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Old 04-03-2001, 07:21 PM   #1
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 5414
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Hopatcong, NJ
Smile Subaru history of reliability . . .

Okay, here's my situation.
I've been a VW owner for the past 3 cars and I feel a little funny getting something other than my trusty ol' VWs . . .
I've had an 89 Fox (budget!), 92 Jetta GLI 2.0 16V (I loved that car and it got stolen!), and my current baby, the 97 GTI-VR6 driver's edition. This over the course of about 8 years. Throughout the course of reading (not too much) literature/reviews and (a lot of) my friend talking up the WRX, I've put in an order for a WRX; from Flemington, NJ if anyone's interested. Anyway, I'm just wondering about the reliability of the brand 'Subaru' in general. In my experience, whenever someone talks about a reliable car, it's always a Honda or a VW. "They're tanks!", many will say . . . Yes, Volvo's are tanks, but I'm talking affordable for me. So, I'm just wondering, biased or not, what's the overall consensus on Subaru?
My VW-Fox had about 160k before I used it as a trade in for my Jetta. I drove that thing over those railroad tracks that no matter where you are in the U.S, 5 times out of 10, can be like a Duke's-of-Hazzard type of jump that can launch your car pretty far . . .
My Jetta, I took pretty good care of (before it got stolen, 140k) and actually did some minor modifications on it. Nothing big, short shift and exhaust. Drove my pretty little Jetta back from Waterfest-Limerock, CT to North Jersey at about 125mph average in a matter of roughly 1/2 hour. My GTI I've taken great care of. Early on, naturally, I had to see what it could do and drove it up to 130mph (with about 2K rpms to go before redline) on a few occassions-hehe. (It's at 67k right now).
I don't beat on cars like I used to and don't plan to by any means with the WRX that I ordered. I'm just wondering what the people that know the car and the company think about it's reliability overall.
All in all, lots of the stuff I've done is really stoopid, but I've never had to do major surgery on my cars. Basically just the normal oil checkups and replacement of battery, tires, plugs and such. I did have overheat problems with my old VW's but that was the extent of my car repair problems.
I have nothing to go against Subaru, but on the other hand, I don't have anything to go for Subaru . . . . Can anyone out there tell me that I've made a good choice?

Thanks a bunch.
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Old 04-03-2001, 07:34 PM   #2
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 4893
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: St. Jacobs, Ontario Canada
2008 WRX


Look at the facts. Consumer reports has lowered the Jetta from average reliability to
no longer reliable plus it is made in Mexico.
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Old 04-03-2001, 07:34 PM   #3
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Member#: 3097
Join Date: Nov 2000
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: www.rs25.com Beaverton, OR
2013 Ford Focus ST
Performance Blue

Thumbs up

The reason you haven't heard about Subaru reliability is probably because they don't sell as many cars here as Honda, VW, or Toyota. But the reliability of Subaru's is very good. Plenty of old Subaru's still running around, and fixing them isn't too expensive from what I've heard, either. Mines still pretty new, so I haven't had to fix anything, but no problems either. And congets on the WRX! Sedan or wagon, and what color did you order? I owned an '85 VW Golf 2-dr a few years ago, and it was a fun little car. You'll like the Suby, I'm sure
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Old 04-03-2001, 08:13 PM   #4
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Member#: 5313
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Danbury, CT, USA
2002 WRX Wagon
World Rally Blue


Hey poostik,

I'm not sure about current ratings, but I do remember the days when Subaru and Mercedes Benz continually traded first place as the car with fewest highway break downs. Also, although this is highly anecdotal, my girlfriend's family and a few friends of mine has had all subies for years and they say all they ever needed to do to their Subaru's was brakes, batteries, tune ups and tires.

I think you will find the WRX less trouble than a VW and less expensive when it needs work (don't get me wrong, I like VW, but I heard their mechanics wear white lab coats and charge accordingly!).

Also, Subaru's do very very well in crash tests. I'm sure the WRX, with all that body reinforcement is tough, and I know the Legacy is really safe. My girlfriend, in her Legacy, side swiped an Explorer that ran a stop sign - she nailed the brakes but estimates she was going close to 30 when she hit him (air bags popped). She had a lof of front end damage, but could drive the car. The Explorer was towed away.
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Old 04-03-2001, 08:36 PM   #5
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Member#: 4203
Join Date: Feb 2001
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Palm Harbor, FL
2009 WRX 5spd hatch
Platinum Silver Metallic


Here is an earlier thread with lots of good info on Subaru reliability.

