheapest - hario hand mill $30

Cheap - Capresso infinity

Best choice for drip for most people- baratza encore

Espresso - baratza preciso, cunill tranquilo, any mazzer

Drip Machines-

I'll recommend three. All can brew nearly equally well.

The reason you need one of these machines, even if you just bought what you thought was a good machine yesterday: drip coffee needs to be brewed at a specific temperature, namely 195-200 degrees. No more, no less. Few drip machines start brewing at that temperature, and other than those listed above, virtually none keep 195 degrees throughout the brew cycle. Lesser temperature, lesser coffee. (More than 200 degrees will over extract and 'cook' the coffee.) These machines keep a rock-steady 195 degrees throughout the cycle.

Bunn HG Phase Brew - $100

Bonavita - $160

Technivorm - $$300

Espresso machines -

The best starter espresso machine is the cheapest gaggia you can find. I used a cheap Gaggia for years, and it works very well for the price. Just don't expect to serve 15 lattes at a party: it is very slow for more than 1-2 drinks. I highly recommend these as your first machine.

Next step up is the astra pro for $1100. Is $200 to $1100 a big jump? Yes it is. But in between there is nothing good, you're either paying more for similar performance to a cheap gaggia, or you're buying a seriously flawed machine that requires a lot of tweaking to get it to work right, or you are only a few hundred dollars away from the astra pro, which is aeons better than whatever junk you're considering. Gaggia, astra, or bust. Trust me.

Please ask before buying, I'm more than happy to help. Please don't buy a silvia, it's junk. And if you want an astra, let me know.

Knowledge ----

There are so many new brew methods today, there's no point in trying to cover them in detail. The Internet is a big place, and learning how to brew a good cup is a Google search or youtube video away. So I'll be very general:

When looking at a brew method, there are two things it must give you to create a good cup of coffee: control of the brew time, and brew temp (or be accurately calibrated to provide the correct time and temp). Here are some methods that provide that:

Chemex
French Press
Clever Dripper
Bonavita Dripper
Able Cone
Hario
Aeropress
Any of the drip brewers I listed above
Espresso

There are many more, but those are popular, for good reason. If you control the brew time and water temp, and you're using good beans and good water, you'll get a good cup. I'm personally partial to espresso, clever, and the technivorm.

* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.

Strider · 11-03-2015, 10:11 AM

The thread is dead. Long live the thread!

Now, moar coffee pls.

poison · 11-03-2015, 10:17 AM

Holy crap! Thank you guys! Panama is noms! Kona is coming! NASIOC10YEARS is the code for the holidays! Sample packs!

Crazy stuff.

sedagive · 11-03-2015, 10:18 AM

I love the coffee thread.

Vectors2Final · 11-03-2015, 10:45 AM

In.

Whooo!

darksc00by · 11-03-2015, 11:46 AM

I've been using a new local roaster. He does a pretty good job, but nothing like Nate's beans. mmmmm.

poison · 11-03-2015, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darksc00by

I've been using a new local roaster. He does a pretty good job, but nothing like Nate's beans. mmmmm.

Thanks man, I appreciate that. I hear that a lot, which is cool!

samagon · 11-03-2015, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by poison

Holy crap! Thank you guys! Panama is noms! Kona is coming! NASIOC10YEARS is the code for the holidays! Sample packs!

Crazy stuff.

Finally ordered some for the business partner to try! Been a crazy semester.

You need to update the first post as well. Tell us more about Keurig.

poison · 11-03-2015, 03:17 PM

Keurig hmm? The vein in my temple just started throbbing.

AllAWD · 11-03-2015, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by poison

Keurig hmm? The vein in my temple just started throbbing.

Keurig shares dive 27% after news of lay offs news

They're in full decline.

poison · 11-03-2015, 05:22 PM

Works for me.

hate those things.

I'll just leave this here: https//:goo.gl/dp7dpi

kfoote · 11-03-2015, 05:36 PM

*subscribed*

I'll be ordering something later this week, I just want to make sure I'm not on the road when it could potentially show up.

poison · 11-03-2015, 05:38 PM

Next roast day is tomorrow!

Howang · 11-03-2015, 05:54 PM

poison, i really want to try your beans. where can i pick up in LA area?

poison · 11-03-2015, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Howang

poison, i really want to try your beans. where can i pick up in LA area?

