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Old 12-06-2005, 09:50 AM   #1
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Default F1: How different will Red Bull's car be?

Red Bull announced its official driver lineup:

Red Bull Racing will have
Christian Klein
David Coulthard
Robert Doornbos (Dutch, 3rd Friday driver)

The 2nd team "Scuderia Toro Rosso" (owned too by Red Bull)
Scott Speed (yea!)
Vitantonio Liuzzi
Neel Jani (Swiss, 3rd Friday driver)

Anyways, isn't there something in the F1 regulations that say the 2 teams must be different? Different Chassis, different engine? Wonder how well each team will do.

How well can we expect S.Speed to do? Possible podium?

Should be interesting to see how well Red Bull wil do in F1. It took BAR many hundreds of millions to get to where they are and still took a long time
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Old 12-06-2005, 10:38 AM   #2
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Red Bull's plans go something like this..

Red Bull racing will be running a brand new chassis with a Ferrari V8 engine on Michelin tires.

Scuderia Toro Rosso wil be running a version of last years Red Bull Chassis (which they own the intellectual rights to) with a restricted Cosworth V10 engine, also on Michelin tires.

There's a lot a gruff being made right now about the restricted V10 still being something like 80bhp up on the new crop of V8 motors. The FIA has said they will go as far as imposing more restrictions on the V10 on the eve of the first race if it proves to be an advantage over the new engines.

I don't expect Scott Speed to be challanging for podiums this season..it's simply to much to ask. However depending on how the engine parity works out, there's an outside chance they could steal a march in the first few races. If the FIA get's the restriction wrong you could see the Toro Rosso cars at the sharp end of the grid in Bahrain.

Don't be so quick to compare Red Bull with BAR. Remember that BAR went through several seasons of mismanagement, horrible political infighting, and general arrogance (they claimed they'd win their first race...) before David Richards and Prodrive stepped in to restructure the team. BAR threw hundreds of millions of dollars into things that has nothing to do with making the car faster...Villenueve was being paid something like 15 million a year for heaven's sake!

Red Bull on the other hand seem to be spending their money much more wisely...see Kevin's post about Newey below.

Last edited by Ferg; 12-06-2005 at 10:57 AM.
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Old 12-06-2005, 10:50 AM   #3
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I think we can expect STR to be slightly slower then RBR at the end of 05. I don't think there is enough man power at STR to make them that fast out of the box. The car is good for sure but you have two relative rookies in both seats. Yes, both have F1 experience but nothing as of yet to show for it. I think Vantanio and Scott will do well if they get points. Remember that now 9 our of the 10 teams almost have to have points to be considered anything close to succesful. All but Midland, and maybe Aguri if it happens, now expect it. Every weekend there will be at least 10 very dissapointed drivers.
On the other hand, RBR has stepped up to the plate IMO. Getting Newey, teaming DC and Klien (old and new) and investing in Ferrari hp are all steps to show that they are serious about F1 and want to win. Probably not this year and maybe not at all but if things fall in place they want to be there.
Here's a question:
How will win a race 1st-Red Bull, Toyota, Honda or BMW?
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Old 12-06-2005, 10:59 AM   #4
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Toyota, Honda, Red Bull, or BMW....hmmm.

That's a hard one.

On past performaces and driver strength I'd go with Honda. Toyota would be next up, then Red Bull, then BMW.

Who knows...maybe Toro Rosso will walk the field in Bahrain. Scott Speed wins his first race? Stranger things have happened.
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Old 12-06-2005, 05:30 PM   #5
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Villenueve was actually getting closer to 30 mil a year at BAR, it helps when your manager runs the team though.

I think Toyota has the best chance to win a race, then Honda, then Red Bull, then Sauber BMW.

As long as the teams own the rights they can run the car, remember the 04 Sauber was essentially a copy of the 03 Ferrari.

I hope Speed does well, but to be honest I'm not sure. Watching him run GP2 he had problems passing people although he seemed to be doing well once he was in clean air.
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Old 12-07-2005, 06:33 AM   #6
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I think it's time for Honda to win a race. They have 2 good drivers in JB and Rubinho. Next bet would be the Toilets. Trulli is due, and every once in a while Ralfie doesn't have a brain fart.
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Old 12-07-2005, 12:10 PM   #7
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A little calrification on what exactly Toro Rosso will be running next year.

Toro Rosso building new car for 2006

By Jonathan Noble & Michele Lostia December 7th 2005, 10:43 GMT

Scuderia Toro Rosso have quelled concerns about which car they will be racing with next season by confirming they are building their own chassis for 2006.

The Italian outfit caused a few raised eyebrows in testing at Barcelona last week when they kicked off their winter programme by running Red Bull Racing's RB1 chassis.

Rival teams were worried because Formula One's Concorde Agreement rules out teams from running other team's old cars - and insists they must design and manufacturer the chassis themselves.

That would have meant Toro Rosso would have been breaking the rules if they had opted to run the RB1 in 2006 and it could have led to early season controversy.

However, although autosport.com understands that the team initially hoped to run the RB1 in 2006, the team have now opted to build their own car because of the strict constructor regulations.

Red Bull Racing's technical operations director Gunther Steiner told Gazzetta dello Sport: "It (the RB1) won't be the car with which Toro Rosso will start next season. The car that debuts in Bahrain will be fully built in Faenza."
Of course how much of the car will actually be "new" and how much will be a worked over RB1 remains to be seen.
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