[This message has been edited by scott_gunn (edited April 03, 2001).]
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Old 04-03-2001, 08:36 PM   #6
Chris N
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Member#: 5322
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Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Maine
07im +07Leg+00Forest
Scooby wrench turner


I second what Speedy says. Back in 95 we went looking for new cars - Subaru ranked right up there with Honda, VW was very low. Consumer Reports has continued to rate Subaru very High. AWD is bullet proof. Intigrity is awesome. And I'm talking about our 3rd Subaru with over 100k since 1995. My OUTBACK Sport has 110k. Heres the service record since we have owned it at mile 1.
45k Front Brake pads. Machined front rotors.
55k 4 tires
100k 4 tires
I drive like a wanna-be Mario Andretti, its not pampered!
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Old 04-03-2001, 09:37 PM   #7
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 2167
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Daytona Beach, FL USA

Look at the porche flat four and six cylinder design. Funny how subaru and porche are the only two manufacturers allowed by patent to make a "boxer" engine. 95% of all general aviation airplane motors are flat or horizontally opposed due to inpecable reliablility, I would worry about wngine driven accesories before I would worry about the motor. The "boxer" engine design is virtually bullet proof.

On another note. My mom's old subaru '89 to be exact has out run all of her friends hondas and toyota's she still brags about it to them. Believe me I have never see any toyota or honda with almost 500,000 miles on it and still going strong, only maintenance ever done to the car was routine, brakes, hoses after they deterioated, starters, tires, and etc. No major enigne or system work ever done! Subaru has got my attention and business probably for life as long as their cars stay somewhat unique in their own way. You have to have a special something in you to appreciate a subaru.
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Old 04-03-2001, 11:25 PM   #8
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Location: Stay Classy __
0000 Gee See


SUBARU does boast that 95% of all Subarus are still on the road.
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Old 04-04-2001, 12:16 AM   #9
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Member#: 3601
Join Date: Jan 2001
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Tigard, Oregon
2006 WRX Wagon


I don't believe that "subaru and porche are the only two manufacturers allowed by patent to make a "boxer" engine."

After all, Volkswagon used to sell aircooled boxer engine cars, the Corvair was a boxer engine, and Honda and BMW make boxer engines - for their motorcycles. And Lycoming and Continental still make boxer engines for aircraft.

The patent on the opposed flat engine has long ago passed into public domain. Now the specifics of some of the details might still be protected by patent, but the basic engine design is well known and usable by any company that wishes to use it. And while it has many advantages, it also has some drawbacks, as do all designs. And I don't see any particular reason that the boxer engine should be inherently more reliable than an inline engine.

A well made engine, maintained reasonably can be very reliable, whether it's inline or opposed. Or even a "V" though I must admit I'm a bit hard pressed to think of a "V" engine that ever impressed me for longevity.

But don't get me wrong, Subarus and their engines ARE very reliable and well made in general. I wouldn't have bought another if I didn't believe that.
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Old 04-04-2001, 04:00 AM   #10
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Member#: 1754
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: West Boemfugk, Egypt
2002 S4
Nogaro Blue


Well, I don't know how much this say's for Subaru's reliability, but it does say something for the Impreza: http://carpoint.msn.com/vip/overview...=Home&pos=Find
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Old 04-04-2001, 05:19 AM   #11
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Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Elizabethtown, PA
2002 Forester L
Scratch-n-Dent Blue

Thumbs up

My wife's last car was a Jetta GLI 16v. We sold it at 165k because it was starting to cost us money to fix all the little things that typically go wrong with VWs (window motors, oil leaks, radiator, etc). A good car, always ran, but not Japanese quality (used as a descriptive term only).
We replaced it with the Impreza, 108,000 miles on it when we bought it. It has about 120,000 on it today and I have fixed NOTHING on it. It uses a quart of oil between changes but this is not unusual from what I've heard and remember from my old Subys.
I had an 84 GL 4x4 hatchback that had 140,000 on it. I owned it for a year and only replaced the oil pump o-ring, a muffler, and fixed an electrical problem with the choke. It had been poorly maintained and seemed to thrive on abuse.
My folks bought a 78 4x4 wagon new and put 130,000 on it before selling it for $350, and that is only because the underside rusted away. Replaced clutch cables, mufflers and a heater fan switch, nothing else.
My 1986 Audi has given me occasional fits. Nothing that ever keeps it from running (well, a fuel pump) but little annoying things. This is typical of VW/Audi cars.
If you were happy with your VW products, you will be more than pleased with the Suby.
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Old 04-04-2001, 05:28 AM   #12
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 4760
Join Date: Mar 2001

I'm not a Subaru owner yet either. I'm planning on an Outback Sport later this year, or about this time next year. A few bills to pay off first. Ah, well. Good things come to those who wait, right?