I'm in west la!

poison · 11-03-2015, 08:50 PM

Would you guys rather have the Kona at $40 for a full lb, or $30 for 12oz?

poison · 11-03-2015, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Christmas time is Kona time! I skipped this last year, but I'm bringing it back this holiday season. This Kona is the best the Big Island has to offer. It's grown by a husband and wife on their beautiful 5 acre farm; they do all the labor themselves, and don't use chemicals and pesticides (it's not certified organic, due to prohibitive cost). It's shade-grown, bird-friendly, and 100% American. The level of care they put into this coffee is astonishing, and it shows in every aspect of the coffee, from the beautifully uniform, large, defect-free green beans, to the way it roasts, to the flavors in the cup. Great coffees display the flavors of terroir, or where it's grown, and this is no exception: sweet coconut, toasted macadamia nut, caramelized sugar, and starfruit all wrapped up in a silky medium>heavy bodied package. It always sells out fast, so get some while you can!

poison · 11-04-2015, 12:51 AM

I think I'm going to switch from donating to the imc, and the mercy centre on the blend 55, to donating solely to the mercy centre for everything. The imc does good work, but I can no longer specify what country the aid should go to, and I would rather donate directly to someone doing the real deal work on the ground, than some multinational conglomerate org. The fact that charlie sheen's brother, Ramon, goes there pretty regularly, knows them personally, and has seen their dedication first hand makes me feel pretty good about it (beside all the other accolades they've received).

tegan_ca · 11-04-2015, 01:19 AM

In on first page.
What's this talk of $40/lb coffee? Bring back the Mexican cake you talked about in old thread for $12/lb or something in that ballpark.

poison · 11-04-2015, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tegan_ca

In on first page.
What's this talk of $40/lb coffee? Bring back the Mexican cake you talked about in old thread for $12/lb or something in that ballpark.

It's kona, expensive as hell. It's 50‰ more than it was a couple years ago, but I only raised the price around 10%.

The Brazil Blend 56 with the code is $14.66, and it's better than that Mexican. That fit the bill?

Joe · 11-04-2015, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by poison

Would you guys rather have the Kona at $40 for a full lb, or $30 for 12oz?

I think I am going to give the Kona a shot this year. Either way works for me as long as you can ship it with the sampler pack so I can save some on the shipping.

Strider · 11-04-2015, 07:48 AM

I'll be due for an order in a week or so, I want to give a pound of kona a try.

poison · 11-04-2015, 08:33 AM

Adding to the sample pack is fine! It may charge shipping on top, but I'll refund it, so order away.

shiplemw · 11-04-2015, 09:11 AM

What is your website address again? I'm going to orders a sampler pack or two.

80083r · 11-04-2015, 09:22 AM

For another perspective (which you didn't ask for, but I don't care...) when you work 2000 miles from home, from 5am to 7pm, coffee isn't an art.

It's the stuff that you inject in your veins to stay alive, and it comes from the magic machine at the end of the hall. I think it's made from the screaming souls of sinners executed by the mayans, or something.

I know it's blacker than a hole, and you can't stir it because the spoon dissolves before you're finished.

<twitch><twitch>... but I'm fine really, how are you?

11-03-2005, 01:18 AM	#1
poison Scooby Specialist Member#: 37678 Join Date: May 2003 Chapter/Region: SCIC	Coffee FAQ v. 2.0 - The Master Coffee Thread Amended and revised 1.30.15 OK, since there seems to be a weekly "Help A N00b With Coffee" thread, and I field a lot of questions about which coffee, what grinder, how to brew, etc, I thought I'd put together a master thread that will consolidate all this info and put it at your fingertips (and give my two-finger typing a break ). To get the most enjoyment and flavor from your coffee, you need four things: good water; fresh, good quality beans; good equipment; and the knowledge to put it all together right and produce a cup of excellence. WATER ---- The basis of good coffee is of course good, fresh water. Drip coffee is 98% water, so of course good water is essential. Tap water has chlorine and lots of other impurities which affect the flavor of your brew. Distilled water, the most pure form, is not good either: it tastes 'flat', and is lacking minerals instrumental in extracting maximum flavor from your cuppa. I recommend spring water, the best being Fiji and Ice Age. Arrowhead, Dasani, and similar waters are fine. (Incidentally, the Bay Area has very good water for coffee brewing, straight from the tap- everyone else, don't do it! ). COFFEE ---- Ah, the coffee! This section could take up pages, but I'll try to keep it simple: Www.westcoastroasting.com YOU NEED FRESH BEANS!!! That's more or less it. You can have the best beans in the world, roasted by a master roaster, but if they've sat on the shelf for 2 months, it isn't worth squat. Beans are best from day 2 out of the roaster, through day 10. The longest I'd go is 3 weeks, and that is REALLY pushing it. They should always be stored as whole beans (never ground- ground beans go stale in hours), in tin-tie coffee bags, or better yet in an air-tight container, away from light and heat. Freezing beans is not ideal, unless you'll have them around for more than 2-3 weeks, in which case freeze away. If you freeze, take 1/4-1/2lb out at at time, so you're not pulling the beans out every day; this allows condensation to form on the beans, which leaches flavor. I won't make bean recommendations here. Oh wait, I already did. GEAR ---- I won't post links, because those change over time. A quick Google should bring up my recommendations, if you need help, ask. Grinder - There are a TON of different methods of brewing coffee, all of which require their own gear. I'll cover the most popular methods. Everyone loves shiny new gear, so I'll definately be recommending stuff, some of which I've personally used and vouch for, others that I have researched and know to be good. The most important piece of gear a coffee lover can own, and should not skimp on, is the grinder. THe quality of the grinder is almost more important than the quality of the brewer. A poor grind is inconsistent. The particles of ground coffee are different sized; some particles will over-extract when brewed, some will under extract. Neither is good, and you will get sour, bitter, nasty coffee. (Just because your coffee isn't outright nasty doesn't mean you shouldn't buy a good grinder; like I said, your coffee can ALWAYS be better). If all you can afford is a nut-type grinder, do it; the important thing is to grind just before brewing. If you can spend a bit more, a $90 burr grinder will be a great improvement in your coffee flavor. Cheap burr grinders grind into consistent sized particles; expensive ones actually shave slices off of the beans. Once you dial in the right grind for your machine, all the evenly ground particles will extract evenly, and you'll have better tasting coffee. Here are my recommendations: Cheapest - hario hand mill $30 Cheap - Capresso infinity Best choice for drip for most people- baratza encore Espresso - baratza preciso, cunill tranquilo, any mazzer Drip Machines- I'll recommend three. All can brew nearly equally well. The reason you need one of these machines, even if you just bought what you thought was a good machine yesterday: drip coffee needs to be brewed at a specific temperature, namely 195-200 degrees. No more, no less. Few drip machines start brewing at that temperature, and other than those listed above, virtually none keep 195 degrees throughout the brew cycle. Lesser temperature, lesser coffee. (More than 200 degrees will over extract and 'cook' the coffee.) These machines keep a rock-steady 195 degrees throughout the cycle. Bunn HG Phase Brew - $100 Bonavita - $160 Technivorm - $$300 Espresso machines - The best starter espresso machine is the cheapest gaggia you can find. I used a cheap Gaggia for years, and it works very well for the price. Just don't expect to serve 15 lattes at a party: it is very slow for more than 1-2 drinks. I highly recommend these as your first machine. Next step up is the astra pro for $1100. Is $200 to $1100 a big jump? Yes it is. But in between there is nothing good, you're either paying more for similar performance to a cheap gaggia, or you're buying a seriously flawed machine that requires a lot of tweaking to get it to work right, or you are only a few hundred dollars away from the astra pro, which is aeons better than whatever junk you're considering. Gaggia, astra, or bust. Trust me. Please ask before buying, I'm more than happy to help. Please don't buy a silvia, it's junk. And if you want an astra, let me know. Knowledge ---- There are so many new brew methods today, there's no point in trying to cover them in detail. The Internet is a big place, and learning how to brew a good cup is a Google search or youtube video away. So I'll be very general: When looking at a brew method, there are two things it must give you to create a good cup of coffee: control of the brew time, and brew temp (or be accurately calibrated to provide the correct time and temp). Here are some methods that provide that: Chemex French Press Clever Dripper Bonavita Dripper Able Cone Hario Aeropress Any of the drip brewers I listed above Espresso There are many more, but those are popular, for good reason. If you control the brew time and water temp, and you're using good beans and good water, you'll get a good cup. I'm personally partial to espresso, clever, and the technivorm. * Registered users of the site do not see these ads. Last edited by poison; 01-30-2015 at 12:47 PM.

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11-03-2015, 10:11 AM	#2
Strider Visiting NASIOC Timeout Member#: 2197 Join Date: Aug 2000 Chapter/Region: Tri-State Location: An adventure is just Vehicle: an inconvenience, properly considered.	The thread is dead. Long live the thread! Now, moar coffee pls.

11-03-2015, 10:17 AM	#3
poison Scooby Specialist Member#: 37678 Join Date: May 2003 Chapter/Region: SCIC	Holy crap! Thank you guys! Panama is noms! Kona is coming! NASIOC10YEARS is the code for the holidays! Sample packs! Crazy stuff.