Anyway, I've pretty much decided to go with an OBS over a GTI 1.8T or Golf GLS 1.8T. Like most things in life, a new car purchace is a trade-off. The Subaru does some things better than the VW, and vice-versa. But, for my needs at the moment, I think I'm going with the Subaru. And, one factor in my decision is reliability and cost of ownership. My perceptions at the moment is that the Subaru will be more trouble free than the VW over the course of ownership.

I've read noting but positive comments about Subaru reliability from different sources. Heck, even those goofballs, "Click & Clack" over at "Car Talk" have commented on their reliability and the fact that Subaru's are the easiest import to work on from a mechanics point of view.

But, having said all that, every car may have some problems. Every car I've owned has had its share. If you visit a VW board, you'll find they have their share. You'll probably find those who have had a nightmare experience with every brand at one time or another, Subaru included.

VW reliability seems to have had its ups and downs over the years. This may be because their cars are sourced at different plants in different countries. Germany (Passat and, I think, GTI VR6), Mexico for North American Beetles and Jettas, and now Brazil for the latest Golfs and other GTI's). Initially, the Mexican plant was riddled with quality control problems. But once VW got the Mexico plant sorted out, the quality of the cars produced there was fine. However, as VW sales have increased and production has been ramped up, the quality seems to have slipped and warranty claims are up. I think this is what has lead to the downgrading by Consumer Reports. I test drove a 2001 GTI 1,8T recently which was made in Brazil. A blast to drive and seemed well screwed together. But I don't know anything about the history of the Brazil plant or its quality reputation.

Subaru sems to have had more consistency over the years.

I've owned a few VW's, and also a Saab and an Alfa Romeoand a Chevy pick-up. In my own experience, I'd rate my VW as "average" in reliability. The Chevy truck? Very reliable. The Alfa? Poor reliability....but what character! It was great when running properly. The Saab? I had an 1988 900 Turbo. I wouldn't rate it as having poor reliability, but it did require more mechnical attention than my VW's or Chevy. But the Saab also had lots of character. I'd consider a new one, but they are a bit out of my price range right now. But none of the cars I've owned have been as reliabile as my dad's or my sister's Hondas. But I'd still rather drivea Saab, VW or a Subaru than a Honda. And, since I haven't yet owned a Subaru, I'm going to give one a try this time.

Sorry for straying a bit off the topic of your question. Good luch with your new WRX. It should be a blast.
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Old 04-04-2001, 06:48 AM   #13
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Member#: 5414
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Hopatcong, NJ
Thumbs up

Thanks to everyone for the comments. I don't feel so funny anymore. I'm sure I'm gonna love the WRX, but I'll miss my VR6 for a little while at least. (Is that girlie of me?)
HondaH8er: Ordered the Sedan in Blue!

Thanks again all.
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Old 04-04-2001, 08:51 AM   #14
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 3773
Join Date: Jan 2001
2002 WRX Sedan
2006 Outback 3.0R


I think it is 95% of all Subaru's sold in the past 10 years are still on the road.
Another reason why many engines used in aviation are horizontally opposed is the fact that this is an inherently vibration free design
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Old 04-04-2001, 09:08 AM   #15
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Member#: 2575
Join Date: Oct 2000
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Winter Park, Florida
2008 Forester 2.5X
Dark Gray Metallic


we drove Volvos 27 years and were afraid to move up newer than a 91 or so, as our Volvo mechanic himself was having doubts about the make quality. So last year we traded the 84 Volvo wagon in for an OBS (last May) and I still want to smile every time I get in that car.

I was afraid of VW's after reading about numerous electrical problems and after much research, we felt Subaru was the most logical choice for us to change over to as far as reliability.
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Old 04-04-2001, 09:40 AM   #16
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Member#: 700
Join Date: Jan 2000
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: BANNED!
99 Impreza RS
Silverthorn Metallic


A former Nissan owner here. Nissans have been good to my parents since the Datsun days in the 70s. I'm the first in the generation to buy a non-Nissan/Datsun car.