11-03-2015, 10:18 AM	#4
sedagive Scooby Specialist Member#: 186334 Join Date: Aug 2008	I love the coffee thread.

11-03-2015, 10:45 AM	#5
Vectors2Final Scooby Newbie Member#: 15553 Join Date: Feb 2002 Chapter/Region: TXIC Location: Austin, Texas Vehicle: '19 Shelby GT350 Tesla MYP/22 Ram 2500 LL	In. Whooo!

11-03-2015, 11:46 AM	#6
darksc00by Scooby Guru Member#: 102140 Join Date: Dec 2005 Chapter/Region: South East Location: Tampa Bae Vehicle: 2016 Single Speed or Death	I've been using a new local roaster. He does a pretty good job, but nothing like Nate's beans. mmmmm.

11-03-2015, 03:17 PM	#9
poison Scooby Specialist Member#: 37678 Join Date: May 2003 Chapter/Region: SCIC	Keurig hmm? The vein in my temple just started throbbing.

11-03-2015, 05:22 PM	#11
poison Scooby Specialist Member#: 37678 Join Date: May 2003 Chapter/Region: SCIC	Works for me. hate those things. I'll just leave this here: https//:goo.gl/dp7dpi

11-03-2015, 05:36 PM	#12
kfoote Scooby Specialist Member#: 39180 Join Date: Jul 2003 Chapter/Region: NESIC Location: Trying to get :unamused: on TV Vehicle: 2006 Ford E350 Parked in a school zone	subscribed I'll be ordering something later this week, I just want to make sure I'm not on the road when it could potentially show up.

11-03-2015, 05:38 PM	#13
poison Scooby Specialist Member#: 37678 Join Date: May 2003 Chapter/Region: SCIC	Next roast day is tomorrow!

11-03-2015, 05:54 PM	#14
Howang Scooby Newbie Member#: 411265 Join Date: Jan 2015 Chapter/Region: SCIC Location: Los Angeles Vehicle: 2003 wrx wagon aspen white	poison, i really want to try your beans. where can i pick up in LA area?

11-03-2015, 08:50 PM	#16
poison Scooby Specialist Member#: 37678 Join Date: May 2003 Chapter/Region: SCIC	Would you guys rather have the Kona at $40 for a full lb, or $30 for 12oz?

11-04-2015, 12:51 AM	#18
poison Scooby Specialist Member#: 37678 Join Date: May 2003 Chapter/Region: SCIC	I think I'm going to switch from donating to the imc, and the mercy centre on the blend 55, to donating solely to the mercy centre for everything. The imc does good work, but I can no longer specify what country the aid should go to, and I would rather donate directly to someone doing the real deal work on the ground, than some multinational conglomerate org. The fact that charlie sheen's brother, Ramon, goes there pretty regularly, knows them personally, and has seen their dedication first hand makes me feel pretty good about it (beside all the other accolades they've received).

11-04-2015, 01:19 AM	#19
tegan_ca Scooby Newbie Member#: 150388 Join Date: Jun 2007 Chapter/Region: SCIC Vehicle: '14 FXT	In on first page. What's this talk of $40/lb coffee? Bring back the Mexican cake you talked about in old thread for $12/lb or something in that ballpark.

11-04-2015, 07:48 AM	#22
Strider Visiting NASIOC Timeout Member#: 2197 Join Date: Aug 2000 Chapter/Region: Tri-State Location: An adventure is just Vehicle: an inconvenience, properly considered.	I'll be due for an order in a week or so, I want to give a pound of kona a try.

11-04-2015, 08:33 AM	#23
poison Scooby Specialist Member#: 37678 Join Date: May 2003 Chapter/Region: SCIC	Adding to the sample pack is fine! It may charge shipping on top, but I'll refund it, so order away.

11-04-2015, 09:11 AM	#24
shiplemw Scooby Newbie Member#: 203905 Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: MI	What is your website address again? I'm going to orders a sampler pack or two.

11-04-2015, 09:22 AM	#25
80083r Scooby Newbie Member#: 430446 Join Date: Sep 2015 Chapter/Region: E. Canada Location: Ontario, Canada	For another perspective (which you didn't ask for, but I don't care...) when you work 2000 miles from home, from 5am to 7pm, coffee isn't an art. It's the stuff that you inject in your veins to stay alive, and it comes from the magic machine at the end of the hall. I think it's made from the screaming souls of sinners executed by the mayans, or something. I know it's blacker than a hole, and you can't stir it because the spoon dissolves before you're finished. <twitch><twitch>... but I'm fine really, how are you?