So far, so good.
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Old 04-04-2001, 09:44 AM   #17
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Member#: 807
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Greenville, SC
2002 WRX Wagon


That's odd. I've never heard the words "reliable" and "VW" in the same sentence. Since I've been alive, VW has a poor reputation for reliablity, especially the Jetta. Just about every survey ranks the Jetta as the least reliable car in its class. But reliability is a touch subject with car owners. A lot of people will tell you that whatever car they drive is the most reliable car there is. Yes, even Ford and Chevy owners. People who have owned Chevies there entire lives think it's normal for an engine to require an overhaul at 100,000 miles, the alternator replaced at 30,000 miles, and the car not starting at all when it's below 0 degrees outside. They always call Japanese cars "Jap crap", even when the neighbor's '82 Civic starts every morning reglardless of the weather and their own 2001 Silverado chokes on anything less than 20 degrees. Doesn't matter. They'll swear to you that their '79 Monte Carlo, on its 4th engine, 6th transmission, and 7th carburator, is the most reliable car ever made.
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Old 04-04-2001, 09:46 AM   #18
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Member#: 4449
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Raleigh, NC

A recent report listed the Subaru Impreza and Legacy(or was it Forester) as one of 12 (?) cars with outstanding intial quality as well as outstanding long term quality.

A number of folks on here complain about the quality of the stock clutch and transmission, but I think that's just because they might drive their cars a bit hard
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Old 04-04-2001, 09:50 AM   #19
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Member#: 1434
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Hackettstown, NJ USA
2000 2.5RS
Silverthorn Metallic


I think that the quality of a Subaru, especially the WRX, is second to none. It's kinda like an HFC pistol vs a Marui MP-5. Just my 2 cents
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Old 04-04-2001, 10:50 AM   #20
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 2362
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: South Carolina, USA
1999 Legacy Outback
Blue w/ Paint Chips & Mud


My outback is my first subaru, and my first 'new' car.

I have only put 25k miles on it in two years, but I really beat the heck out of this thing. I mean I take it through roads that even the jeep guys stay away from. I drive it on two wheels around turns, I floor it from stoplights, I stand on the brakes. I basically drive this wagon like it is a sports car, and while it doesn't quite hold up to a WRX it certainly tends to decimate most of the competition around here on the road and especially on dirt.

The only thing I have had to do to this car is oil changes, tires, and brakes. Which makes sense, considering the way I corner.

I wish there were more (well, ANY) rally events around here but there aren't... so I'm stuck on backroads and rainy parking lots having fun.... but this subaru does everything great.

And one of the best things (other than the AWD and boxer engine) is that this car is easy to work on! I would look in the engine bay of my 87 Sable Wagon and get a headache trying to figure out what goes where, but with my subie everything makes perfect sense and is relatively easy to get to.

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Old 04-04-2001, 11:51 AM   #21
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 4665
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Because life is too short to drink cheap beer!
1999 Grand Cherokee


Well, I've only had my Scooby for a few months, but it seems to me that it is very well screwed together. I don't purchase a car without researching it to death, and I've been very pleased with this purchase. I had an Accord before this car, and the Accord was rock-solid, it was, in my opinion, a little more refined than the Impreza. HOWEVER.. Little things, little "quirks" make me love a car, I liked my Accord, just because of the precision with which everything operated, but I LOVE my 2.5, because it's such an endearing little car. My Scooby is only the second car that I've ever owned that has inspired these feelings. The other one was my first car, a 1985 Merkur XR4ti, that car was kind of unreilable, but it had such an incredible personality, just like Scooby does. I do agree that some people aren't very good judges of reliability, some people (American car buyers especially) are under the impression that you are supposed to have trouble with a car once it gets over 10,000 miles on the odometer, but what can you expect of NASCAR fans? I mean, they think 500 miles of left turns is racing, try watching WRC sometime Jed. I owned one American car in my life, and it will, in no uncertain terms, be the last, ever. Saturns are supposed to be the best defense America has against the Civics of the world, if this is as good as we can do, we should just get out of the car-making business all together, because they can't cut it. Anyone who's never driven a Saturn will tell you that they're great cars, but any car that is in such sorry shape as mine was after only 30k (burining tons of oil, interior pieces coming loose, body creaks, constant shifter breakage) is not even close to good. The American market supports it though. Oh well, I got on a tangent here, sorry guys.
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Old 04-04-2001, 12:49 PM   #22
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Member#: 3578
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Canada

My only grip with Subarus, and the only 'con' I've heard consumer evaluation type publications make are aimed at the clutch or transmission- the issue with the clutch I've read in a few places usually says something about 'premature clutch wear' - and things like that- I'd say that'd be partially attributed to the AWD factor- otherwise,

That said the tranny on the RS isn't the smoothest in the world either-

in terms of the WRX, it seems subaru may have addressed that now with the upgraded synchros and synchro'd reverse gear-
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Old 04-04-2001, 03:16 PM   #23
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Member#: 3683
Join Date: Jan 2001
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Collinsville, IL 62234
2007 Corvette


"People who have owned Chevies there entire lives think it's normal for an engine to require an overhaul at 100,000 miles, the alternator replaced at 30,000 miles, and the car not starting at all when it's below 0 degrees outside. "

1974 Chevy Nova--Crappy carb dug out of a junkyard by previous owner. Only serious problems that showed up with this car was tranny problems. But that was after I sold it with nearly 200,000 miles. Engine had never been replaced by me. No major work done on engine by me. It had 100,000 miles when I got it. It was already 10 years old. Yes it did start in extremely cold weather, even with the crappy carb.

1985 Chevy Sprint (Geo Metro)--Piece of crap. Never shoulda bought it. Made by Suzuki.

1988 Chevy Cavalier--Always started no matter the weather. 186,000 miles at trade-off. Bad valve. Overheated once. Replaced $60 part three times (Idle Air Control). Engine wasn't very durable.

1994 Chevy Cavalier--160,000+ miles and still going strong. Replaced battery and tires once. No other major work. Regular oil changes. Always started no matter the weather/temp. Gets hot in stop and go traffic. I've thrashed on it some to see what it could do. Let's just say it's a decent economy car that gets 35+mpg regardless how you drive it, but the cooling system needs improvement. Otherwise this car should last beyond 200,000.

I was surprised at how well the second Cavalier served me. The engine seems more durable. I've always been aware that Toyota, Nissan, and Honda made reliable long-lasting cars. I'd always driven Chevy. Your criticisms seem biased. When I finally decided to buy a import, I had no doubt about the reliability factor. The fact that the sticker price on my Subaru is more than twice what the 1994 Cavalier was, I expect more from it. I know someone who has a Subaru Legacy with over 200,000 miles. I wouldn't buy a Corvette for reliable transportation. But I wouldn't use a Mazda RX-7 for reliable transportation either.

Certainly GM needs to do some catching up, but I believe they've at least made progress.


p.s. I'm the only one in my immediate family with an import. None of them have called imports "Jap Crap", they realize that some imports have good reliability. They just happen to prefer domestic. Those who disparage imports are biased.

[This message has been edited by brainrally (edited April 04, 2001).]
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Old 04-04-2001, 03:27 PM   #24
Scooby Guru
Member#: 4419
Join Date: Feb 2001
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Carol Stream, IL
2002 S2K - 2013 ISP
i don't have a wrx


Wow! My soon-arriving WRX will be my first japaneese-built car. I'm excited to see that Subaru's reliability has a good reputation. The few cars I've been trough are a good example of what im used to:

the car and what broke (short summary)

85 caravan -3 carbs, 2 trannys, 2 head gaskets

88 lebaron gts- just about everything under the hood, motor broke a rod on the highway after oil drained out bottom!

98 mystique- nothing major broke here, just SIX recalls in the three years I've owned it.

Lookin' forward to the wrx

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Old 04-04-2001, 03:54 PM   #25
n00b Moderator
Member#: 4263
Join Date: Feb 2001
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Encinitas
Thumbs up

Heh, I love my Scooby, and my '91 Camaro Z28. But it's true, the alternator on the Z28 did go out at about 42,000 miles. And on my Dodge Caravan, I've had to install a new waterpump, a new tranny at 50,025 miles (bastards made the tranny to go out, I swear!), new O2 Sensor and a new torque converer at 135,000 miles. I consider that alot of mileage on a '92 Caravan. Just got it detailed today. I wouldn't sell it though, it's a very useful vehicle.

After seeing so many old Scrubbies (nickname I use on pre MY90 models) on the road, it's nice to know that my Scooby will be around long enough to be labeled a Scrubbie.


[This message has been edited by Skylab (edited April 04, 2001).]
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